problems with 24p

D

debitproductions

Active member
I always shoot on 24PA, but for a project I needed to cut on a standard editing timebase of 30 so I shot on 24P. What are the proper capture settings? right now im using

Device control : Firewire NTSC
Capture/Input: DV NTSC 48 kHz

and im getting annoying field dominance problems though (i tried using lower and higher and none and its still visible.)

problem.jpg


I know its a noob question, but Im so used to shooting with 24Pa Ive never had to look into this before.
 
Every 3rd and 4th frame will look like that. You're not doing anything wrong; that's just what it looks like when you edit 24p in 29.97.

It won't look like that on a TV.
 
so those are correct capture settings for 24p then?
If thats what every 3rd and 4th frame looks like whilst im editing will it look like that if i export if for a web video? would there be certain export settings that would have to be used to eliminate it?
 
I've always found shooting for web that progressive (or ALL interlaced) is best. None of this 24p nonsense. So, 30p or 24pA only.

You are going to be stuck with the interlaced frames.

CaptM
 
are you kidding me, damn thats redicilous! Are you saying that even once its exported through compressor and put on a DVD itll have interlaced frames?
 
damn that really sucks, so theres no way to remove the interlaced frames for exporting as a normal file... I mean even when i export using compressor for DVD use?

p.s. what is the proper editign timebase for 24P footage (29.97 or 30?)
 
Debit, I'm kinda with you on this one... but I have a different but similar (read "noobie") question about 24p into FCP: My footage seems to have a lot of digital artifacting (jagged lines instead of smooth) throughout all the stuff I digitized in. Is this just the FCP compression of the 24p footage for editing and resulting in the kind of junk debitproductions is getting? Will this crud resolve when I send it out to go to DVD... in other words, will MPEG-2 "unpack" more of the information than what I'm seeing now in my edit windows?
 
Well, it's not THAT bad... I think you and I will both come out OK.
I've seen quite a bit of final product shot on the DVX in 24p and edited in FCP and it's really good looking stuff. I just want to be sure I'M not messing it up with not knowing the right setting or output or whatever. We just need to gather up some good tips and it'll be cool.

I've got a couple who will be wanting their wedding video and I don't want to hand them crap! You know??? Plus, this is the way I want to shoot most of the time, so I want to be sure I'm clear about what's going on.
 
man

man

damn i was just looking around b/c i had the exact same problem and was trying to fix it... so for now on ill shoot in 24pA, only i dont see where the editing timebase settings are i need to change to 24p. i see when i export i can choose if its 24p or 30p, but where are the settings to change before i start editing and putting the video in the timeline? or do i have to change settings before i capture?
 
debitproductions said:
for a project I needed to cut on a standard editing timebase of 30 so I shot on 24P.
Click to expand...

This is just what happens when you shoot 24 and edit in 30... on a tv, it'll look fine. for web, yeah, you're going to see the interlacing. If you can edit in 24, then take the footage into cinema tools and reverse telecine.
 
bigbossbmb said:
This is just what happens when you shoot 24 and edit in 30... on a tv, it'll look fine. for web, yeah, you're going to see the interlacing. If you can edit in 24, then take the footage into cinema tools and reverse telecine.
Click to expand...

I would say the same, why don't you just edit in 24, rev. telecine the clips in cinema tools.
 
Hey, guys.... I wanted to report in after working on this last night. I've got good news... once I edited together a test sequence that highlighted various conditions (normal light, low light, indoor, outdoor, etc.) and exported it as a full quality QT which I then burned out in DVD Studio, about 95% of the digital artifacting was gone and I had no sign of any strange interlacing. It really seems that we are just seeing the compression from FCP and watching DV footage on an HD monitor. Once you burn everything out full res (MPEG-2) and watch it on your own DVD player and TV set, you'll see that everything is going to be all right.
(phew!)
 
Here's a flash clip that has both progressive and interlaced in it. See if you can tell which is which. heh. (sarcasm) It's about halfway down. I know it's not relevant I just wanted to show off my logo.
 
bobbylong said:
damn i was just looking around b/c i had the exact same problem and was trying to fix it... so for now on ill shoot in 24pA, only i dont see where the editing timebase settings are i need to change to 24p. i see when i export i can choose if its 24p or 30p, but where are the settings to change before i start editing and putting the video in the timeline? or do i have to change settings before i capture?
Click to expand...
Before you import it into a timeline, you need to set your Sequence Preset (under Audio/Visual Settings) to: DV NTSC 48 kHz - 23.98.

If you've already have already imported it into a project, check the Sequence Settings. Choose the Advanced tab (under QuickTime Video Settings) and verify that it is 23.98. If it is different, you can set it up there.
 
debitproductions said:
What does everyone use for capture settings for 24P ? right now im using Firewire NTSC and DV NTSC 48kHz
Click to expand...

You are using the correct settings. FCP needs all the data from the DV FireWire datastream. Frames get flagged with regards to the pulldown and you need all 29.97 frames of info from the camera. Otherwise, just random frames get 'dropped'.

Google most anything written by Noah Kadner ("24p workflow", "24p and Final Cut", etc.)

His DVD is here:

http://www.callboxlive.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=28

Graeme Nattress also added his input to Ken Stone's website:

http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage/24p_in_FCP_nattress.html


"24p Normal - Use DV-NTSC Easy Preset
Because 24p Normal uses “normal” 3:2 pulldown to embed the 24p in a normal NTSC DV video, you can capture and edit just as normal DV NTSC."
 
a different problem?

a different problem?

Hi, I came across this thread, while trying to resolve an issue with captured DVX footage. This problem is not horizontal interlace lines, but what looks like vertical "dither" lines (?)

here is a frame grab:

frame.jpg


if you look closely at the dancer's skirt you will see the jagged edges. I've never seen this before, though I've been shooting in 24p for many months now. this is 24p not 24pA, captured into FCP under normal NTSC settings, showing 29.97fps in the browser, etc. everything appears normal. why this effect?

another thing: i have noticed recently that the LCD display and the viewfinder exhibit a strange "ripple" effect when I move the camera quickly up and down: horizontal lines appear on the screen for the duration of the movement and disappear as soon as the camera stops. they are not obtruive, but noticeable. could there be a connection?

I would like to show this strange effect to a specialist.. but where does one take one's DVX camera for expert advice (without sending it off somewhere?) I live in New York.

Sorry about the lengthy post.

Very best
 
Nothing to do with frame rates, shadowy reds look like that on all DV cameras. As far as 1/3" CCD, Canon will get you the cleanest look but DVX will be the worst. You can add some chroma blur to soften that up but it will come right back if you expert to DV...



ash =o)
 
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