Potentially DUMB Oktava question...

Right, and that's why it's not a fair comparison. One mic cost next to nothing and the other, although still low money in the professional world, cost quite a bit to an indie filmmaker. So, I don't think Matt or anyone else has ever said it could beat out a Schoeps, but is a good option for people on a budget.

The AKG comparison is pretty good because it's the sub $500 range.

Steve
 
I think everybody would be really surprised if we had a bunch of flicks shot with all different mics... from Oktava to Schoeps... and you handed out mics along with scripts so that everybody got a random pick.

You could put those flicks in order of best sound to worse sound.

Okay next we make a new set of flicks and mix up the mics... once again, you could put the flicks in order of best sound to worst sound.

It wouldn't have as much to do with the mics as it did the people using them.

Guaranteed.

My posts are directed at two types of people. 1) The guys who are where I was 3 years ago, all nervous about the idea of spending $500-700 on their first mic, mount, screen, pole. and 2) The guys who are right where I am right now, willing to spend every cent they can scrape up to get the best possible sound they can.

There is a #3 and that is the experienced professional who owns all the best stuff and has many years under their belt using it. I know and they know that my posts are not for them. I expect at times they'd get a laugh out of my "discoveries" that are common knowledge in their world... and that's totally cool with me. I'm a modest person.

I just think that sometimes when I'm going over the top about some economy choice that the experienced pros come along and wonder what all the buzz is about. All I'm trying to do is get some hesitant shooters (me 3 years ago) to jump into the pool. After you get your feet wet you'll know when it's time to go in the deep end.
 
Sorry if I seemed to be questioning the recommendation. I agree fully with you Matt. Oktavas are a good budget solution.

Adam was just drawning a comparison to the Schoeps that I was speaking to. Call it the equivaliant of someone saying "If I can shoot a movie in 35mm or with the DVX, which should I choose (all other things being equal)?" Now with the exceptions of Danny Boyle and Steven Soderbergh and their special circumstances, 35mm wins hands down. Still doesn't mean people on this board shouldn't try and film their movie with a DVX, just means, while it is a "decent" medium, it is not the best one if budget is no concern.

The more I think about that analogy, the less I like it, but you get the idea. :grin:
 
Wabbit, you make a good point, and I actually like the analogy.

To throw one wrench into it though, if someone made an incredible film on the DVX rather than film, does that make it less of a project? No. Can they get something 'close' to a Hollywood look, yes?

I think that is the point with the Oktava. You can get a Hollywood sound out of the Oktava, but it's not going to be read on Hollywood. I believe the Oktava is a great mic, great price, and just a good tool. All that being said, I will turn to the Oktava when I need a mic just for audio, otherwise, the AKG is the tool I'm going for. I still think it's a great mic, then again, I don't own a Schoeps... yet...
 
I asked about the Octava in relation to a Schoeps because I know that Octavas are used sometimes on big shoots where Schoeps are available. I was curious if there were any reasons to do so other than those I mentioned. I wasn't asking which is a better mic.
 
I also think it can be very useful to compare, for instance, Octava to Schoeps, DVX or HVX to 35, painter's pole to Ambient, imac to Dual 2.0 G5 to Quad, iriver to 722. In many cases, for many people here, it's not as much a matter of whether you can afford a Schoeps, for instance, but what else you won't be able to afford if you get one. So you look for the overall balance of purchases and rentals that gets you the most for the least and hopefully keeps your production values across the board above a certain level. Deciding where that level should be and what tools will get you there is the big trick which so many posts here are all about. Comparing to the high-end helps create some perspective.
 
Adam, I'm actually going to go on a limb and disagree with the logic of the post. When you are discussing computers does it make sense to buy an Imac for $1500 when you could spend $4000 on a dual g5? Depends on the person. If the imac delivers what the person wants then it makes sense to buy it. If it is a bandaid while they wait to get the bigger machine, thus it hurts the available cash flow to allot to the other purchase does it make more sense to wait? Maybe, depends on the person. When discussing microphones, I really believe that there is a situation where every mic is usefull; even something like the AT55 (it could be used as a prop!).

When discussing if someone should purchase the Oktava or just wait until they have the money to afford the Schoeps, I say get the Oktava. There are always going to be situations where you will not want to risk such a valuable piece of equipement, plus the Oktava is really a good mic! It sounds great, and I like the performance.

I have my AKG modular system which I love. Recently I have been reaching for my Oktava over the AKG though. Why? I think that there are situations where I prefer the tonal qualities of the Oktava over the AKG. If I am shooting a 10 minute interior scene I will use the AKG for 60% of the shots, 40% I will use the Oktava. It all depends on the situation. If I had a $1500 Schoeps would I still use the Oktava? I can't answer that from personal experience, but if you look at people on this board who do have $1500 Schoeps and equivilent mics, they do reach for the Oktava. It performs and meets the needs of certain situations.

My father likes to build things. He has 10 different hammers and more screwdrivers than I can count. There are situations where he wants to use one tool over another. It depends on the project he is working on. Because something is 85% of the cost doesn't mean that it is any less effective in acheiving the goal. If your goal is to get across town you can do it on a $100 bike, $50 skateboard, $2000 motorcycle, $15000 car, or $150,000 car. Hell, you could get a $3.4M helicopter. It just depends on how you want to achieve the goal.

For me the alpha and omega of the Oktava is that it is a great tool that I believe in. It is effective, and an excellent microphone that will yield excellent professional results for users at a very low price that rationalizes its purchase price versus rental solutions.

Then again, I am a huge advocate of people hiring sound people for their projects because sound is so important, but if someone wants a good tool in their chest, the Oktava is a no brainer purchase.
 
Yankee,
Well stated. I'm with you on this, hence my original question. These are really two different points which don't invalidate each other, which is one reason I put them in different posts.
 
Oktava%20chart%20from%20100Hz%20to%2010KHz.jpg


Is this as good as a Schoeps? No. Does it vary between Oktavas? Yes. Is this an impressive chart at any price? Yes.

Now go out and get yourself one and trust me when I say it's peanuts for what you get. Your ears will thank you.

I just saw that "the other Oktava site" raised their price for a cardioid only kit to $200 and you can't even get the hyper kit from them... you have to buy the 3-cap kit or buy the hyper seperately. They were already higher then the Sound Room and the Sound Room has been selling these things a lot longer... and they listen to our needs.

Paul is doing us a huge favor to offer the hyper kit only... even if it was $200. The fact that he only charges us $165 is wacky... and the quality of the little cedar box he includes for FREE will surprise you.

My guess is that it won't be long before the price of these things goes up anyway... it almost has to. Hopefully not, but I always watch the Oktava sites and that other one just jumped $20 each.
 
adaml said:
If you already have a Schoeps MK41...
Click to expand...

adaml said:
...it's not as much a matter of whether you can afford a Schoeps, for instance, but what else you won't be able to afford if you get one.
Click to expand...

TheYankee said:
When discussing if someone should purchase the Oktava or just wait until they have the money to afford the Schoeps
Click to expand...

To be clear, I was responding to someone ALREADY owning a Schoeps. If you have $1500 to spend on mics, no one is saying, just empty your pocketbook on the MK41.

This was never the point. The point was that except for a situation where I don't want to risk the Schoeps (very rare) the Oktava's gather dust in my bag. If you already have a Schoeps, the Oktava can be fun to own and fool around with but there really is no situation where sonically it is a better choice. This was all I was trying to respond to. Somehow this really got turned on it's head.

I believe we have plenty of threads on how to spend XXX number of dollars on audio. Unless that figure is at least over $5000, the Schoeps won't even get mentioned.


Best
 
I hope nobody thinks an Oktava ever outperforms a Schoeps. It doesn't.

You guys just got caught up in semantics.

No real sound guy will have an Oktava for anything other then a disposable mic... but for the rest of us it's pretty damn good for the price.

Nobody has to say, "that's what I was saying" because we all know that's what we all meant.:happy:
 
Matt-

Based on what you said, I should probably pick up an Oktava sooner than later. Let me ask you or Yankee or whomever else knows their stuff...would I be okay getting one mic now then if I like it, trying to pair it up in the future with another? OR is that audio suicide? Should I just bite the bullet now and try to get a matched pair?

Thanks!
Rick
PS You guys have me so convinced that I am going to make the purchase tomorrow.
 
I get up from my desk, go out for a quick chain smoke, come back, and this thread has completely gone nuts.

I first want to offer an apology if anything I said was out of line. For not a moment did I believe or did I try to convey that an Oktava will out perform a Schoeps. I would trade my Oktava and my AKG hyper & shotgun for a Shoeps (any takers?).

There was a Hyundai dealership in Charlotte that was giving away a car when you bought one. Would you rather have two Hyundai's (no offense if you own one) or a Mercedes?

To state what I obviously failed in stating earlier, I believe an Oktava has a place in a sound bag, it is a lot of bang for your buck (what $165 shotgun has a place in a bag?) and it delivers the goods or units that cost more than 2x what it does. There is very little difference between my AKG and the Oktava, noticeable, but very little difference.

Either way, I want to apologize to everyone in case anything I said allowed this thread to get so blown out of proportion or off topic.

Rick, regarding your question, I don't know my stuff. I turn to Matt constantly for opinions and there are a ton of other pros on this board. I just like sound and buy mics because I'm a junkie and they don't make a Micadone program because they are afraid that it will hurt the sales of Methadone. That being said, and a disclaimer that this is a non professional opinion worth the grain of salt that spawned this opinion in my mind, if you order from an established vendor like the sound room and get just one microphone now and add to it later, I don't believe that you will have earth shattering differences because you didn't purchase matched pairs at the same time. Buy one, if you like it, which I am betting you will, you will pick up another.
 
What he said. If you want a matched pair then all you can get is silver... and there won't be earth-shattering differences anyway.

I did a stereo recording a long time ago with an Oktava cardioid and a Rode NTK cardioid (tube mic) and those mics couldn't be any farther apart... yet nobody even noticed until I said something. Don't sweat it unless you're buying two together...

The thread didn't blow out of control but we're all so PC and respectful to each other that we tend to get into apologetic explanations of things rather then just letting go of the point... that's what I meant by semantics.

Everyone doesn't realize it yet, but we're all in agreement.
 
Okay, this is another potentially DUMB Oktava question...but what is the difference then of a Condenser microphone or a Small Diaphragm? The Sound Room offers each for $173.00 bucks. Either way, tomorrow, they are getting my money. I just want to make sure I get the right one. The thing I HAVE learned is that I must get the Hyper cap.

Rick
PS I know, the mic is so ridiculously cheap that I shouldn't even ask but, do they give discounts to dvxuser members like Rush at EVS does?
Thanks guys!
 
Time to read around a bit... I don't mean to sound harsh, but I've spoon fed the coupon details to everybody about a hundred times.

Enter coupon code "DV" at checkout (or if you call say you want the DV discount for an extra 5% off... that is what makes the mics $165 instead of $173... which is already $27 cheaper then anyone else on a genuine Oktava)... You will ALSO get the hyper cap whereas it used to be a seperate purchase and you were forced to get the cardioid first. That's favor #1. Next you will get a cool cedar box to store your new mic in at no extra charge. The black plastic boxes aren't as nice and that's what you usually get. That's favor #2.

Be sure to ask for the mk012a hyper... but Paul will be expecting you because he sells a lot of these to video guys. If you don't already have a shockmount then you might want to consider the SabraSom SSM-1 for another $49. That's the cheapest mount you're gonna' find and you can get the 5/8" to 3/8" adapter included at no extra charge if you just ask for it.

Condenser mic is a type of mic and small diaphragm is a type of mic... they can be independent terms, but in this case the Oktava is both.

Mk012a Hyper in your choice silver or black. That's what we've been talking about. Don't forget coupon code DV.
 
MattinSTL said:
Time to read around a bit... I don't mean to sound harsh, but I've spoon fed the coupon details to everybody about a hundred times.

Enter coupon code "DV" at checkout (or if you call say you want the DV discount for an extra 5% off... that is what makes the mics $165 instead of $173... which is already $27 cheaper then anyone else on a genuine Oktava)... You will ALSO get the hyper cap whereas it used to be a seperate purchase and you were forced to get the cardioid first. That's favor #1. Next you will get a cool cedar box to store your new mic in at no extra charge. The black plastic boxes aren't as nice and that's what you usually get. That's favor #2.

Be sure to ask for the mk012a hyper... but Paul will be expecting you because he sells a lot of these to video guys. If you don't already have a shockmount then you might want to consider the SabraSom SSM-1 for another $49. That's the cheapest mount you're gonna' find and you can get the 5/8" to 3/8" adapter included at no extra charge if you just ask for it.

Condenser mic is a type of mic and small diaphragm is a type of mic... they can be independent terms, but in this case the Oktava is both.

Mk012a Hyper in your choice silver or black. That's what we've been talking about. Don't forget coupon code DV.
Click to expand...


thank you kindly.
 
Thought you might enjoy this, from RAMPS:


On 10/17/05 8:57 PM, in article 43547521$0$3753$39cec...@news.twtelecom.net,
"John Blankenship" <"John Blankenship"> wrote:



> Jeff,


> So, how's the new mic? Many of us look forward to the lowdown from a
> true, dedicated Schoepsophile.



I have only had a few precious moments to listen to the new Schoeps shotgun
microphone (actually, it seems strange to even say "Schoeps" and "shotgun"
together), MI 3 as most of you know, has few scenes that benefit from this
sort of microphone. One of our favorite mics on this movie is the Octava
because it holds up to the assault of noise, gunfire, explosions and so
forth, that we are doing.

I will post info on the Schoeps at a later date. Preliminary use confirms
that what has been said in the advance literature ("advertising" Roberto) is
quite true --- it provides much of the benefit of a longer, more directional
microphone while still preserving the legendary Schoeps sound (even at
considerably greater distances).


Regards, Jeff Wexler


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