Plasma vs HMI

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nickbeef

Active member
Looking to get a Joker 400 or 800, but I came across these Hive plasma lights... anyone got any thoughts on the pluses/minuses of either?
 
That can be a complex question. And admittedly, I'm not a master of lighting. However, here is my opinion currently (subject to change).

HMI is still king for 20Ks and these larger outputs. But for lower outputs such as the range you're asking about, in my personal experience I prefer the plasma fixtures. They have better quality light, they are flicker free, and they have better power to output ratio...so they can more easily run off of household circuits. So less need for generators.

If you are thinking about owning, I would say Plasma over HMI, specially at the lower tier of output you're talking about. So the Wasp 250 instead of the Joker 400 and the Wasp 1000 instead of the Joker 800. And I believe the plasma counterparts might even be cheaper.

Obviously there is more to consider, but for me, that is how they initially compare.
 
If you haven't seen it already this may help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iP0PZo2JDM


This gives a decent side by side size comparison (@7:26), which is the most beneficial part of the video.

They act like modifiers on the jokers will burst into flames. It's a stretch of an argument but they have incentive to move Hive units.

Rafael, why do you think the hives have better quality light than jokers? And isn't the Hive 1000w competing more with larger fixtures than a joker 800?
 
rob norton said:
Rafael, why do you think the hives have better quality light than jokers? And isn't the Hive 1000w competing more with larger fixtures than a joker 800?
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Plasmas on spectrometer readings seem to have a more full and even wavelength spectrum than HMIs, and see into the Reds a bit further (good for skintones). But I'd use HMIs any day of the week too :)

I only say the 1000 vs 800 because I don't think Hive make a 500 Wasp so the next step up is the 1000...which is comparable in price to the joker 800. But I hink the Plasma 1000 is comparable to a 2k HMI. But you can still run the 1000 plasma off household circuits with room to spare.
 
I'm in Australia and haven't come across any Hive lights yet but it'd be great to actually check some out.
~sticks to hiring daylight sources for the rest of his life~
 
I have two 800 Bron Kobold HMI's and love them and really want to get my hands on a demo of the Hive 1000. It seems very impressive and plasma is supposed to be "full spectrum"(or at least closer to it), unlike HMI's. My .02, stay away from Jokers. I've never liked them. They're cheaply built(at least the 400's & 800's) and will fall in apart in a year if handled with anything except kid gloves.
 
rob norton said:
If you haven't seen it already this may help: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iP0PZo2JDM
Click to expand...

I did watch this and is part of the reason I'm seeing the plasma lights as such a strong competition to HMI's. In fact, unless I'm mistaken, I didn't see any advantage that equivalent HMI's have over plasmas (intensity vs power draw, cost vs intensity, heat, etc.), aside from at 8:27 in the above video where the two raw (i'm assuming unmodified) beams are compared. The HMI is cleaner, with a softer more natural fall off, while the plasma is a more focused beam, but has several clear circular "steps". However, the only time I would expect to use an unmodified beam is when bouncing off beadboard.

In anycase, a Joker Bug 400 kit costs about $5000, while a Hive Wasp 250 kit costs about $3500. They should have similar intensity output, but the plasma is about half the power draw, with almost no heat(?), and but the plasma is cheaper?

Why would I buy an equivalent HMI over plasma then? Is plasma the future and makes sub 2K watt HMI's obsolete?
 
Run&Gun said:
I have two 800 Bron Kobold HMI's and love them and really want to get my hands on a demo of the Hive 1000. It seems very impressive and plasma is supposed to be "full spectrum"(or at least closer to it), unlike HMI's. My .02, stay away from Jokers. I've never liked them. They're cheaply built(at least the 400's & 800's) and will fall in apart in a year if handled with anything except kid gloves.
Click to expand...
I got to use Kobold HMI's on a movie a few months ago. After that experience, I'd say f I were to ever get my hands on any smaller HMI's there is no way it would be Jokers, except maybe one for using in a source four. I think there may even be an adapter to get a Kobold HMI into a source four. The 800 kobolds are considerably larger than a Joker but I'll take the power factor correction, weather resistance, dimming, better output due to a larger reflector, even the better transport case that was with the one I was dealing with.
 
Likewise, I only use Jokers in the Jo-Leko configuration but I look forward to the day when we are able to use LED or plasma versions of them instead. Right now it comes down to comparable rental rates, the Jo-Lekos are much more available and affordable. But they are cantankerous and the only HMI's in our package that can't be hot-struck, which has boned me a few times.
 
I was in a store today and they had a WASP 250 up and running. Very nice light, but I did notice some shadow doubling at close range. The included diffuser / focusing disks / lenses helped a lot in removing that.

I couldn't get the barn door to cut the beam with a hard edge, but maybe I'm missing something.
 
the only HMI's in our package that can't be hot-struck, which has boned me a few times.
Click to expand...


That's absolutely staggering, given what the damn things cost.

(No, I don't believe I've ever laid a hand on one - I don't think anyone in the UK can afford the damn things, which sort of restates the problem.)
 
I just tested the Wasp Killer Kit last week and was very impressive both by their throw and how they punched through diffusion. Was able to get a 5.6 (ISO 800/24fps) at around 12 to 15 ft.

Matt, I'm curious if you can speak to any other negative or positives about Hives. I'm thinking of picking up a set of the wasps later this month.
 
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