PilotFly H2 Gimbal

Keylight, I am considering the Came Optimus but there are a few unknowns holding me back. Can it disassemble to the small size of the H2? Does it come with the two handles and, if not, how much extra for those? Can it actually handle 1k load or do I need to keep it well under the max capacity? Also, B&H doesn't carry it yet.
 
Flapjack Mountain said:
Keylight, I am considering the Came Optimus but there are a few unknowns holding me back. Can it disassemble to the small size of the H2? Does it come with the two handles and, if not, how much extra for those? Can it actually handle 1k load or do I need to keep it well under the max capacity? Also, B&H doesn't carry it yet.
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B&H doesn't carry it, but Came-TV was very responsive to email questions I had no problem getting a quick and full refund when I canceled the order. I personally would have no qualms about ordering from them. As for max capacity, my take is that they're probably loosing orders because they aren't overstating what it can carry, while it's possible Pilotfly is. (I'll know soon enough on the Pilotfly, and will document the gimbal with a variety of weights right up to their max 2.2kg limit.)

I don't know about how small the Optimus can be disassembled, but I do know that it does come with the two handles, wireless remote, and a nice hard case. And I prefer their external swappable battery to the H2's built-in battery (and the need to carry a second set of batteries for the 2 handle.

Here's a thread on the Optimus that has more information, videos, and details from others who saw it at NAB: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?346443-Came-TV-Optimus-Gimbal-Details-Pricing
 
I played with both at NAB. For me, the most important feature is that the follow-mode response ramps up smoothly for predictable and good looking moves. They both behaved very well and I would buy either on that basis. It's a tough call for me. If I had to decide today, I would go with the Optimus mainly because I get the impression that their support is better and for whatever reason, I feel the engineering is better. But that is all anecdotal and not worth much.

Regarding packing size, I originally thought the H2 packed tighter. But reviewing the videos, it looks like the Optimus will pack the same way the H2 does. Both can detach the pistol handle and both can fold up the same way. So excluding the two handle unit, they pack the same. But from the pictures it looks like the Optimus case is larger for the two-handle grip. But that doesn't stop you from getting a smaller case for when you need to pack light and don't need the two-handle grip.
 
Thanks. Do you know if it's easy to switch follow modes with the Optimus? For the H2, just click a button above the joystick to cycle through.

Right now I think I could go either way too. I'll see which I can get my hands on first.
 
Flapjack Mountain said:
Thanks. Do you know if it's easy to switch follow modes with the Optimus? For the H2, just click a button above the joystick to cycle through.

Right now I think I could go either way too. I'll see which I can get my hands on first.
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I believe the Optimus is starting to ship this week. That was their target. Of course, it'll come from China. Actually, I may be in China again sometime in the next few months. I wonder if they might let me visit..... Gosh, I really miss Shanghai sometimes.
 
nyvz said:
Oh man. So moral of the story is 2335g is too much for H2, but we already knew that :P

His center of gravity looks way too high too though. I wonder if it could handle it if the COG was lowered...

Looks like copter-rc.com also raised their price by $55...
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Yea it looks like they raised the price by $100 then are giving us a $50 discount. How generous lol.
 
The H2 arrived yesterday from B&H. A few initial thoughts. The build quality seems to be ok, although it was a little greasy around the motors right out of the box. The rubber grip on the handle isn't the cleanest cut, and it wasn’t completely glued on - a small corner was flapping a little – not a huge deal, but I’m sure I’ll have to glue it at some point. I know these are little nitpick things but it does go to the overall first impression. The single page instruction manual was amusing in its brevity, and had a small stain on it (from the grease?).

Okay, so what you probably want to hear about is the weight limit. Given the experiences of others with erratic motors, I decided to start out using a weight rather than a camera and lens. I tried two different weights, 1kg and 2kg. My CoG on the weights was low and centered in the middle of the mass.

The 1kg was a quick and easy to do balance.
After balancing and turning it on, the yaw and pitch motors worked fine. The roll motor began to vibrate and whine at about 60 degrees in one direction (about 90 degrees in the other). This is likely a calibration issue which I’ll try adjusting a bit later with software.

The 2kg was a pain to balance and I never could really get it right.
In balancing, I had to slide the yaw/pan plate all the way to the very end (could have really used another few mm of length). The roll plate also had to be moved far enough that when rolling, the pitch/tilt motor would hit the yaw/pan motor. I had the same whining on the roll motor; it was neither better nor worse than with the 1kg weight.

So it does appear that the H2 can support a 2kg, although depending on your gear, you might not get the full range of motion and may have a hard time balancing it. Beyond whether or not the gimbal can support 2kg, I think the 2 handle setup would certainly be a lot easier for carrying that much weight. I found myself using 2 hands on the single handle gimbal after just a few minutes of use. I'm still curious to see if the Came-TV Optimus can also carry 2kg even though they rate it for less.

Other notes

  • One thing Pilotfly goofed on were the default modes. The 3rd mode ("Head Mode") is supposed to hold the camera in a fixed position. It was locked in only two axes Not a big deal, and I should be able to adjust that via software. Again, a small detail but it leaves a slight tarnish on the whole initial impression.
  • The pan/yaw and roll axes both rotate a full 360° (endless rotation), the pitch/tilt axis has a hard stop that allows it to rotate about 350°. This is different from what the B&H Specs say (B&H says Yaw is 360°, Tilt is 220° up to 100° down, Roll is 100° left to 240° right). Given the difference, I wonder if they goofed and put on hardware for the roll that should have a hard stop. Can someone check their H2 and confirm? Having the roll axis be a full (endless) 360 means you truly can rotate the gimbal to mount a Panasonic camera with articulating monitor in the flipped out position!
  • Invert mode appears to work as it should. Unlike the Came-TV Optimus (where you can invert the gimbal upside down while using it), you have to turn off the H2, invert it, then turn it back on in order to use the gimbal upside down. One thing I'll note is that the whine seemed to be a little less when inverted.
  • I was happy to see that the plate will fit a standard Arca-Swiss QR plate. I thought that might be the case from the photos but you never can tell. The safety pin that prevents the camera plate from sliding off accidentally, appears to be bent. Not sure if it’s a defect or by design.
  • The two 1/4-20 mounts on either side of the handle are plastic and don't seem that durable. I probably wouldn’t mount much weight to them. The bottom 1/4-20 looks has a threaded anodized (red) aluminum mount which looks a bit sturdier. I put my Vinten plate on the bottom to give it a standing base, although I'll probably buy a tabletop tripod with a QR plate. I had to use a rubber gasket between the plate and the bottom of the handle to prevent the handle from rotating.
  • I do generally like the position of the joystick on the back of the handle just under my thumb, although I did find myself bumping it occasionally. (In contrast, the Came-TV Optimus has the joystick located on the front of the handle, which might be a slightly better location in terms of not accidentally bumping it.)

As someone commented previously (in this thread or another) the next evolutionary step in gimbals might be for them to automatically adjust the PID settings based on weight. Short of automatically adjusting, it would be great if the software had a place to simply enter the total carry weight and have the software make basic adjustments based on that. Until then, it’ll be a manual process. Hopefully the software will resolve the whining on the roll axis without screwing up the whole gimbal.

I'll try to get some video up at some point.
 
Appreciate this update / info. As someone still waiting for mine to ship, I'm cautiously optimistic. :undecided
Please do post test video if / when you can. Thanks!
 
Thanks for the rundown. Very helpful since I have a preorder at BH that I'm waiting for.

Would you trust the 1/4-20 on the bottom to hold the whole rig? I've become accustomed to operating my Beholder DS1 with a monopod attached for quick jib shots and an extra hand for stability, but it might be too much for a 1/4-20 especially if it's a little flimsy?

So you can't invert while the unit is on? I was always impressed with my DS1 that I can invert while operating as long as the pan and tilt axes are in the right position. I've even operated with the handle horizontal though it can get a little shakey.

What camera/rigs were you using for your 1kg and 2kg tests?
 
keylight said:
I think the 2 handle setup would certainly be a lot easier for carrying that much weight. I found myself using 2 hands on the single handle gimbal after just a few minutes of use.
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I found it to be easier. However, I wasn't into the build quality of the handles given the price and returned mine and decided to order the Came-TV dual handles:
http://www.came-tv.com/dual-gimbal-handles-p-814.html
The Came-TV are only $68 and can entirely break down into pieces for easy packing, although it mounts on the bottom of the pistol grip so the setup weighs more and looks a little goofy.

The H2 can indeed be flipped to accommodate the GH4's flip screen, although the method is a little different than Keylight describes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ta4aBg7DdGc
 
keylight said:
  • I wonder if they goofed and put on hardware for the roll that should have a hard stop. Can someone check their H2 and confirm?
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Mine is the same way; no stop in the roll axis.

The 1/4 20 on bottom sure seems sturdy to me. Also, I can go from normal to inverted mode and back without powering off.
 
nyvz said:
Would you trust the 1/4-20 on the bottom to hold the whole rig?
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I'm not sure if I'd trust the bottom mount. It is a piece of metal but that metal is embedded in the plastic handle. I suppose it depends how far in the handle the metal piece goes.

Flapjack Mountain said:
I found it to be easier. However, I wasn't into the build quality of the handles given the price and returned mine and decided to order the Came-TV dual handles:
http://www.came-tv.com/dual-gimbal-handles-p-814.html
The Came-TV are only $68 and can entirely break down into pieces for easy packing, although it mounts on the bottom of the pistol grip so the setup weighs more and looks a little goofy.

The H2 can indeed be flipped to accommodate the GH4's flip screen, although the method is a little different than Keylight describes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ta4aBg7DdGc
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I'd love, love, love... if they sold male and female connectors for the gimbal and handle so we could mount them to whatever setup we want. For example, it'd be very cool to put the gimbal on a shoulder rig and use the grip underneath the rig. That would take out so much shake (still not the up/down) and be a great way to carry the weight.

Flapjack Mountain said:
Mine is the same way; no stop in the roll axis.

The 1/4 20 on bottom sure seems sturdy to me. Also, I can go from normal to inverted mode and back without powering off.
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Excellent! Thanks for letting me know. I'll give the inverted another mode another try with power on.

I'm dying to find time to work with the gimabl some more!

EDIT: I missed this part of your question:

nyvz said:
What camera/rigs were you using for your 1kg and 2kg tests?
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I was using measured weights, rather than a camera. I actually just ordered a Panasonic G7 for the gimbal. I was going to give the Sony a6300 a try but ultimately decided against that purchase. Watching the wallet and I've got all my Panny lenses. Going with the Sony would be a whole new system and would have required $$$ of investment. From everything I've read about the G7, it's 4K is fantastic, and the sucker is super light (I had the chance to hold one). This will be my "don't care if I mess it up" camera (although I do care if I mess up the lenses). Cheap, light, seems perfect for the gimbal, especially as I do end up doing a lot of work in places other than home.
 
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Flapjack Mountain said:
SimpleBGC might prompt you to update firmware, but I highly recommend not doing any firmware changes until you've checked with tech support.
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Great idea!

I gave the inverted mode another try. It looks like I can invert while it's on, but it's not a usable inversion in the sense that I can't shoot while inverting. The gimbal goes a bit off while inverting.

I also thought more about using the H2 on the end of a boom. Initially, the picture I had in my mind was something like this:

boom3.jpg

I don't think the mount can handle that kind of vertical force.

But if the goal is simply gaining height like this, then I think it should work:

boom1.jpg


But best might be to mount an L bracket (blue) with a hinge (green) that will allow the gimbal to hang inverted:

boom5.jpg

Would probably want to try to control swing with some kind of tension.
 
Just be aware that these kinds of hinges have a lot of play in them. If you attach them to a stick and move the stick from left to right, the image might jump.
 
I received my replacement H2 and so far it's working well. I'm using my a7sii (627 grams) and Sony 28mm (200 grams), so it's well under 1kg and pleasant to hold. Balance takes less than a minute, I haven't touched any settings, and I'm delighted to say everything is working as it should with only a few vibrations in invert mode.
 
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