Par Cans for Film/DV

T

The Evil Mariachi

Well-known member
Hey guys,

I've been looking to expand my modest light kit with a fixture or two that would add some punch and versatility without breaking the bank. At the moment, I'd be able to get either a used 2k fresnel from eBay, or a couple of par 64 lights. I haven't had any experience with the pars, so maybe some of you guys that have used them in the past can help me out.

Mainly, I'd like to use them for exterior night shots for moonlight and as background/backlights. In your experience, how do the pars perform gelled or bounced? How much difference in throw can I expect from the different types of bulbs available? Are there light stand adapters for the par cans?

I currently own two 650 fresnels, and three flo-lights, which have been adequate for interviews and small scenes. But now I'll be doing more narrative work both on dv and 16mm film and would like to be able to get some more contrast and coverage from my lights.

I could probably end up with 3 par64 cans with the money I'd get a 2k fresnel on eBay with. So, ultimately, would choosing 3 1k pars over a 2k fresnel make practical sense?

Thanks in advance, guys.
 
Par cans are great tools that can suppliment your light kit well.

>Mainly, I'd like to use them for exterior night shots for moonlight
>and as background/backlights.

That's a great use.

>In your experience, how do the pars perform gelled or bounced?

they use gell holders that work fine. They wouldn't be my first choice to bounce them (open face instead) but I've done it before...

>How much difference in throw can I expect
>from the different types of bulbs available?

I'd go with the VNSP 1k bulbs. (very narrow spot) I think the angle spread is like 6-8 degrees. That's great punch for light coming in through a window, or natural even fall off for night time back light if you put the light up high from far back.

You can get a 2.8 with a group of 4 1k vnsp pars from a block away...

>Are there light stand adapters for the par cans?

Yes, just like any other light. See MSE grip website, or BH photo
 
cheno, you recommend the Source 4 Pars more than the normal Par64s? You can get a brand new Par64 for $19.99 plus S&H while the Source 4 one is up near $200. It better be a *a lot* better!
 
Hey Guys, don't get confused. A par 64 and a Source 4 are very different lights.
Pars have bulbs that you can replace (like an old car headlight bulb - big) that come in spot, med, or flood patterns. They are not very controllable because they put out a lot of light. The spot bulbs might just be the most bang for the buck considering how far away they throw their light. I have used them by throwing them and a small putt-putt (generator) into a pickup and sent a guy to light up a water tower that was maybe a half mile away from the foreground action. Here is a good example how I used them in this music video for LOW:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zo3MGbNE1WA.

Too bad utube looks like doo-doo, but you get the idea. We didn't have a hugh budget so I mixed spots and med lens 64pars all the way up the road, maybe 20 of them. Some backlit the trees and some front lit them. I also used a few for rim lights on the band. I needed them far away so that we could quickly get wide and cu shots as needed so they were perfect for that because I could have them 30 feet away and still have a good strong rim (and who doesn't like that?).

A Source 4 is more like what is used in a theater and is highly controllable. They have 4 inner leafs (or barndoors as such) that allow you to shape the light and you are able to put gobos in them in order to project a pattern. You can focus and de-focus the pattern of the light by moving the barrel, or front of the lamp. Even the 1k Source 4 does not have any where near the throw of the pars.
Both are very good tools, and both do quite different tasks.

You can always goto a rental house and ask to look at the difference in person.

Good Luck!
 
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I've used par cans mostly for enviromental/architectural lights (ie lighting the background and not the people). They're cheap and have a good amount of output, which is why they're good for this purpose, but the harsh light quality and non-controllable nature makes it undesirable for people. I've used lekos (source4's) on people before as a rim light (mimicking moon light coming through a window). As mentioned before, they have 4 internal leafs so the light is easy to shape itself without a bunch of stands and flags.
 
I don't use pars much at all. Ugly ugly little bastards. As some of you mentioned previously, they are not very forgiving on people and work best as background lights.

Plus I tend to stay away from theater lighting instruments and stick with arri fresnels and soft light using chimera's and kino's.
 
So par cans are only good for background lighting. Good. That's exactly what I need. I'll get some lighting kits, maybe use some china balls for closer up stuff. So let's say I'm shooting a scene at night, in a forest. Any suggestions on what the minimum or ideal amount of par cans would be needed for something like that? It was mentioned above that 4 with 1k VNSP bulbs would be enough to get a 2.8. I don't know anything about light measurement, but I'm assuming that would be enough.
 
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Well a PAR CAN is not much chop at all IMO and whilst they are cheap dont do much for me. The source 4's however are a different matter. These can make fantastic BG lighting and put out a strong beam over distance.

EDIT: Great for throwing shadows as well.
 
I go with the Source4 pars. One lamp is all you need it comes with four changeable lenses. It cost a little more but after you factor in the cost of lamps, not much.
 
Thanks phudsontx. Any suggestions on what specific model is best? Any accessories you'd recommend? Should I just find the closest ETC dealer? Or is there a better option for buying them?
 
Ryan Patrick O'Hara said:
I don't use pars much at all. Ugly ugly little bastards. As some of you mentioned previously, they are not very forgiving on people and work best as background lights.

Plus I tend to stay away from theater lighting instruments and stick with arri fresnels and soft light using chimera's and kino's.
Click to expand...

Ahahahahaha, how times have changed!

Three years later, and I love Par64's to bounce or diffuse. They give a good punch and are cheap. Light output per watt is most efficient. Back then I really used fresnels for harder light and chimeras for softer... even kino's.

Today, unless the look calls for it, or there isn't much space, I rarely break out a kino.

I do however, stay away from the theater housings, they do have gel holders at the end, but I do prefer the MolePar 64's. Better robust housings, imo.

I guess we all evolve in style, and it's too funny to see me say things like this^ !
 
I will put another vote in for Source 4 Pars depending on the use. The old aluminum par 64's can take some abuse and keep going. I have run a 120k lighting rig of par 64's in the rain and never lost one. A Source 4 par isn't so forgiving outside. They tend to collect water and bugs much more on outdoor rigs. On the flip side of that, in order to have 4 beam spreads on a par 64 you need 4 lamps. With a Source 4 par you get 4 lenses with the fixture and only have to use 1 lamp. The next nice thing about a Source 4 par is it is much more efficient. A 750w S4 par easily equals a 1k par 64. You can also lamp them down to 575 or 375 if you need to and keep a similar color temp. While I'm on that subject, the S4 has a slightly higher color temp than a standard 1k par 64 lamp which to me is much more desirable.

Now for the kicker, out of any of them I prefer the Source 4 ParNel for TV and video work. It has a focusable lens like a fresnel with the par body. They seem to fit right in between a medium and wide in those situations that could use either.

Lastly I will throw in a plug for getting them from your local dealer if there is one. I like to build relationships with local people because you never know when you may need bailed out of a jam at the last minute. If your local dealer is also a rental house they are much more willing to work with you if for some reason you need an extra light or a loaner because yours got dropped from a ladder and broke a casting. They may also have some older used stuff you can get for a deal.
 
A source 4 is an ellipsoidial projector light, very different than a PAR ( parabolic aluminum reflector) ,

The source four is a projector fixture, works like a very powerful spotlight that utilizes a lens, and can be very finely focused, therefore you can use gobos to project certain patterns, logos and things like that. they are used alot in theater to give colorful background patterns as backgrounds on stage and backgrounds. they can also be used as small spotlights and have 4 internal flags that let you control the light spread with a very sharp edge due to the flags being there before the lens, these fixtures are available in different angles of spread based on the snoot and lens on the fixture, ussualy specified by an angle degree of the spread.

Now ETC the maker of the source four also makes a great PAR range fixture too it is way better than a basic PAR can (the rock n roll light you see all over concert truss) .

Source 4 is an actual brand name for an ETC ellipsoidal fixture ( also known as a Leko (the brand that established its popularity) ) and these type of fixtures are made by several companies but not use the source 4 name, but are used in the same fashion.

All stage lighting can be adapted to use a Spud or baby Spud attachment to be able to be utilized with C stands
 
Oh, I also forgot about the S4 Par MCM. That has a specially coated reflector that helps remove some of the heat from the beam. The max wattage that you can put in a MCM is 575w due to this reflector. Once again, I use them for uplighting on drape and backgrounds that may not be as accepting to a hot beam.

http://www.etcconnect.com/products.fixtures.aspx

And if you are in the central pa area, we are one of the main dealers for ETC products.
 
recordingwhiz said:
A source 4 is an ellipsoidial projector light, very different than a PAR ( parabolic aluminum reflector) ,

The source four is a projector fixture, works like a very powerful spotlight that utilizes a lens, and can be very finely focused, therefore you can use gobos to project certain patterns, logos and things like that. they are used alot in theater to give colorful background patterns as backgrounds on stage and backgrounds. they can also be used as small spotlights and have 4 internal flags that let you control the light spread with a very sharp edge due to the flags being there before the lens, these fixtures are available in different angles of spread based on the snoot and lens on the fixture, ussualy specified by an angle degree of the spread.

Now ETC the maker of the source four also makes a great PAR range fixture too it is way better than a basic PAR can (the rock n roll light you see all over concert truss) .

Source 4 is an actual brand name for an ETC ellipsoidal fixture ( also known as a Leko (the brand that established its popularity) ) and these type of fixtures are made by several companies but not use the source 4 name, but are used in the same fashion.

All stage lighting can be adapted to use a Spud or baby Spud attachment to be able to be utilized with C stands
Click to expand...

Thanks for this incorrect and lengthy lesson. Here is the answer from the manufacturer ETC:

http://www.etcconnect.com/product.overview.aspx?ID=20084&lang=us&region=1

Thanks for reading.
 
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