I was looking for some suggestions to display a keyed image with actors onto a monitor while I film backplates for a green screen project so I can match angles of the set to the angles the actors are using. I'm using the HVX200A and filming in 1080i/24P. I didn't know if FCP or an Adobe program would be able to handle this.
On site composite matching
- Thread starter dfsprod
- Start date
clang
Veteran
I thought one of the Adobe programs could do this 'live' but may be wrong.
But a slightly lower tech option would be to have a NLE-equipped laptop at the set, and capture live camera shots whenever required into your NLE and check them there - slower but workable (and much cheaper)...
But a slightly lower tech option would be to have a NLE-equipped laptop at the set, and capture live camera shots whenever required into your NLE and check them there - slower but workable (and much cheaper)...
http://magazine.creativecow.net/article/feeding-live-video-into-adobe-after-effects
http://www.frischluft.com/lensfeed/index.php
I think this may be helpfull, I haven't used it, but maybe...
http://www.frischluft.com/lensfeed/index.php
I think this may be helpfull, I haven't used it, but maybe...
Gord.T
Still "Senior Member"
There are a few ways to do it depending in what your camera moves are as stated.
The simpler the moves, the simpler the problem, but here are the general methods.
1/Motion control rig.
Not everyone is going to have that (Been thinking about a DIY rig for years. A panner would be easiest but I digress.) so the next best bet is:
2/ Placing targets on your green screen (Example)
and using match-moving software to replicate the camera in a 3D program. There you recreate a background set such as a city scape in 3D and
render that out using your tracked 3D camera as your back plate. Generally with a little DOF applied you can get away with something convincing but will still take a lot of effort with or without DOF.
Not what your looking for I know.
3/ Fake it but the more your camera moves the more your in trouble.
a/ Static locked down camera - too easy ofcourse. Can't do 'that', haha.
b/ Tripod with a smooth pan- Not bad. Mark your start and stop pan points and timing and try to replicate while shooting your back plate. Iffy though.
/b2 A dolly roll. Sigh. Actually it's probably one of the more complicated. You could maybe track it and edit with a 2D program if there was enough DOF to blur out the details in the background. Otherwise you'd have to use 3D models or take a series of stills and write a custom script to match the perspectives of the stills with the camera angles. Ouch. Not really worth doing is it?
c/ Hand held- If your shot is limited to standing in one place and not panning say more than 25 degrees, you may get by with 2D tracking in a program like AE.
There are many tutorials on the web about it.
d/ Hand held, panning and moving around-you can't do it unless you use the #1 or #2 method.
Lastly, if I may make a personal comment:
Whenever you ask for advice on a VFX shot, please always give as much detail about the shot as possible. Otherwise it really is a guessing game.
I'd avoid a shot like that and try another approach. Depends on what the script calls for but I think I know what your after and I think if you can't do #1 or #2 then:
a/ your in big trouble if you aren't shooting with a locked down camera.
b/ your really really low budget and doing this for fun so I'd go with a locked down camera and stick in a static picture for the background.
This shot or any won't make or break your short so cut your losses and go with something simple that works rather than something fancy that fails.
Like I say, I'm forced to guess, due to lack of information about the shot, and I get that ALL of the time, constantly, so it's not solely directed at you. Just a pet peeve of mine that I like to remind everyone about haha. :beer:
Hope that helps anyways.
//edit:
Again, I think your approaching it from the wrong direction. -Cheers.
The simpler the moves, the simpler the problem, but here are the general methods.
1/Motion control rig.
Not everyone is going to have that (Been thinking about a DIY rig for years. A panner would be easiest but I digress.) so the next best bet is:
2/ Placing targets on your green screen (Example)
and using match-moving software to replicate the camera in a 3D program. There you recreate a background set such as a city scape in 3D and
render that out using your tracked 3D camera as your back plate. Generally with a little DOF applied you can get away with something convincing but will still take a lot of effort with or without DOF.
Not what your looking for I know.
3/ Fake it but the more your camera moves the more your in trouble.
a/ Static locked down camera - too easy ofcourse. Can't do 'that', haha.
b/ Tripod with a smooth pan- Not bad. Mark your start and stop pan points and timing and try to replicate while shooting your back plate. Iffy though.
/b2 A dolly roll. Sigh. Actually it's probably one of the more complicated. You could maybe track it and edit with a 2D program if there was enough DOF to blur out the details in the background. Otherwise you'd have to use 3D models or take a series of stills and write a custom script to match the perspectives of the stills with the camera angles. Ouch. Not really worth doing is it?
c/ Hand held- If your shot is limited to standing in one place and not panning say more than 25 degrees, you may get by with 2D tracking in a program like AE.
There are many tutorials on the web about it.
d/ Hand held, panning and moving around-you can't do it unless you use the #1 or #2 method.
Lastly, if I may make a personal comment:
Whenever you ask for advice on a VFX shot, please always give as much detail about the shot as possible. Otherwise it really is a guessing game.
I'd avoid a shot like that and try another approach. Depends on what the script calls for but I think I know what your after and I think if you can't do #1 or #2 then:
a/ your in big trouble if you aren't shooting with a locked down camera.
b/ your really really low budget and doing this for fun so I'd go with a locked down camera and stick in a static picture for the background.
This shot or any won't make or break your short so cut your losses and go with something simple that works rather than something fancy that fails.
Like I say, I'm forced to guess, due to lack of information about the shot, and I get that ALL of the time, constantly, so it's not solely directed at you. Just a pet peeve of mine that I like to remind everyone about haha. :beer:
Hope that helps anyways.
//edit:
Again, I think your approaching it from the wrong direction. -Cheers.
Last edited:
Ok, so all shots are locked. Most of my crew (frosh/soph film students) haven't worked with green screen before, so all shots are locked. We already have our foreground performances wrapped and in the can. Now we are filming background plates. We have an entire time capsule house almost an hour away that we are filming in. All of the shots will consist of different angles of the house and I basically just have to match the angles of the rooms with the actors performance. I did a little research and I believe from my understanding that Adobe OnLocation should be able to display a keyed image on a monitor while filming a live background. Unless I'm completely off base.
VariableOrange
Member
I was watching the Hollywood Camerwork VFX for Directors DVD series and in chapter 5 or 6 they mention this briefly, as far as I can tell it was a special kind of monitor. Otherwise, I'm not too knowledgeable about such things.