NTSC vs. PAL Can someone explain?

Doc Bernard

Doc Bernard

Indie Arms Member
Okay, will dvds/.mov's shot in NTSC work in a PAL region? And visa versa? If not, are there work arounds? Is this only for the tech aspects of editing and camera output and once burned to MOV/ Finalized DVD, it does not matter?

Or if I am handed a DVD shot NTSC, does it matter if I play it in the PAL area, as long as the region zone was correctly set (or multi-region)?
 
Doc Bernard said:
Okay, will dvds/.mov's shot in NTSC work in a PAL region? And visa versa? If not, are there work arounds? Is this only for the tech aspects of editing and camera output and once burned to MOV/ Finalized DVD, it does not matter?

Or if I am handed a DVD shot NTSC, does it matter if I play it in the PAL area, as long as the region zone was correctly set (or multi-region)?
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Playback on a computer, no problems. Years ago, playback via a dedicated DVD player connected to a TV might have been a problem, but generally not much of one anymore if your player is both multi-region and multi-format. Cheap players that are both of these start at about $30. Here's a Sony that's $40: http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Ultra-Co...82644&sr=1-1&keywords=multi+format+dvd+player

So if you're handed a PAL DVD in say... Malaysia. Should not be an issue. On the other hand, if you're wondering about distributing your own work on DVD, I'd say go with NTSC. The rest of the world has generally been much more able to handle our NTSC stuff for years, than we have been of handling their PAL and SECAM stuff.
 
LOL, you've been reading my posts! Thank you. That's the info I am looking for. Had submissions that were NTSC, and I wanted ensure we could screen them with no issues!
 
The only thing that seems to make a difference for end users are the safe areas. The difference in screen format means how TV set displays a 'foreign' format seems very random. I've got a NTSC originated DVD, and on one TV, circles are a bit squashed but I can see all the edges, another TV leaves circles, circles but there's a bit of cropping - yet another NTSC disc bought in the states on holiday works perfectly on both the TVs - as if one has some kind of hidden stretch command?

We've got used to safe areas to cope with camera formats, but DVDs also seem a bit variable. I'm wondering if it's the difference in DV (SD) frame sizes as in our 720 x 576 version compared to the US version?
 
"Region" is a market-control mechanism; has nothing to do with PAL or NTSC. Studios want to release specific product to specific markets, so they code them for region, and the players sold in those regions can play them, while players in other regions can't. This is true between NTSC regions and PAL regions -- in theory, something meant for Australia could not be played in Europe, even though both are PAL.

Don't know how much of an issue that is anymore, or if players still adhere to regions without being specifically "region-free" players.

In any case, things that people burn for submission to a film festival aren't going to be coded for region (or it's VERY unlikely they will be), so it's not something you'll have to worry about.
 
paulears said:
We've got used to safe areas to cope with camera formats, but DVDs also seem a bit variable. I'm wondering if it's the difference in DV (SD) frame sizes as in our 720 x 576 version compared to the US version?
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The variance is probably a matter of both the decoding firmware in the player and the encoding software used from disc to disc.
 
David Jimerson said:
Don't know how much of an issue that is anymore, or if players still adhere to regions without being specifically "region-free" players.
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An Australian film "Bliss"(1985), not to be confused with a number of other films titled "Bliss"... was only available on a regioned DVD (I don't recall if it was 2 or 4...). It was unplayable on my 'new' Panasonic BD/DVD player as of last year.

I've not ripped it but that may be the only way to get it on to a 'region free' media for playing on my dedicated player.

Needless to say... the DVD was an official ligit copy bought via Internet and shipped from Australia.

Same is true for my region 2 DVDs from Germany...

While the usual explanation for the regioning is that 'hollywood' wants it to control distribution and price, etc. what I don't understand is why the rest of the world 'fell into lock step', I have no idea why a german production company would want to 'limit' their material only to the EU market, rather than get it out to the world, in particular the US... given that the US buys tons of movies... (and the same reasoning for other countries... just I'm more familiar with german films...).

An additional benefit of playing a country specific DVD is the captions are in the 'in country' language... a help to those whose 'ears' are not quite up to catching dialog... especially if there's regionalisms involved... but I digress...

Note: It occurred to me that I ran across an australian law or court ruling that requires manufacturers to give codes for players to eliminate regioning, then due to a trade agreement with the US, it seems that manufacturers are not obliged to give unlock codes or sell 'region free' players in Australia...

I personally believe that regioning is a form of limiting of competition and free trade, and wish someone with bux to burn could get a case to the US Supreme Court to eliminate this form of impairment.
But alas those with money to pursue such a case, are those that profit by the unfair practices...
 
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LOL, hey, I am wanting info, so to prevent this thread from being shut down, lets not discuss politics, m'kay?
 
j1clark@ucsd.edu said:
While the usual explanation for the regioning is that 'hollywood' wants it to control distribution and price, etc. what I don't understand is why the rest of the world 'fell into lock step', I have no idea why a german production company would want to 'limit' their material only to the EU market, rather than get it out to the world, in particular the US... given that the US buys tons of movies... (and the same reasoning for other countries... just I'm more familiar with german films...).
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Well, they (the German studios) don't HAVE to.

I suspect Hollywood required it as a means of controlling distribution and hedging against piracy, and the DVD/player manufacturers followed suit because they wanted content.
 
Doc Bernard said:
LOL, hey, I am wanting info, so to prevent this thread from being shut down, lets not discuss politics, m'kay?
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The technical reasons for 'typing' a DVD for PAL, SECAM, or NTSC regions are gone.

On the issue of fest submissions. I only been able to attend one fest where my work was shown... and it was good I did... I sent in both DVD and BD media, and the fest provided the room where my work was shown with the BD media... but the player was DVD only... I pointed out that I had sent in both types, and they found the correct media for their player setup... (I'm not big enough to get full theater projection...).
 
for 'data dvds' with .mov files, most if not all dvd burning applications will not have a region. and if he has the codec and player in his computer, it will work.

video authored dvds with region lock(only commercial dvds have those region locks) will not work even on some dvd drives on pcs and laptops(they give you an option to change the region 5 times or so when they encounter a different region dvd). but that's a small percentage of dvd drives. dvds that you author in most if not all dvd authoring application don't have region lock by default at least.

when i send someone a document or image file, i would send him a pdf, old doc file, new docx file(with compatibility), a jpg, png, tiff(windows - no compression), psd(with compatibility - double the size), a root folder and a folder for each file, when the file is sent, the job is done and i will not work/worry about it again. if it's a print job, i send a printed picture as a reference, and tell them not to send me anything that does not match that reference.

if you expect him to play the dvd in a dvd player, send him two dvds, it won't cost you much but will save you time and headaches, just mark them NTSC and PAL.
if he is expecting to play the dvd as a data dvd on his computer, send him multiple formats that would work on pc and mac native operating system without any installations, wmv, mp4(h.264), ...etc. don't give anyone any reason to make you re-work something or delay anything your doing.
 
Amr Rahmy said:
video authored dvds with region lock(only commercial dvds have those region locks) will not work even on some dvd drives on pcs and laptops(they give you an option to change the region 5 times or so when they encounter a different region dvd). but that's a small percentage of dvd drives. dvds that you author in most if not all dvd authoring application don't have region lock by default at least.
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The 'region lock after 5 (or howevermany) uses seems to be an application layer function. I've disabled the auto start on the standard Mac OS player, and used VLC for years and have been able to play all DVD's VLC supports, and I have Region 2 and I believe 4 DVDs, in addition to my 'native' region 1.

I've not tested this with my latest Mac Book Pro, as it doesn't have a disk player at all... have to buy an external... because as we all know physical media is going the way of the dodo... except for dinosaur users...
 
Regioning also helps control costs when (my favourite subject) copyright issues arise. In copyright control the US system is totally separate from the UK one, so stopping playback could be cheaper in some circumstances, and certainly less tricky to negotiate when the markets are quite different. I'm guessing, but it would impact on product placement too, but I suspect it's really done to make sure film release followed by DVD release doesn't get out of step.
 
j1clark@ucsd.edu said:
The 'region lock after 5 (or howevermany) uses seems to be an application layer function. I've disabled the auto start on the standard Mac OS player, and used VLC for years and have been able to play all DVD's VLC supports, and I have Region 2 and I believe 4 DVDs, in addition to my 'native' region 1.

I've not tested this with my latest Mac Book Pro, as it doesn't have a disk player at all... have to buy an external... because as we all know physical media is going the way of the dodo... except for dinosaur users...
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yes, but that's not a solution for less savvy users, and the settings are permanently stored on the drive if checked. happens in windows also.

i did not say it was an efficient way of whatever it thinks it's supposed to be doing, to the people that are using legit copies of the film/tv series, but it's there.
 
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