No control over audio input off a pro sound mixer -- what gives?

N

Noj

Member
I shot a concert video at a local night club the other night, and am mystified as to the lack of control I found with my Canon XH-A1 during the shoot. Fortunately, the sound turned out quite well, but here's what I found. I used my XLR to 1/4" cables and plugged right into the outputs off the club's mixer, that the sound guy said are the way to get the best signal. Even with the audio level inputs on the A1 turned all the way down, I mean to zero, the level controls had no effect. I just got an overloaded signal on the camera, so I turned the audio level control to automatic from manual, and then the levels were fine. I don't see anything in the manual about this, and obviously I am a relative newbie and no sound expert. Is there another output on the pro mixer that I should plug into? Is there a setting I am missing?

The video turned out quite well, I managed a 3 camera shoot and will be getting more live concerts business. Also, any words of advice on editing time I should be charging for, my associate thinks I way underestimated editing time at 3 hours for the first song (obviously balancing color, lighting, and syncing the three cameras to start. Advice?

Thanks,
Jon
 
Are you sure you had the XLR inputs selected in the menu rather than the built-in mic?

Did you use the pad?

What type of signal was being sent to your camera from the mixer mic or line level, and what did you select as an input?
 
Yes, XLR selected in the audio menu. I asked for mic level from the mixer, so I assume that's what I got, and I had the XLR input controls set to XLR. I did not use any attenuation, can't see that would have mattered with the results I got. Not sure what you mean, did I use the pad?

Thanks!
Jon
 
OK, I did not use the attenuation there or the switch on top of the camera either. If he did indeed send line level, I tried switching the XLR inputs to line, and the signal was totally distorted. So I guess I set it up right using the XLR inputs set to XLR, and the audio level to automatic.

Thanks,
Jon
 
Noj said:
OK, I did not use the attenuation there or the switch on top of the camera either. If he did indeed send line level, I tried switching the XLR inputs to line, and the signal was totally distorted. So I guess I set it up right using the XLR inputs set to XLR, and the audio level to automatic.

Thanks,
Jon
Click to expand...
Live sound mixer outputs, be they XLR or 1/4", are almost always going to be line level, usually a nominal +4dBu pro line level. That will inevitably overload a mic level input, even when the input itself is turned all the way down.
 
OK, so I should switch the XLR inputs to line level -- and assume something else was wrong last time, because I switched to line level and had no better results.

Thanks again for your input. No pun intended. :)
 
Noj said:
OK, so I should switch the XLR inputs to line level -- and assume something else was wrong last time, because I switched to line level and had no better results.

Thanks again for your input. No pun intended. :)
Click to expand...
Everything you describe says they were sending a signal that was way too hot for your inputs - whether the problem is at their end of the cable or yours remains to be seen. Double check what the venue is actually sending you and the wiring of the cable you're using to connect the mixer to the camera. WHICH output on the mixer are they are they sending yo,u the 1/4" stereo headphones out, a 1/4" mono mix of the L and R main outputs, a 1.4" aux bus output, or just exactly what?

Their mixer's "line level" is almost certainly the professional +4dBu line level while I'm pretty sure your camera's line level is the consumer/prosumer -10dBv line level. Even if they're sending from their line level output and your camera input is also set to line input, the two signals are still mismatched by about 12 dB - you'll need to insert appropriate pads into the line to get them to match properly.
 
Thanks, this information really helps. I am getting some pads before I do another gig at this club, and reading up on more audio recording techniques.

Jon
 
Noj said:
Thanks, this information really helps. I am getting some pads before I do another gig at this club, and reading up on more audio recording techniques.

Jon
Click to expand...
To do it right, you need to find out the make and model of the mixer the venue is using, find its manual online, and study up on the technical details of its operation. Find out exactly what output they're giving you and you'll be a lot better prepared to make sense out of it all. Note that the best bet is to take your feed from an aux bus that does not change in level as the operator rides gain for the house sound. Also realize that they might not have mic'ed all the instruments - in smaller venues especially drum kits and guitar cabinets often go un-mic'ed because they're already loud enough without added amplification. This means they're going to be missing from the mix they send you.
 
Professional mixing consoles do not normally send out mic. level. It will normally be +4dB professional line level that would overload a consumer line level input and grossly overload a mic. input.
 
Thanks again to all of you for educating me, I am copying all this information so I can work to make my next sessions at music venues work better. I will say that the A1 did an admirable job with the feed I got from the mixer, once I switched it to automatic from manual. I will post a song from the session once I have it edited, I am sure there will be more advice and help. Much appreciated.
 
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