Newb Question - FCP X or FCP 7?

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rezanaghibi

Member
I dno if I'm posting this in the right section, but I need to make a decision on what NLE i want for work so my boss can go pull the trigger and gimme something to edit video with. We have Premiere Pro on here, but just starting it up made me scoff several times. I missed FCP. My old teachers tell me to stick to FCP7, that FCPX doesn't do what they want.

How do I know if FCPX or FCP7 will do what i want? I know FCP7 and am comfortable with it. I just don't want to deal with all the stipulations and short comings I've heard so much about when I talk bout FCPX. Can someone give me a pointer or two?

Thx in advance
 
You do realize that FCP 7 is an End-Of-Life dead platform, yes?


What do you mean when you say that PP made you scoff when it started up? Have you even tried CS5.5?
 
Final Cut X is riddled with design flaws and poor interface decisions by Apple employees. For P2 users, it is good news/bad news.
The good news is that it imports P2 files smoothly at the same time as it transcodes them faster than any other NLE.
The bad news is that it renames all of your clips without asking you. (Another "helpful feature" from the people who brought us Lion's "Version" and "Duplicate" fiasco.)
There is no way to preserve the names of clips. Apple's Compressor will not import those files at all. To preserve your clip names -- for example, for a database or other Media Management System -- you must continue to use Final Cut Pro 7.

Moreover, if you try to eject a P2 card from Finder, Final Cut X locks up.


Third, Final Cut X creates a folder named Final Cut Camera Archives into which you can copy (not import) the card contents for import later. This does nothing more than combine the files found on a P2 card into an OS X Package on your hard drive, so that the card contents now appear as a single file. In other words, it is the same as a Finder copy, except that you no longer see all the P2 folders; you see only a single file, that later can be “attached” and used to select and import the clips.
Another user interface "duh!": Once you have begun the Archive process, Final Cut X offers no way to pause or cancel it.

Despite its dozens of jaw-dropping design flaws (uncharacteristic of Apple), its new paradigm is a good one, and it makes some editing chores much faster and more intuitive. Your decision is a time-based one. If you can afford to wait for the first major update to FCX in March, I would recommend switching to it then.
 
hatchmo said:
Final Cut X is riddled with design flaws and poor interface decisions by Apple employees. For P2 users, it is good news/bad news.
The good news is that it imports P2 files smoothly at the same time as it transcodes them faster than any other NLE.
The bad news is that it renames all of your clips without asking you. (Another "helpful feature" from the people who brought us Lion's "V.
Click to expand...

Good grief, it STILL transcodes P2 files. I dumped FCP and went to GrassValley Edius 6. Uses EVERY native codec, realtime on the timelline, NO transcoding. I just started shooting 3D, and their new 3D system is fantastic, using their new 3D beta. Just change, you'll be glad yo did. You'll find many FCP users in their forum.
 
My P2 files don't get renamed at all. I find FCP X to be a wonderful workflow. Get the trial, see if it works for you. Most folks who hate FCP X I personally find don't know how to use it. Like any NLE, there's a learning curve. If you eject your P2 card from inside FCP X, there's no problems, no need to switch out to the Finder, much faster and easier. You don't have to create an Archive of your P2 card, but the Archive function is a handy and easy way to make a backup copy of it. It's all personal choice. As for doing what they want, FCP X can produce anything any other NLE produces.
 
No Avid recommendations then? Just FCPX or 7 right? I would love to tinker around on the demo, but I have a few projects to work on and with no software I cannot work.

Premiere made me scoff because of it's interface and over-complicated option-riddled start up. I remember it being much simpler when I stopped using it back in the day to move to FCP. I have CS5.5, yes, and compared with FCP it's just a silly almost-there NLE. Adobe is great and all, but at this point I would keep my distance from Premiere.

But regardless, I need software - like yesterday. I need some solid opinions not fan-boys. I don't work with P2 cards ATM but I don't want to get new software that is not future proof - in case I need to work with the cards later on. Most footage is from DSLRs.

Thx
 
So it even looks like FCP7 costs more - 999$ for the Studio (compressor, soundtrack, shake, fcp, motion) while FCPX is $299. I've never been more confused. Why would the old version cost more? I'm downloading the trial as we speak since I learned it is in fact full featured for 30 days. Any further input would be appreciated.
 
If you (or your boss) have the money to spend and need an NLE to complete a project now, buy FCS since you know it already. Just recognize that you're spending $1k in hard dollars to save $X in soft dollars (your time to complete the project in FCS vs time to learn a new NLE and complete the project with that new NLE).

Also recognize that FCS is end-of-life, as noted by Phil, so you'll eventually have to spend more money on another NLE.

If you have the time to learn a new NLE, buy FCPX (along with Motion and Compressor) and dig in. I think you'll realize that it's more than sufficient for most jobs.
 
rezanaghibi, as others have stated - FCP 7 is now dead so I wouldn't recommend learning it. In your situation I would without a doubt recommend FCP X. While there are many valid arguments for certain missing features, etc. You will likely not notice any of them as a beginner and in time these issues are sure to be resolved. Personally, I use FCP 7, X, Avid MC, and occasionally premiere pro (which I don't love either). Depending on what my client needs, or what my own project requires, I choose the best tool for the job - with that said, more often than not that tool has become FCP X. Naturally, most of the arguments against FCP X are from FCP 7 users (it is doubtful that any avid user for example would jump to FCP X). Because of this, I've found many of the arguments against X unfounded. In fact, many of the new features such as an EDL list, timeline with blackspace inserted, etc. Can be found in other NLE applications including Avid, and Da Vinci Resolve. I just mention this so you don't play in to the hype too much. Try X for 30 days - if you have a good eye for detail you'll be able to make some amazing looking projects. Otherwise if you are going to learn another NLE, try Avid MC 6. Far superior to Premiere Pro and Avid is still industry standard so your skill set will be that much more valuable. If you're a quick learner, you can watch a few tutorials and have the basics down in a day or two.
 
The OP said that he knows FCP7 and is comfortable with it so he wouldn't have to learn it. Other than that, I think your points are valid.
 
JohnnyD said:
Good grief, it STILL transcodes P2 files. I dumped FCP and went to GrassValley Edius 6. Uses EVERY native codec, realtime on the timelline, NO transcoding. I just started shooting 3D, and their new 3D system is fantastic, using their new 3D beta. Just change, you'll be glad yo did. You'll find many FCP users in their forum.
Click to expand...
What the hell are you talking about? I ingest P2, Canon XF, avchd, Canon DSLR footage, and hacked 150mbit gh2 footage all the time, without transcode. All of them play back like butter dropped into the same timeline.
 
The advantage to editing with ProRes rather than Long-GOP is that Long-GOP falls apart very fast when doing heavy compositing, dumping on effects, etc. ProRes won't loose one iota of quality. Beside, with Avid, you'll end up using DNX for the same reasons.

FCP X transcodes in the background, so you never notice it much. Dusty, yes, P2 does have to be transcoded to edit in FCP X, it's just done in the background while you edit. Before a clip is transcoded, FCP points to the original on your card. Once the transcode is done, it changes the pointer to the new ProRes clip. H.264 does not have to be transcoded, but you have that option.

FCP X does have a 3D plugin available, too.

I highly recommend Ripple Training videos, especially the new Compositing in FCP X course. Lots of stuff most people don't know FCP X will do.

I've trained many Edius users over the years, and 4 on FCP X so far, and they all fall in love with FCP 5-7 & X, telling me how bulky and awkward Edius is to work with (I spent a day recently with a student at her studio being taught Edius, wasn't impressed at all).
 
BenB said:
My P2 files don't get renamed at all.
Click to expand...
Then you're alone. FCX does properly name files from some cameras, but not from others. From a Panasonic HVX camera, Final Cut X does not retain in Finder the name that the camera gave to the clip. An Apple Certified FCX trainer suggested in a training session that either Panasonic or Apple needs to rewrite the driver to correct this. Until they do that, if you want to use files with their original names, you can use Final Cut Pro 7 do the import, then manually move the files into the folder "Final Cut Events".
 
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Final Cut retains the filename, but only as metadata. And it hides it from you. You need to select the new, convoluted "date-time" name, go to the Info Inspector window, then select the tab for Info, then go to the bottom of that window, then select Extended View from the popup and then scroll to the bottom of that window -- all to see what Final Cut X calls the "Original Name". Really?
From the gear popup at the bottom of the Info Inspector window, you can select Apply Custom Name->Original Name from Camera. But there are two problems with this: First, why make me do this every time I import video clips?
Second, after you rename the clips to what they should have been in the first place, go to the Final Cut Events folder and look at the list of files you just imported. What do you see? "Original Name"? Nope.
The design flaw is that FCX renames every file without your permission or giving you an option.
 
I'm a firm believer in the "do what works for you" method. The layman doesn't care what you edit video on, as long as the output looks and sound professional.

After the FCPx debacle, I made the jump premiere. There's still a lot of things I miss about FCP 7, but it's hard to back a horse that is officially out of the race.
 
What type of work are you going to be editing in this new edit suite?

The total workflow from shoot through to presentation medium may have an impact on what you choose.
 
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