Need help listing the pros of Arri Lighting

R

RyanMKincaid

Well-known member
A friend and I have been doing some small projects; we're a total package team, we cover every aspect of production from writing to post editing. We purchase our own equipment as needed. So far, for lighting, we've been making do with practicals, 3x 1200 LEDs, 3x Smith Victor 750s, and a pair of Smith Victor Q60s; Nothing terribly special.

We've come into some money which we can pump back into our company and have come to the conclusion that we should improve on our lighting inventory. He favors LEDs, I'm leaning towards getting an Arri kit: 2x 150s, 1x 300, 1x 650. The problem is trying to convince him that the Arri set is where we want to go. Other than the ability to resell and ability to rent out to others what other reasons can I use to convince him we should put all the money into a set of Arri lights instead of getting some more LEDs and may be some used Kinos? (his argument).
 
- The arris are more shapeable.... You can use the as hard, bounce or through silks. Try that with LEDs or kinos....
- The light spectrum is better. Atleast better than LEDs (check Guy Holts article on light and power).
- They are build like tanks
- The quality of light is better.

- only things really against tungsten fresnels are heat and power consumption.

If youre buying from EU check out Thomann.de. They sell brand new arris for only a little more than they go for on ebay. And remember... You can lamp down the 650w version with a 300w lamp.
 
You are getting by on cheap lights now.

If you dont perceive any problems with them then why pay for a premium brand?

S
 
1k on a generator in pouring rain for over two hours with no cover. True story. Trying doing that with a Large LED panel source.
 
No idea what type of stuff you shoot, but a Diva 400, 150w fresnel, 300w fresnel would cover a few bases and keep both of you happy.
 
it all depends on what kinds of things you shoot and environments you shoot in.

if you do mainly indoor corporate and retail. id stick with KINOs or LEDs simply because of the heat and power consumption issues.
if you do indie/feature work, then the arris are the better choice.

arris are much better than what you have, but not so much better that its going to radically change your workflow or deliverable. they also take more peripheral gear to shape and control. so if having lean sets is important to your needs, thats another kino/led plus.
 
The OP didn't mention what type of work they do mostly, so that is a consideration.

Flos have the advantage of being able to use both 5600 and 3200 tubes and provide very nice soft light for interviews or fill in a natural light interior.

Tungstens, and fresnels in particular, regardless of brand, are the most versatile, except not good for daylight situations.

I have a LED panel and love it for size, low power, battery options, but given the choice, I would go with tungstens, flos, or a combination of the two.

Grant
 
It's a tricky one. All advice given so far is good. I will add that resell value may dramatically change in the near future. Personally I prefer the quality of incandescent lighting (better fallout, shapable, better CRI), but I think it is on its way out (halogen bulbs are a waste of energy compared to fluorescent and LED). So a set of Arri tungsten fresnels may have little value in the next few years. Equally, I'm sure future LED lights (or Plasma, or whatever it may be) will perform much better than the current solutions (which have low CRI, poor reach, multiple shadows, difficult to shape...) so anything you buy will also decrease its value in the next couple of years. The Arri L Series is a massive improvement, but it's quite expensive for what it is.

Don't think so much about resell value and think about the type of work you do and practicality. I would personally go for a Kino Diva and a set of USED Arri fresnels (there are always up for sale on ebay). If you are getting the work you will surely make your money back with these. Personally I think LED are not quite there yet, so I would definitely wait another year or two before buying one.

Good luck,

D.
 
A Kino and a set of Dedo's (used if possible) is also a good option (Dedo's are built to last and have a lot of punch for their size), but again it all depends on the type of work you do.
 
morgan_moore said:
You are getting by on cheap lights now.

If you dont perceive any problems with them then why pay for a premium brand?

S
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The amount of light we have is fairly limited in what can actually be lit. For tight spaces these are fine but when we want to light outdoor scenes, especially at night (I know I need HMI's for large scale shots) but for mids and background ambience, I find that the lights are extremely limited. I'm go towards the premium brand because, 1. quality 2. reputation 3. because we can afford to splurge at this moment.
 
wgzn said:
it all depends on what kinds of things you shoot and environments you shoot in.

if you do mainly indoor corporate and retail. id stick with KINOs or LEDs simply because of the heat and power consumption issues.
if you do indie/feature work, then the arris are the better choice.
Click to expand...

We're doing features. The LEDs and practicals take care of the indoor stuff, we use a few china balls and black wrap to shape for the most part. We use the 750s against accent walls and surfaces to make backgrounds pop more. The Q60s really don't get used other than lighting out door spaces so we can work (can't seem to find an environment where they'd be effective.

wgzn said:
arris are much better than what you have, but not so much better that its going to radically change your workflow or deliverable. they also take more peripheral gear to shape and control. so if having lean sets is important to your needs, thats another kino/led plus.
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I know, quality equipement doesn't = quality product. I just think a kit of Arris will allow us to handle exterior shots better, an example that comes to mind is lighting a car from the outside during a night shoot. Or even a backyard for a party sequence (we stole this scene using white christmas lights hanging over head)
 
ggrantly said:
The OP didn't mention what type of work they do mostly, so that is a consideration.
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Narrative. We did a feature 2 years ago but the lighting was mostly rented. Since then we've gotten by on what we have for 2 music videos and a couple of short narratives.

ggrantly said:
Flos have the advantage of being able to use both 5600 and 3200 tubes and provide very nice soft light for interviews or fill in a natural light interior.

Tungstens, and fresnels in particular, regardless of brand, are the most versatile, except not good for daylight situations.
Click to expand...

For daylight situations, we've gotten by using bead/bounce boards.

ggrantly said:
I have a LED panel and love it for size, low power, battery options, but given the choice, I would go with tungstens, flos, or a combination of the two.

Grant
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the reason why I'm pushing for the Arris is that it will be tons more effective for the outdoor/large space locations. We scored a warehouse in Jersey city for shooting and I see the Arris being a big help here.
 
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RyanMKincaid said:
The amount of light we have is fairly limited in what can actually be lit. For tight spaces these are fine but when we want to light outdoor scenes, especially at night (I know I need HMI's for large scale shots) but for mids and background ambience, I find that the lights are extremely limited. I'm go towards the premium brand because, 1. quality 2. reputation 3. because we can afford to splurge at this moment.
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You can never afford to splurge - there is always other stuff to buy .. or save

You seem to be mixing/confusing two or three things - power, quntity and brand

Power can be had from anything even theatre cans

Quantity - more is available when you buy more cheap lights

Brand - if you are hauling and abusing the gear so the cheap stuff falls apart - or needing specific precision instruments for then brand items come to the fore

Today I shot a hotel - big spaces, deep corridors

In expanding my lighting I would tend to go for more rather than better after todays shoot - a Kino Celeb would have been pissing in the wind - a crate of theatre pars would not have been..

And four theatre pars bounced off a sheet will give a better quality of light than a Kino Celeb

Id look into some solid grip, but dont get me wrong - you wont go wrong with Arri, will be able to get spares and service and they work well..

S
 
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Hi, I didn't want to start a new thread so I am hoping this is a good spot for my question. I have a kino diva 400. I have some china balls and reflector lights. I am thinking of grabbing an arri 650. I read you can use a 300 bulb also in it. Is that a nice next piece of gear? Will the combo of the arri, kino, china balls and reflector lights allow me to light an interior pretty well? Or should I go bigger? After this purchase I won't be buying anything for a while (or so I think). Any advice? Thanks! I hear the arri and kino will mix alright, true? Thanks a bunch!
 
You can read all the pro and con about tungsten lighting vs other types, but if you are going tungsten, a 650 is one of your most useful sizes, regardless of brand. If you need less light, you can always scrim or down-size the bulb. The Arris are pretty well made, though Mole-Richardson gets a lot of love here.

Grant
 
ggrantly said:
You can read all the pro and con about tungsten lighting vs other types, but if you are going tungsten, a 650 is one of your most useful sizes, regardless of brand. If you need less light, you can always scrim or down-size the bulb. The Arris are pretty well made, though Mole-Richardson gets a lot of love here.

Grant
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Grant, thanks for the reply. So with the kino diva and some china balls and reflector lights, I can sort of light a small interior scene you think? Thanks.

Is this considered well lit? They used a bit more gear than what I would have. I tried searching the net for kino and arri combo examples to see how it looked. http://vimeo.com/43937274

Thanks.
 
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They lit for effect. For me, it is underexposed, but as is, it hides the flaws in the talent better when the makeup is applied.

For a small living room, with one or two people evenly lit, I'd probably start with a couple of 4 tube flos, and add a tungsten or two for a hair and or background light. Of course the big drawback of tungsten spectra is that daylight from windows can look wonky. A nice thing about flos is you can use daylight bulbs and complement with real daylight.

Of course you can gell tungsten to daylight, but it wastes a lot of light, easily turning a 650 into less than half.

Grant
 
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