Moving to L.A. - yes or no?

Mile Bozicevic

Mile Bozicevic

Well-known member
Reading ten tips from Tony Gilroy in another thread, I stumbled upon #9...

9. Don't live in Los Angeles

I don't think there is any reason to live there, I think LA is probably very bad for you. It's a bad place to feed your head.

In LA you are driving around all the time, surrounded by people who are making you depressed. I don't think Hollywood really helps a young writer feel any sense of romance about their life.

Even if it's a delusion, you want to feel special when you go to work in the morning.
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I'm aware there is no point moving to L.A. if writing skills are just good or mediocre. I mean, from what I can tell, one needs to be extremely skilled as a writer, and have a bit of luck/connections/whatever when he gets there in order to get a decent job as a writer. I don't have delusions of moving to L.A. soon (lack of writing experience/skill+language barrier), but I must admit - it does sound like this magical land where every mainstream filmmaker wants to go.

What are your thoughts? Some writers advice is "GO. MOVE TO L.A. ASAP.", while others are like Mr. Gilroy, telling writers to focus on writing, wherever they are.
I guess it depends on what you really want etc... but I'm curious to hear what someone who's (not) living there and makes a living as a writer has to say.
 
Have you ever visited? If you want to move there for the sake of the area and not just the networking then it's a great idea. But it isn't worth it just for work unless you've been noticed enough for work and need to move there to continue.
 
The thing to keep in mind re: Gilroy's advice is that 1. Gilroy grew up in the movie business, so having connections in that business, he can afford to live wherever he wants, and 2. Gilroy's been around as a professional writer for over two decades, so he's been able to live wherever he wants for a long time now, and his perspective might be a little skewed.

The thing about good writing is that you can't just write a brilliant script, put it in a parcel and send it off to LA while you continue writing in your ivory tower back in Toronto. At some point, you've got to get your feet wet in pitch meetings, generals, and that whole schmoozing thing that annoys the hell outta me. Most managers and agents won't sign you unless you're willing to come to LA. So no, you don't have to live in Los Angeles to write a great script, but if you want to have a great career, you're going to have to put in your time there sooner or later. There are glaring exceptions to this rule, but they only serve to prove it.

Terry Rossio once wrote a great article about this topic on Wordplay. The article is closing on a decade old, and things have changed a lot in the industry over the past ten years, but the general idea is still accurate, I believe.

From what I've read, and from people I've talked to in and out of Hollywood, the best route a writer can take seems to be living back home, writing great scripts, and then submitting. Once you get attention, that might be the best time to head out to LaLa Land, so you'll be just around the corner when an agent/manager/producer/dev exec asks if you can do lunch. The thing a lot of writers don't seem to understand is that this business isn't a spec market store. Specs are just auditions to get the open writing assignments, and in order to do that, you've got to be there, 100% dedicated to peddling your s--t to the studios. Unless, of course, you're a writing god and you somehow manage to get the studios to come crawling to you (ha!).

There's also the "move to LA, make connections in the mailroom, do my time as an assistant, get rep'd, make my break" formula, and that worked for a number of people I know, but if you want to play the game, your only real way in is great writing, and sometimes that's hard to do in LA. There's a lot of distractions out there. The biggest distraction for me, when I lived there, was getting bogged down by people who were going nowhere. My friend and I were both dedicated to being constantly active in filmmaking (he far more than I at the time), but for all the "everyone in Hollywood is a writer/director/actor" bulls--t you hear, 99% of them are just bus boys and department store workers who've got a hobby, and a dream with an expiration date. Nothing wrong with that, it's just easy to get dragged down into a dead-end life if you don't have razor focus and strict dedication.
 
Looking over my post, I think I should add something to clarify. I loved my time out in LA. It was depressing as hell sometimes, but there's absolutely nothing like the feeling of living in that city. The Santa Monica Pier was just a 3-mile walk from where I lived, and you can get just about anywhere with a buck-fifty and an hour to kill (if you don't mind riding a crowded metro bus). There's so many different cultures mingled into that place that it comes alive in a very real way. If only for the experience itself, I'd recommend living there for at least a little while some time in your life.
 
Nice responses!

@Cassius
I'm planning to visit L.A. soon, but just for a couple of days. To get a vibe of the place, so to speak.

@Eric
99% of them are just bus boys and department store workers who've got a hobby, and a dream with an expiration date.
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That's an interesting perspective - never really thought that way.

I agree with what both of you said. But...

I'm 27. Soon 28 :(
And. Time flies. Also, I'm not from Canada, but from Europe, Croatia. I moved to Canada for a year or so to write, learn, meet people, work on cool projects, master my English etc. - kind of a stepping stone before moving to L.A., if I'm ever going to do that.

If I could move to Toronto, I might as well move to L.A. I believe most important thing is to write and enjoy the process - and I truly do, but living as a writer where I come from... seems limited and borderline impossible (if you exclude TV soap operas writing). Also, English language. It will take me YEARS before I feel completely confident in it, and that is years spent writing and talking and thinking in it every day.

And what happens when I reach 35? Will there be any ounce of strength and willpower left to move around the world, just like that? I feel like I'm on some sort of time trial until I reach my 30's. :/
 
I moved here (L.A.) 3 years ago. The competition drove me to be a better writer. Also, it's not always about having work completed to show people here. The most successful work I've found came from meeting people of note and then hustling to get something done that would grab their individual attention. If you want to be a screenwriter and try to launch a career, I say come to L.A.
 
Mile Bozicevic said:
I'm 27. Soon 28 :(
And. Time flies. Also, I'm not from Canada, but from Europe, Croatia. I moved to Canada for a year or so to write, learn, meet people, work on cool projects, master my English etc. - kind of a stepping stone before moving to L.A., if I'm ever going to do that.
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Those are valid concerns. But 27 really isn't old for a writer, even by Hollywood standards, and while the fact that you're from Croatia may indeed put up a language barrier, remember that you have a unique and interesting background that will offer you a different perspective in a town that's swimming in a sea of white American men all offering the same take on the same old stories. I'm not saying use your cultural differences as a crutch or think that it somehow makes your writing automatically better, but it's definitely not a hindrance or a roadblock if you're able to find what makes your voice distinct, your experiences different from others. Most of the guys trying to make it in LA have never left the country, let alone grown up in Europe, then had the experience of uprooting oneself for a new home across the ocean.

Mile Bozicevic said:
If I could move to Toronto, I might as well move to L.A. I believe most important thing is to write and enjoy the process - and I truly do, but living as a writer where I come from... seems limited and borderline impossible (if you exclude TV soap operas writing). Also, English language. It will take me YEARS before I feel completely confident in it, and that is years spent writing and talking and thinking in it every day.

And what happens when I reach 35? Will there be any ounce of strength and willpower left to move around the world, just like that? I feel like I'm on some sort of time trial until I reach my 30's. :/
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For what it's worth, you have a surer mastery of English than 98% of people on the internet.

I've realized that my advice so far in this topic has been sort of middle-of-the-road. I don't like giving direct advice (such as "GO. MOVE TO L.A. ASAP."), but I'll offer two things:

If you decide to stay in Toronto much longer, don't let the resources and opportunities you have available to you go to waste. Toronto is a sizeable production hub, and you're just across the river from Detroit/Michigan, which is itself home to a decent industry (we've got Warner Bros' Superman/Batman starting filming here in February, and I think Errol Morris is shooting his narrative thriller here next year too).

http://www1.toronto.ca/staticfiles/...opment_and_culture/docs/currently_filming.pdf

On the other hand, obviously, there's a lot going on in LA, all the time. And I'd put stock in any advice vcassel gives -- one of the few on this board who's actually working as a screenwriter in Hollywood.

Whatever you decide, don't take anything too seriously, and remember that it's your writing that counts, regardless of where you came from or where you are.
 
Mile Bozicevic said:
Reading ten tips from Tony Gilroy in another thread, I stumbled upon #9...



I'm aware there is no point moving to L.A. if writing skills are just good or mediocre. I mean, from what I can tell, one needs to be extremely skilled as a writer, and have a bit of luck/connections/whatever when he gets there in order to get a decent job as a writer. I don't have delusions of moving to L.A. soon (lack of writing experience/skill+language barrier), but I must admit - it does sound like this magical land where every mainstream filmmaker wants to go.

What are your thoughts? Some writers advice is "GO. MOVE TO L.A. ASAP.", while others are like Mr. Gilroy, telling writers to focus on writing, wherever they are.
I guess it depends on what you really want etc... but I'm curious to hear what someone who's (not) living there and makes a living as a writer has to say.
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I think he may have been saying that in the context of what you need to do in your life to have something meaningful enough to say that you could make it as a writer. A mistake would be to move to LA before you're ready. LA, indeed, is not a place to find yourself and your inner voice.

That's my take on what he said, anyway.

There are certain things you'll need to be in LA for -- if you want to be on a writing staff, for example, it's where you need to be. But, there are many different types of writing.
 
Mile Bozicevic said:
Reading ten tips from Tony Gilroy in another thread, I stumbled upon #9...



I'm aware there is no point moving to L.A. if writing skills are just good or mediocre. I mean, from what I can tell, one needs to be extremely skilled as a writer, and have a bit of luck/connections/whatever when he gets there in order to get a decent job as a writer. I don't have delusions of moving to L.A. soon (lack of writing experience/skill+language barrier), but I must admit - it does sound like this magical land where every mainstream filmmaker wants to go.

What are your thoughts? Some writers advice is "GO. MOVE TO L.A. ASAP.", while others are like Mr. Gilroy, telling writers to focus on writing, wherever they are.
I guess it depends on what you really want etc... but I'm curious to hear what someone who's (not) living there and makes a living as a writer has to say.
Click to expand...

I always think it's an odd question.

Because if there's nothing stopping you, just go and see.

But if something is stopping you (kids etc), then you can't and why worry about it. Try and do it from wherever you are.
 
Mile, If I may substitute New York for LA, just by way of discussion; NY is where art is sold, not where it is created. There's probably an element of that to LA too. I hesitate to say something that would start disagreements, but some argue that there has never been a great band or novelist out of New York. They go there to sell. Often they don't even have to. Obviously it's not a place for starving artists to live anymore. Also, there are internets and affordable long-distance flights, which makes things different for writers.

Here's the other side: those of us a bit older had to decide to up and move somewhere as young men, in the absence of any substantial information about where we were headed. U mom slucaju, od NY-a do ex-YU. With the internet, there can be too much questioning, "researching," and vicariously experiencing things, which can keep you in a dark, computer-screen-lit cave in Canada. When you're a young man, you have to jump on your horse and go.

In either case, good luck.
 
Tony Gilroy had the advantage of being born into the business and having connections straight out of the womb.

I didn't. I wrote like crazy in my home town, and refused to move... until I sold a script. Okay, after selling a script to paramount, I moved to LA in my 30s... and realized all of the crap jobs I'd done up until then I could have done in LA, and been making accidental connections at the same time. You go to the grocery store here, and there's someone in the biz. I have coffee a few times a week with an actor you'd recognize. How do I know him? We frequent the same Starbucks. If you're here you just bump into people.

Also: 80 percent of screenwriting is meetings. You do generals, you go in to pitch your take on some project, you get called in because some other writer got drunk and they need pages written. You can't do that from out of town.

You *can* write anywhere. But eventually even Tony Gilroy ends up spending a bunch of time in Los Angeles.

I'd suggest you soak up as much of your home town/state/country culture as you can, so that you aren't just some generic writer... then think about moving.

Bill (wish I'd moved at 20)
 
wcmartell said:
Bill (wish I'd moved at 20)
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I don't know that it would have been 'better' having moved to LA at 20... my anecdotal vicarious experience is some number of friends moved to LA, with an eye to 'get into Hollywood', some even went to prestigious colleges, such as UCLA, but as yet, I've only found 2 on the Internet... one reference was a cook for the Mt Wilson Observatory... and another apparently moved to Monterey...

Needless to say, none are listed in IMDB... I am, for a short film I made a few years ago, and submitted via withoutabox, and was accepted for the fest... but not them...

In several cases the juggling of 'idiot job' and 'getting film gigs' burned them out with in a few years. I lost track of them in the late 70's, so I don't know what happened other than they didn't get into Hollywood... (I really don't know how people can really do the 'idiot job' and attempt to break in... just getting from one place to another is a 2 hour at the minimum exercise in many situations... which leads to being fired from most idiot jobs, if one is 'late' trying to get from one place to another... perhaps a string of idiot jobs...).
 
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