Mole HMI

dlang

dlang

Well-known member
OK new to HMI's completely. I was wondering if anyone knew anything about this light

Mole Richardson 4000W HMI Solar-Arc with Type 6275 Mole solar ballast

I love mole fresnels and I know they're reputable, but how about this HMI. Is 4000 watts overkill? Also I know HMI's draw less power per watt, so how many amps would this things take to run? Thanks in advance....oh and look at this thing, it's enormous!! Is this an old clunker??

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Uh, you have that one wrong. HMI's put out more light per watt, but a watt is a watt is a watt. It is a unit of power. So, 4000w HMI is going to be drawing the exact same amount of power (4000w) as a 4000w Tungsten. The big difference is that the HMI will put out about 4 times as much lumens. So to run this, you'd need close to 40amps.
 
So this will throw out 16,000 lumens?? whew that's alot of light. thanks for clearing that up. So now that that's established any comments on the actual unit itself.
 
I don't know the lumens, but buying used HMIs can have risk involved. That looks exactly like one on ebay right now, are you buying or selling or is that just a coincedence. Anyway you have to look at the hours on the ballast, thats whats going to cost you the money to either get repaired or replaced, yeah I know bulbs are expensive too, but if you've ever had a ballast repaired you know what I'm talking about. Moles are great lights and usually worth the money, but an HMI I wouldn't buy it unless I knew the owner or I had a chance to check over myself.

As for the throw, I've used 2.5K and 4K HMI fresnels many times, if your trying to fill in sun light and bounce won't do you usally need a lot of punch. Every light has its use and you'll find plenty for this workhorse.

Goodluck.
 
dlang said:
So this will throw out 16,000 lumens?? whew that's alot of light. thanks for clearing that up. So now that that's established any comments on the actual unit itself.
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16000 lumens is the equivalent of an 800 watt fresnel. That's nothing compared to this monster you dug up. Try 380,000 lumens. Here's a link to the bulb it probably uses:

http://www.bulbman.com/index.php?main_page=product_bulb_info&cPath=5399&products_id=10854

380,000 lumens is the equivalent of a 19,000w fresnel. Let's see. A 19,000 watt fresnel draws--19,000 watts! On a 220v circuit that would be 86 amps. On a 110 that would be 172 amps (or almost the equivalent of the maximum total capacity of the service going into an average house).

If you run your 4000w HMI on 220v then it draws 18 amps or 36 amps at 110v. Both of these solutions are out of the range of the normal indy production because of their power requirements. You'd need a good studio with the normal kind of power service they have to do this right--or a really big generator.

By the way, that's a magnetic ballast on that unit and it's far from guaranteed to be flicker free at all shutter settings/frame rates.
 
ahh you've exposed the limitations of my technical knowledge(: thanks so much guys for clearing that up. Yes this is the one on ebay and the price is really inexpensive, so I thought it was worth looking into to. Thanks again ya'll
 
That's what the forum is for to learn. So there aren't any dumb questions, but its definitely best to ask this kind of stuff before you order it or you end up with an expensive thing that sits in the garage. Just remember, anything that draws over about 1200 watts is going to be tough to run in normal household environments.
 
Richard, today a guy tried to tell me that a 1.2kw HMI with an electronic ballast will draw 19amps whilst a 1.2kw HMI with a magnetic ballast will only draw about 13amps. That seems like baloney, but then again, I've never owned an HMI. Thoughts?
 
Hmm. Not sure where he got that. If anything I would believe the magnetic to draw a bit more while underdriving the bulb a bit. A magnetic is always a bit dimmer than an equivalent electronic and less efficient. The electronic ballasts drive the bulb to maximum output and also seem to be more efficient too so I don't see how that could be true. I calculate normal draw is about 11 amps at 110v for an electronic one and perhaps the same for a magnetic or just a bit more.

You should see the Arri 1200w clone when I power it up with an electronic ballast or when I power it up with a magnetic one--a world of difference in light output. One day I discovered just how efficiently the parabolic mirror has been optimized on this baby and how intense the light is. I had a sample huge soft light fixture carrying case made out of black cordura nylon about 5 feet away from the 1200w par.

I powered up the par to do a test of a new 110/220v e-ballast and pointed the par at different things. Couldn't believe the light output and how bright it was. I pointed it at the area where the bag was to see how it performed on dark black objects and had to go to the phone for a moment. When I came back, the velcro hand strap around the case was smoking. Ahh! So much for Cool Lights. Don't try this at home...
 
Oh of course. Especially hot restrike types. I was referring to the running part after the strike which is just a momentary thing. So its true you have to rate a circuit for the pulse but I haven't found most household circuits to be problematic for the startup of a 1200w.
 
That's an old mole-richardson 4k hmi with magnetic ballast (as apposed to the more modern electronic ballasts) with bates cable. You can't plug this into your house. It takes a double ended (NOT SINGLE) hmi globe which can be found available at Studio Depot, which is Mole-Richardson's expendable store;
http://www.studiodepot.com/store/index.cgi?cmd=view_item&parent=&id=58731

4000w / 120v = 33.3 AMPS... + 20% power factor = 39.96Amps... For Magnetic Ballast, which are less efficient, it is possible to pull 42Amps

HMIs don't draw less power per watt.

A great source of information on HMIs, electricity and all things set lighting is the 'Set Lighting Technician's Handbook'.


You can try and ask mole to send you some material on this lamp by calling 323-851-0111
 
Regardless of the bulb being single ended or double ended (because thats a moot point--they both usually put out the same exact amount of output for any given wattage type), it still has a 380,000 lumen output. It may not "draw less power per watt" (which doesn't mean anything anyway as the unit for measuring actual power draw is the "watt") but it does draw less power per lumen of output; thus puts out more light per watt drawn then tungsten by a factor of at least 4. Lumen output is actually more descriptive than "watt" for describing light output.

http://www.donsbulbs.com/cgi-bin/r/b.pl/hid%7Chmi%7C4000w%7Cgs.html
 
If you have to ask if you need this kind of light then it's going to be overkill. I have 3 hmi's all bron kobolds, an 800, 400, and a 200. The 800 is saved for when i really have to fight the sun for network quality standups. 4000w HMI is for making real movies as you'd have to have a tie in and generator or a real power setup. Good luck. I'd try and find some older 575w lights with a magnetic ballast if you want to get in the world of HMI's. Once you get one you'll find out how wonderful they are but its expensive...
 
You don't need this light. I have a 2.5 K HMI and a2.5K HMI PAR on the high end as well as a couple 1.2Ks and a couple 575s. Plenty 'o light.

My DP had a 4K arrisun that he sold because he never used it. And this guy worked all the time.
 
Well Richard, I guess I should add that if the light is a radical bargain, I wouldn't pass it up. But I wouldn't go looking for it either.

Remindsme of the first light I bought, and still have. A 2K Mole Junior. I put it in my living room, where my camera was set up. I wanted to film a little short. I turn the thing on, and......holy **** this thing throws off tons of light everywhere - and the heat just about burned a hole in the cieling!!!!

I said to myself - I need smaller lights. Funny, when you don't know, bigger is better.
 
Skip it, unless your starting a lighting/grip rental company. Even then, if I was your client and wanted to rent it, I would have my doubts as to trust it's reliability in the first place.
 
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taormina said:
Well Richard, I guess I should add that if the light is a radical bargain, I wouldn't pass it up. But I wouldn't go looking for it either.

Remindsme of the first light I bought, and still have. A 2K Mole Junior. I put it in my living room, where my camera was set up. I wanted to film a little short. I turn the thing on, and......holy shi* this thing throws off tons of light everywhere - and the heat just about burned a hole in the cieling!!!!

I said to myself - I need smaller lights. Funny, when you don't know, bigger is better.
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Yes, even a 2K is ridiculously big for most indy production work. And yes that light is a great bargain but you wouldn't use it inside, its for outside work and the power problems are the worst. Plus even a 2K has some powering problems in the USA. It is possible to use a 2K in a household in much of the rest of the world though given their use of 240vAC and therefore lower amp draw
 
Richard,
Ok here's another newb question for you. your 575W HMI's....do they work well outdoors? Can you use them as say a fill in direct sunlight?
 
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