mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!!!!!

M

mroczkowski83

Member
hi everyone
I have a major broblem over here. Im trying to produce a feature lenght movie which will be shot at night half the time. Mostly in a small town, woods, and dark rooms. Proper lighting is extremely important and the film must look great. I am planning on using the DVX100A 24p camera with a mini35 set up which will run at around $5500 for renting on a 3 week shoot. I have to be absolutely sure that all those night scenes are shot properly and look great but this is video im dealing with and i dont know about all the issues such as video noise. Is this at all possible and doable with this camera and the mini 35 setup. Let me remind you that the scenes must be symbolizing night and light must look like as if it is coming from the moon. sorry, im not a DP but do need to know if this type of camera is appropriate for this. thank you my fellow film community. please reply.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

d00d...BUY the camera!
It's only $3300!
also, I'm not sure, but the min35 setup might, as with traditional cameras, require MORE light because of the lens.

I personally have not had success (at least I haven't yet been satisfied) with my low light interiors...I think the thing to do might be to light your scene and then close down the iris or increase your shutter speed, and take advantage of the darkness that way...kind of like day for night....
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

if you're going to rent all that for 5500, I suggest just buying the camera like hillcity said...

you'll still have 2200 extra to spend on a mini35 (or maybe build one?)

but night lighting is tricky... can't help you on that :-/
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

i can pick the camera up for as low as $1600 but the rental houses tell me that the mini35 is $12,000 so i even need to get $600 of insurance on it. are you saying that i can get a mini 35 setup for a few hundred dollars and it will give me the same result as P+S mini35?
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

[quote author=mroczkowski83 link=board=news;num=1109394861;start=0#3 date=02/25/05 at 23:02:34]i can pick the camera up for as low as $1600 but the rental houses tell me that the mini35 is $12,000 so i even need to get $600 of insurance on it. are you saying that i can get a mini 35 setup for a few hundred dollars and it will give me the same result as P+S mini35?[/quote]

If you spend 1600.00 on a DVX100a that is brand new...you just made one travelling scammer very happy.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

if you goto nextag.com or A and M,a and m is selling it for $1550 but it must be a gray market version. on e-bay you can get it for $2500 brand new. what do you think.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

The best way to shoot a night scene in the woods for me, and I think a lot of people is shoot Day for Night......Since you basically get what you see on video, adjust the iris to get the best look, then add a touch of blue in post....Oh, also go to www.resellerratings.com..punch in A&M to see what consumers are saying. I would suggest you be sitting when you read some of the consumers comments that shopped at a&m
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

quick question
will the day for night setup look really good. i want to be able to get the best possible image comparable to what i see in the movies.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

use a 650watt light with full CTB.

put it on a lightstand and put it up on the highest point and sandbag it.
night scene ;D
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

[quote author=mroczkowski83 link=board=news;num=1109394861;start=0#7 date=02/26/05 at 14:15:09]quick question
will the day for night setup look really good. i want to be able to get the best possible image comparable to what i see in the movies.[/quote]

Unfortunatly no.....
But that's where hopefully your story will kick in. If it's a good story, the audience won't care....
Some big budget movies, to this day, do day for night. I as an audience can always tell. I'm sure most can....
My suggestion as a filmmaker is concentrate on your story. Don't worry too much about technique. If you have a great story, you've achived something that's hardly done right....
I've seen a lot of very low budget movies get picked up by major studios that had poor lighting, but great human emotion..
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

thanks zordon
I believe i do have a great original story and that is why i was worried because some grainy noisy long night scene might ruin it. but if you are saying that day for night will do the trick than im going forward with this. thanks guys
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

If you buy the camera you can experiment before hand and see what works better for you, that would be my suggestion. I've filmed things at night with the DVX with just a few small lights and the quality was decent as far as grain is concerned, but trees and sky were just black, no detail whatsoever. You can tell when things are filmed during the day and darkened in post, but you can get some really cools looks with all the great software that is out there. I agree that the story and acting can carry a film, but it's nice to have it looking great too.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

I agree with all above. Buy the camera. But I also believe using the Mini 35 adapter is a lot of horsing around and if your not a skilled DP, or working with a non skilled DP, that mini 35 adapter could cost you more time and money then it's worth. And to be fair, even a skilled DP will tell you, there is alot of tweaking to get it just right. Remeber, you have to look at the limitations of any media your working with and work within them. As for night scenes, lighting is the most important, no doubt, but what does the story tell you to do? Do you have a production designer? Maybe you can incorporate pracs such as lanters, campfires, ect. Or, like some one said above, day for night. 2 hours before sunset and 30 min after does the trick too. I don't know what your story is so those are things I'm just throwing out. I guess what I'm trying to say is, save the money that you would of spent on the 35 adapter and put it in a place that will give you a better return (I.E. lighting, extra crew people, extra lens rentals such as a 2x extender ect.) Good luck on your shoot!!!!
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

I haven't had the problem myself, but understand that the DVX has some real pixelation / blooming issues in contrasty blue highlights.

Normally, I'd 1/4 - 1/2 CTB a few appropriately-sized fixtures and throw some light on whatever I wanted to see in the otherwise "black" nighttime shot and be done with it.

With the DVX blue pixelation bloom I'd be really careful about levels - might just be a matter of crushing your shot a bit and not allowing any highlights to zebra out too hard.

That makes your work a little harder in balancing your primary subject within the frame, but those blue highlights are something to consider after what I've seen posted here.

Day for night never looks good in my opinion - especially when you allow clouds and sky to creep into the shot. You might well pull off a shot or two if you keep it below the horizon and cc toward blue spectrum in post.

e
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

You are going out to shoot a feature film over three weeks so do a test with the camera to learn its capability and what the look will be like. Have a play and learn at the same time like the pros do.

Advice :Know your tools before you start or you are going to get some very big and expensive surprises.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

just wanted to add that i'm not a dp and i will be hiring one. I will also be hiring a PD. I do need the mini35 because without it everything looks too flat to me. that adapter changes perception completely. If i'll be going to get investors to pay for this and hire all the right crew, im ging with the intention to sell a film not play a film game. but like you guys said, everything has to be tested. Ill have to blow the money and get the mini 35 and equipment a couple of days earlier so that we can figure eveything out before shooting. o well, thats life.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Dude where's my camera? That's what you're going to be saying if you don't buy it! BUY THE CAMERA forget the mini 35 buy the anamorphic! you'll be satisfied there's no sense of renting it and there's no guarantee you'll make your money back off the film.
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

sorry artistian can't do that. My process is this, I prepare for a film 6 months ahead of time, get a great script, get investors and hire a great crew, make a great film and try to sell it. I don't bother with shorts of experimental, no plot stories. If you want to succeed in this type of industry then you get serious. Great cinematography will add beauty and a sense of story in the film. If i will get more money, i wont even think about getting a DVX. I'll go with HD. I hear peoplemaking films for $50. sure its low but the film looks like crap and it wont sell. No one will take you seriously untill you mean business. Percise, did'nt people on this site post that the anamorphic adapter is useless and the change should be done in post? however popping 35mm lenses on the dvx looks beautiful from what i have seen.

too many people making cheap crappy films. i don't want to be in that crowd. I want a glamorous career dammit :P
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

o yea nad another note. i was once cutting tiles to help out a carpenter friend of mine. He once told me "what ever you do, do it right" you get my point. I understand the dirty side of this industry and that i can loose the money but guess what. if you do it right than at least u got a chance. if you goof around with a camera and a couple of friends then they will squash yyou like a bug at sundance. You still spent a lot of time and money making a film except yours sucks and the next guy's get sold. get it? lets be a bit more positive here. :P
 
Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

Re: mini DV 24p SHOOTING AT NIGHT VERY IMPORTANT!!

As a DP i would say talk to your DP about this stuff first. If he worked with Mini35 before and knows his **** he would have something to say about loosing 2 f-stops with the adapter (so you have to pour **** load more light). Stuff shot with standard lens looks flat becaue it was lit in flat way and composed akwardly. Chcek out Polanski's "Knife in the Water" -- whole film shot with one wide lens -- everything is in focus buy it looks spectacular because of inventive framing and good lighting.

Mini35 is an overkill in my opinion. I would rather take the money i rent out more lights to make those nights really spectacular (BTW, i love to shoot at night).
 
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