Mics for music

[StayNuts]

Live music performances is the main subject I film... to capture the sound, I link my Apple to the mixer board & use the line out to record the performance... at home, I dub the sound over with the computer...

now I like to record with my camera also a good sound... which mic I can use the best for general live performances... one or two mics? And how to set them up on the location, high, low....

my plan is not to buy the x000's mics as I still use the digital recording with the apple...

any advice is very welcome...
thx

 

[David W. Richardson]

If your camera can handle mics that require phantom power, then I had good results recording live music using Samson C03's.

What I didn't have so much luck with was connecting my recorder to the house mixing board. The mixer is balanced to give the right sound for the acoustics of the room and the placement of the speakers in that room -- the mix comes out sounding all wrong when piped straight into a recorder. That may not always be the case, but it certainly was the night I tried it.

Good luck!

 

[David W. Richardson]

BTW, I used a Zoom H4 for recording that project. Nice little audio recorder that's probably a lot smaller and more portable than your Apple. Records to SD memory cards using either the built-in mics or external mics -- either XLR or 1/4" plugs. Switchable phantom power too. Very handy, and priced under $300.

 

[saneproductions]

check out this

www.taperssection.com

 

[StayNuts]

BTW, I used a Zoom H4 for recording that project. Nice little audio recorder that's probably a lot smaller and more portable than your Apple. Records to SD memory cards using either the built-in mics or external mics -- either XLR or 1/4" plugs. Switchable phantom power too. Very handy, and priced under $300.

And these Samson's are cheap too... hmmm that is try worth... any suggestions how to place these mics, on a standard in front of the stage and which height? Or do you mount to your camera or a pole?
thx

 

[SMuir]

And these Samson's are cheap too... hmmm that is try worth... any suggestions how to place these mics, on a standard in front of the stage and which height? Or do you mount to your camera or a pole?
thx

It all depends on what part of the sound you're trying to capture.

An X-Y stereo pair at the audience's point-of-view facing the stage is probably a good start. To fill in some of the detail and articulation, you can mix in a dry feed from the sound-reinforcement mixer.

A pair of spaced omni's can add further depth, and fill out the crowd a bit.

The more tracks you can record, the better: if you can get the sound-reinforcement mixer to send you a set of four feeds (eg. L/R drums, Guitars, vocals), then you will be able to re-ballance the mix for your own benefit.

 

[StayNuts]

It all depends on what part of the sound you're trying to capture.

An X-Y stereo pair at the audience's point-of-view facing the stage is probably a good start. To fill in some of the detail and articulation, you can mix in a dry feed from the sound-reinforcement mixer.

A pair of spaced omni's can add further depth, and fill out the crowd a bit.

The more tracks you can record, the better: if you can get the sound-reinforcement mixer to send you a set of four feeds (eg. L/R drums, Guitars, vocals), then you will be able to re-ballance the mix for your own benefit.

Can I put these mics in the middle of the stage and pointing the right one to the left & the left one to the right? And on which height is it best to do... love to keep them so low as possible, better for the band... but afraid that the mics will record more bass...

On the moment I record the dry-feed from the mixer directly into my apple using a MIDI interface. At home I remix the tracks, add soms reverb if necessary & sub it over the video tape. I split the XLR inputs with a splitter. Do you have a another solution, now I have always reconnect everything...

Most times is it no problem to connect it to the sound-mixer... but some bars and clubs don't allow to link something to there mixer... in those cases I want to use these mics... thinking also to add one mic to capture the sound of the public on a seperate track...

has anyone good experience with those Samson's connect to the camera with a wireless system, or is still the best solution to use wires.... and what kind of wireless system is then best to use...

thx...
( sorry for many questions )

 

[David W. Richardson]

The beauty of having the Zoom H4 is that you can connect mics like the Samsons to your camera, and connect the H4 to the mixer board. That will give you the dry feed that SMuir mentioned. Mix it all together in post and you'll have a pretty decent sound. Adding things like the Omnis will make your sound more robust.

 

[SMuir]

If you can't connect to the sound-reinforcement mixer (or the mixer outputs are full of line noise), used a dynamic mic like the Shure SM-57 to close-mic the speaker stack for that dry sound.

You'll probably want to keep your mics off the stage, unless you're micing specific instruments in the absence of sound reinforcement. The stereo pair I mentioned is ideally somewhere near the middle of the audience, facing the stage. If that's not practical, put the stereo mics on a stand with a long boom and a counterweight. Set the stand up close by your camera tripod (to minimize the "footprint" of your setup), extend the boom out as far as is proctical, and fly it up over the audience's heads.

Get a "stereo bar" to hold the two "audience" mics in a phase-accurate stereo configuration. X-Y coincident is pobably the easiest. For more information, read http://www.tape.com/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/Bartlett_Articles/stereo_microphone_techniques.html?L+cassette+nqna2923+995498793

You'll probably end up with three tracks: two "audience" mics, and one "dry" mixer feed (or PA system mic). If you're using an audio interface with three or more tracks, then you're golden. If you only have stereo inputs on your Mac, then you'll need a production mixer (eg. SD 302, SD 442, Shure FP-33). Mix the stereo "audience" mics hard left and hard right, and keep the "dry" track to the centre of your stereo image.

I strongly advise against using Wireless transmitters for any of these tasks. The dynamics of a live performance can play havoc with the tranmitter's compander settings: the last thing you'll want is to have to run up to the speaker you've mic'd and turn down the transmitter's level because it's just feeding you distortion. Keep everything wired, and tape down all your cables propperly.