Low output level while using Rode HS1 headset

S

sleroux

Member
Hi everyone,

While using the Rode HS1 headset microphone connected through the Micon-5 XLR adaptor to an Art USB Dual Pre mic preamp set on +40dB gain (almost the max), I still have to boost the amplitude by +5/+10 dB on postprod in order to reach a level equivalent to the one obtained with our reference mic (a Rode Podcaster). But, by doing so, I increase the noise (both electronic and environmental) at the same time to unacceptable level.

So, I have two questions:
1) Were such low level expected from the HS1? Or do I have to suspect some problem with my mic preamp?
2) Would I have notably better signal/noise ratio by using directly a preamp capable of +55/+60dB gain? Or do I have to stay with the current setup, counting only on a noise-removal filter to "clean up" the audio track?


The long story:
I have to shoot vocational training videos showing a technician performing various electronics/computer related tasks. Some footages are done at the technician workbench, while other show him installing various equipments on location. The set is particularly noisy with the hum and beeps of many electronic devices. We have to capture the comments of the technician "live" since the talent won't be available for any kind of re-recording afterward.

For the video part we will use a consumer-grade camcorder. As for the audio, using a microphone on a boom pole was not an option for practical reasons. A shotgun won't be adequate as for some tasks the technician will be back to the camera or even moving off-camera. We thought a Lav would have done the job, but some tests using a low quality one showed it capturing too much environmental noise (notably when the technician was using tools). Moreover, the results were not very consistent, depending of the movements of the technician's head and arms. We finally decided to use a headset microphone in order to have the capsule as close as possible of the technician mouth, still allowing him a full freedom of movement. Since we cannot afford (nor require) a wireless system, the mic is wired to a mic preamp providing +48V phantom power. We chose the Rode HS1 based on good reviews incl. the video review by Chad Johnson (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfhkjgS6KOY) were that mic sounds high and clear when connected directly both to a Sony EX1 camera or a Sony D-50 audio recorder. As a matter of fact, much higher than what I currently obtain. That's why I'm wondering if it is normal to have to somehow turn the gain up to +45/+50dB to reach comparable levels.

- Sylvain
 
First, thank you Steve for your interest.

I'm recording on a laptop by using the Art USB dual pre internal A/D converter (the Art device is both a mic preamp and an USB interface).

To make things a little bit more clear (I hope), I currently have to set the analog gain on the Art device to +40dB and later boost again the digital audio stream on my laptop by something like +10dB to reach not even full scale signal.

I never used a headset before, so I was wondering if a total gain of +50dB was something I should have expected first, or if there is definitively something odd with my setup.
 
You shouldn't be aiming for full-scale for your original recording. Speech levels should be averaging about -12dBFS with the peak-reading meters found in most recording software.

There's nothing to be done about the increase in environmental noise when you boost the gain ... the ratio of environment to speech at the mic capsule is what it is and no change in gain up or down will affect that. Make sure the mic is positioned as close to the talent's mouth as possible - right at the corner of the mouth where the lips meet - and they're talking at a normal level. Monitor as you record to make sure they're not mumbling.

I've seen some online discussions of flakey MiCon XLR connectors. Perhaps a visit to your dealer is in order to see if swapping it for another unit helps.
 
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Does the mic have a micon 5 or a micon 3 ?

If it has a micon 5 than I would suspect that the conversion to 3-pin XLR may be suspect if that is now you are getting into the pre amp.

If it is a micon 3 I would still check the pin to pin wiring or the micon 5 to XLR adaptor may not be correct.

I am not familiar with the pre amp but I would check the interfacing as a micon 5 is not a usual connector for a three conductor mic cable.

I suspect that you need a micon 3 to XLR adaptor and not a micon 5 to XLR adaptor as the wiring may be different.
 
Thank you both Steve and Gary for your advices!

@Steve: As a matter of fact, the output signal of the HS-1 with analog gain set at +40dB on my preamp reach currently -7.6dBFS (Peak, not RMS). So, I'm above the -12dBFS you mentioned. I was fooled because until now, for our other videos, we only used voice-over with speech levels around -4 dBFS (Peak). I don't know why it was set that high on the first time. Maybe the lack of knowledge of that -12dBFS rule. Or simply because the Rode Podcaster used was set "like that" and that was "good enough". Did I mentioned we mostly are newbies here? I think I still have to learn a lot in order to produce quality videos! :tongue:

@Gary: I use a Micon-5. But, as I said above, after all, the output level is not as low as I thought first when the preamp gain is turned almost to its max. Anyway, you gave me something to think about. I took the time to measure a few things with a multimeter. I don't think the Micon-5 itself is faulty, but, measuring the XLR mic input of my Art preamp, I found that whereas it is sold for +48V phantom power, it barely reaches +36V. When fed at that level, out of the Micon-5 to the HS-1 itself, I only have +4V [whereas Rode specs let assume it should be around +5V for "true" P48: "All measurements are calculated when powered at 5V or P48 (RØDE XLR adaptor)"].

However, I don't really know how powering the capsule at +4V instead of +5V does impact the sound. Does it have consequences on the capsule sensibility or other characteristics?
 
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GaryNattrass said:
Does the mic have a micon 5 or a micon 3 ?

...I suspect that you need a micon 3 to XLR adaptor and not a micon 5 to XLR adaptor as the wiring may be different.
Click to expand...
Quoting the Rode website "The MiCon-5 is designed to connect to a standard 3 pin XLR, with P48 phantom power" while the MiCon-3 is used to connect the mic to a Shure wireless transmitter. The MiCon-5 is the correct connector. The '-5' does not mean it's a 5-pin XLR. In addition, the MiCon-3 is a female mini XLR while the MiCon-5 is a male XLR ... the '-3' wouldn't even physically fit into the preamp's mic input.
 
Sorry for any confusion but I know there are five and three pin small XLR type connectors and I thought that may have been the problem.

I tend not to use them much but my AKG guitar radio system has a three pin type as an input but my Twelco mixer has a three and a five pin type for outputs.
 
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