Looking to Upgrade Shotgun Mics... What do you guys use?

Z

zackhosseini

Member
I do mostly narrative films and I have a small budget of $300 for a new shotgun microphone, maybe $400. I have a friend who is an audio engineer and he does a lot of the sound work for me and mentors me as well. I've been using a Rode NTG-2 and he complains about the quality of the audio a lot.


We've agreed I should upgrade and I keep hearing throughout the circles that the NTG-3 is a great mic, while my friend still says compared to the Sennheiser ME67 for example, it doesn't sound as good. He keeps telling me anything Rode isn't going to be very good and Sennheiser makes all around better mics. (His main complaint regarding the Rode mics, and he may have watered this down for my understanding, is that there are some mid frequencies that are louder due to a bad capsule that produces a lot of unwanted and unneeded ambiance.)


So you see my dilemma. What do you fellas think? How's the Rode NTG-3? Is the Sennheiser ME67 better? What do you guys recommend?? I understand a good amount about audio, but when it comes to purchasing mics and stuff, I can never make the decisions myself because I'm not 100% familiar with everything. So just looking for some more knowledgeable assistance here.
 
Rode NTG-3 is a great mic, but it runs around $700.

Given your budget you should take a look at the Sennheiser MKE600, it's a new mic that came out last year, and it's a nice step up from the Rode NTG-2. The MKE600 sells for $400.
 
Here's a mic shootout that invovles the MKE 600 and the ME 64 (which is more of an on camera or dialogue mic)

https://vimeo.com/54540728

There isn't a lot of choice in the price range you are looking.

The problem with mics below a $1000 is primarily noise floor. I think you will find dollar for dollar Sennheiser microphones have a lower noise floor than other mics in their price range especially in lower end.

Unfortunately most of the audio tests you here on the internet do not go out of their way to show you noise floor issues. The lower the noise floor the easier it will be to do audio processing to sweeten the sound.

Have you looked into renting or borrowing before you buy?
 
"The lower the noise floor the easier it will be to do audio processing to sweeten the sound."
-- In a perfect world. Most location sound recording do not offer a perfect or even good recording environment like a recording studio would. A lot depends on the recording itself, BG noise, ect.
 
I'm not sure that what your guy is saying makes a lot of sense. But he may, as you said, have dumbed it down. Going by his description I'm not sure your going to get an improvement that is worth the cost. I haven't used the NTG3 but I have used the NTG2 a couple of times and I didn't feel it was picking up a bunch of extra ambience. But you don't get a lot of options in the low price range so I'm not sure you will get a lot of improvement. I suspect that better booming would make more of a difference but?

If you are using it indoors then he might be talking about the effect of using an interference tube mic in bouncy environments. Some shotguns because of the design do better in those situations. I don't think the ME67 would fair any better though. And it's out of your price range since it's around $600 for the capsule and power unit.

If what he is talking about is the "indoor issue" mentioned above then adding a hypercardioid mic to your kit is probably a better choice, and a more affordable one also.
 
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Oh and I would disagree strongly with his opinion on Rode, they make some very nice mics and I have used a few Sennheisers that I didn't think sounded that great. I think any company that makes some "affordable" mics is going to have some that don't sound great to some people.
 
Noiz2 said:
I'm not sure that what your guy is saying makes a lot of sense. But he may, as you said, have dumbed it down. Going by his description I'm not sure your going to get an improvement that is worth the cost. I haven't used the NTG3 but I have used the NTG2 a couple of times and I didn't feel it was picking up a bunch of extra ambience. But you don't get a lot of options in the low price range so I'm not sure you will get a lot of improvement. I suspect that better booming would make more of a difference but?

If you are using it indoors then he might be talking about the effect of using an interference tube mic in bouncy environments. Some shotguns because of the design do better in those situations. I don't think the ME67 would fair any better though. And it's out of your price range since it's around $600 for the capsule and power unit.

If what he is talking about is the "indoor issue" mentioned above then adding a hypercardioid mic to your kit is probably a better choice, and a more affordable one also.
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Hi Zac, I read your other thread about your high school drama film and from that I'd say, Scott is spot on, your boom op does need more experience, because Rode have sold many thousands of NTG-2 shotguns used for exactly what you're shooting, outdoors that is.

The NTG-3 is a step up and one of its big advantages for your boom op would be, it has a slightly wider pickup pattern than most other shotguns. Even so, he has to pay more attention to the action, get in closer to the voices .. that'll result in a better signal to noise ratio for a start. And a teenager holding a boom up for a couple of hours, give him/her more breaks?

Might be worth finding out if a pro boom op can come along and provide some help.

Cheers.
 
Allan Black said:
Hi Zac, I read your other thread about your high school drama film and from that I'd say, Scott is spot on, your boom op does need more experience, because Rode have sold many thousands of NTG-2 shotguns used for exactly what you're shooting, outdoors that is.

The NTG-3 is a step up and one of its big advantages for your boom op would be, it has a slightly wider pickup pattern than most other shotguns. Even so, he has to pay more attention to the action, get in closer to the voices .. that'll result in a better signal to noise ratio for a start. And a teenager holding a boom up for a couple of hours, give him/her more breaks?

Might be worth finding out if a pro boom op can come along and provide some help.

Cheers.
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I would agree that I'd like to use a more experienced boom op. in the future. The one I'm using right now does have a good amount of experience as an audio engineer (he's in college, I don't know him from school, I met him when I was out on a job directing a commercial). He's an engineer at North Point Ministries, which has some extremely large productions. But as I've been working with him, I've began to realize most of the knowledge he has is on the musical side of audio engineering and not necessarily film.

Would ProductionHub be a reliable place to find crew members such as a boom operator? If not, where do you suggest I look?
 
Zac, if your current op is worth his salt, he'll want to improve his act and get better results, but you have to assess that.

If he can't hear the boom mic with h/phones will make it hard for him, and you need to have phones too.

Fix all that and if it's still not better, try a local commercal film outfit or TV outlet.

Cheers.
 
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What makes a mic sound "the best" is completely subjective, and everyone will give you a different opinion, so when someone says "such and such mic is the best", you really have to take that with a grain of salt. What matters is what sounds good to you. Given your budget, I really don't see a big improvement (unless you are using a built in mic on a camera). You'd probably need to up your budget to around $1000 to get a high quality mic, BUT, even a lower quality mic in the hands of a skilled boom op can sound good.
 
zackhosseini said:
I do mostly narrative films and I have a small budget of $300 for a new shotgun microphone, maybe $400. I have a friend who is an audio engineer and he does a lot of the sound work for me and mentors me as well. I've been using a Rode NTG-2 and he complains about the quality of the audio a lot.


We've agreed I should upgrade and I keep hearing throughout the circles that the NTG-3 is a great mic, while my friend still says compared to the Sennheiser ME67 for example, it doesn't sound as good. He keeps telling me anything Rode isn't going to be very good and Sennheiser makes all around better mics. (His main complaint regarding the Rode mics, and he may have watered this down for my understanding, is that there are some mid frequencies that are louder due to a bad capsule that produces a lot of unwanted and unneeded ambiance.)


So you see my dilemma. What do you fellas think? How's the Rode NTG-3? Is the Sennheiser ME67 better? What do you guys recommend?? I understand a good amount about audio, but when it comes to purchasing mics and stuff, I can never make the decisions myself because I'm not 100% familiar with everything. So just looking for some more knowledgeable assistance here.
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The NTG3 and ME67 are very different - the NTG3 is a short gun and the ME67 is a long gun (more directional).

With your budget I would go for the Sennheiser MKE 600 - this is affordable and said by several to sound better than the K6/ME66 (K6/ME67) even though it's cheaper. This is a relatively new mic. being introduced only a year or two ago.
 
You might want to look at the whole chain. Room>Sound source>Distance>Mic>Mixer>Recorder. For example, if you're feeding directly into the camera/recorder, a mixer may be a better investment. If the distance is too far and your boom pole is too short, you may want to consider investing in a better boom pole to get closer - every inch matters. If the room is too small and reflective, consider a different mic other than one with an interference tube design such as a hypercardioid. The NTG-2 produces good results in the right conditions, but your money may better spent in dampening the room (rugs, foam pads, moving blankets) or in other areas like a better boom pole or mixer with decent pre-amps.
 
Personally I now use the AT 875R as my stock small shotgun but also have the sennheiser 416 available but that is way out of your price range.
 
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