Loans for Gear

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Hi.

What lons or credit unions do you guys recommend for small gear purchases under $10K?


In the past i had a business license, but after time i ended up freelancing and working for other companies and let it expire. Sadly. Now that things are coming back around to me needing to be operating more like a business, i am running into the issues of getting loans.

Do any of you know a way to get a loan with an lower interest rate than 30% apr that isn’t a credit card?

I am near the end of having a diverse rental kit, and want to get the last buts and pieces to make it all more appealing to renters and clients. Piecing everything together takes so long, and not having the last few items makes it difficult to rent while still being a financial overhead to me.

I started freelancing, but as i have moved toward DP, it gets more competetive and clients want me to own gear, also the jobs start to get fewer unless one has a good kit. I would go back, but now being a DP is how i make a livingg and i don’t have other quick options at this time. I could wait it out, and just take my time, but it is also that i am so close to having a full kit that i want to take the last jump. And yes, i am realizing the importance if setting up a business now and i will start that process asap.

Any suggestions on getting a loan that can work for someone who more or less happened into DP’ing and hasn’t set up a business?
 
I have been using Bill-Me-Later (now PayPal Credit) for the past 10 years.

The terms have changed over the years, but it's basically been no interest for 6 months if you pay off what you bought in full by the 6 months.

I've spent thousands and thousands of dollars (like many of us) on gear and basically just sold everything in the fifth month, and paid it all off and continued on to the next items...for literally 10 years.

It's been insane...just recycling cash and gear, haha. (It won't work for everything though...like a $20K camera or something.)

Not sure how much available credit people get (I guess it's probably also good to have some money available just in case you can't or won't sell it and want to make sure you can pay off the debt while you work - because the interest is bad), but if you have at least $8K-$10K-$12K available, you can be all set.

For me, it's the perfect solution because I'm neurotic and can't hold onto a camera or anything else for more than 6 months anyway. And not a single penny in interest is nice too.
 
With an amazon prime credit card you get 1 year interest free payments for purchases over $750 or something.

But if you don’t pay it off in time you get hammered. But you could utilize NorBro strategy that way with an extra 6 months of wiggle room.

With depreciation of course I would try to minimize any interest at all - at that point, why not just rent?
 
Those are both great ideas, and ones I have been using for about 3-4years. I have noticed it more difficult to sell name brand gear second hand these days now that there are so many cheap third partyt options. So, while I am not losing money, it is a slim margin game, and easy to get in trouble when I need money fast.

Always tried to stay out of debt in the past, but as things changed, both in my work, and in the industry, owning gear has become more important, both to clients and to me in being able to rent my own gear.

Unfotunately, I got into this as a passion, so I didn't go through the professional channels properly, but now I find myself trying to get clients in a constantly changing landscape of tastes and job requirements. One gig needs this, another needs that. And I started buying gear based on my personal preferences. I have awesome gear that no body but me and 5 other people want. haha.


I'll have to take the longer road. It is just tough having an almost complete kit for projects. All of the other DP's I know get a loan from a family member to start their kits. I've also heard of steadicam operators getting loans for a steadicam, not sure how they go about that since they must not be making much money if they don't own a steadicam yet, and even a used steadicam can be around $30,000.

They system of credit cards is treating my purchase the same way some one might be buying frivolous luxury items. Just not a good business model for me. I have to change the way I am doing this.

If I sell all my gear, then I lose a competitive edge. And currently I cannot double down and complete my gear package because I have maxed out my paypal balance.


I could rent, but I am trying to relieve my current over head by making a more enticing rental package to a broader range of people.

In any case, it is looking like I am going to have to spend a few months sorting all of this out, and then another year or two building my gear package into something more rentable. Whereas a loan would get me there in 24hrs.


I'll lower my prices on gear I am selling and see where that gets me in the short term. hate to give gear away at low prices to people that are just going to flip it, or that aren't even sure if they want it.
 
It's definitely getting more difficult to sell. I'm pretty much done myself...buying a 4K pocket and riding off into the sunset.

I started in the industry in a very niche lucrative sector and it kind of expanded into fun personal freelance only because of the other work/opportunity. But I actually dislike what everything has become, and truly admire people who can make a good living in production only, especially in the last 5 years. To put up with the ever changing technology, demands, and competition is a nightmare.

I think it's only fun if you're already rich then you can just mess around and "make movies".
 
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That is wise. The 4K pocket looks like a good option for that.

Not only has selling gear gotten harder, trying to rent gear through kitsplit and sharegrid is awful, because rental houses can also be on there. so it isn't true peer to peer rentals. Add to it that rates go so low.

There are many days my friends say they are jealous, but they get to spend there money and free time on life. I should get a real job. I have always come back to camera, but never doubled down and invested in it and gone past the burning point to really make it work. It is very scary. Apparently not many people do this. Day jobs are so much easier and pay so much better.

My father was pretty altruistic. he never made much money. I am ok with being poor, but being poor is always a liability. It turns off clients, for one, and a bad month can throw one out of it for years.

If I find anything out, I'll up date here. as of now, if anyone reads this and is interested, the basics needed for a business loan from a typical bank is a business license and $100K revenue, and a business loan of $10K or more. Anything less is generally classified as a personal loan. In which rates get classified differently, and penalties are less forgiving. Best advice is to keep a camera package that is perfectly nimble for small gigs, and great in lowlight, and only rent larger gear. don't spend more than $10K on a shooting package to start. Things get tricky after that. Credit options disappear and interest adds up, but it takes more gear to make up for more gear with bigger everything there is an exponential pricing that happens. Interest on personal loans and credits cards are generally too high for startup business without many clients. And if you already had the clients, you would need the loan. a classic catch 22.


I am pretty happy with what I have now, and should just work within that. I just really wanted to add a lens or two to the extreme ends, say something over 85mm on the telephoto end. or get an essential lighting kit for inteerviews, or a cinema zoom of some type. Btw, if you are renting to clients, get a zoom over primes, because if you are renting to clients, chances are you are going to be short handed and zooms work in almost every scenario and primes require time or additional crew.

As NorBro said, it is kind of a rich persons game.
 
NorBro said:
It's definitely getting more difficult to sell. I'm pretty much done myself...buying a 4K pocket and riding off into the sunset.

I started in the industry in a very niche lucrative sector and it kind of expanded into fun personal freelance only because of the other work/opportunity. But I actually dislike what everything has become, and truly admire people who can make a good living in production only, especially in the last 5 years. To put up with the ever changing technology, demands, and competition is a nightmare.
Click to expand...


What niche did you start in?
 
I'd rather not get into that right now, ha...but I also meant it's sometimes good to get into a very specific line of work.

I'll give you an example...I know someone who works in the slow-motion food commercial industry, and he claims there are only 4-5 main companies in the entire country (USA) who provide slow-motion for every food chain that has a nationwide commercial (this was said to me 3 years ago). The crazy close-ups of food flipping in the air or sizzling on a grill or bouncing around, macros of particles melting/water droplets/liquids, etc. They also build and prep the food which sounds like a complex process (building support inside the food to make it look bigger (like sandwiches), spraying the food with chemicals to make it look juicier, the lighting, the angles, etc).

And that's not to say other production companies don't make food commercials (because I imagine they do), but those companies above would be the specific guys/gals they call in for all of the slow-motion Phantom and FOR-A camera work - and the design of the food - for those specific shots.

I don't know anything about any of that, but it's an example (if true) of how sometimes you have to think outside the box or get into doing something that not everyone else is doing.

But going back to this conversation...I would never invest too much money into anything anymore unless you're in a specific line of work and simply making a lot of money. One really needs to figure out what you truly need, not want...and you cannot rely on renting gear anymore.

Camera bodies, lenses, lights, audio, support gear, creative tools...I think you really have to be sure if you can actually make some decent money from all of it (and not just money to pay it all off).
 
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The other thing to keep your eyes open for is terms manufacturers make available....for example you may buy a Varicam or Sony Venice....Certain companies probably finance at a better or competitive rate to banks/credit unions....it of course depends on your purchase but in say the case of a Cinema Camera the item itself provides good security for the loan...I would look at all the various manufacturers financing packages....especially after the item has been released for say 6 months or more. This would be a way of getting the really big ticket items you feel you need to round out your kit...even in the case of a good lighting package it would'nt take much to run up between 10 and 20 thousand....
 
NorBro said:
I'll give you an example...I know someone who works in the slow-motion food commercial industry, and he claims there are only 4-5 main companies in the entire country (USA) who provide slow-motion for every food chain that has a nationwide commercial (this was said to me 3 years ago). The crazy close-ups of food flipping in the air or sizzling on a grill or bouncing around, macros of particles melting/water droplets/liquids, etc. They also build and prep the food which sounds like a complex process (building support inside the food to make it look bigger (like sandwiches), spraying the food with chemicals to make it look juicier, the lighting, the angles, etc).
Click to expand...

Interesting, that is something I've thought about too. That specialisation is a good idea.

But you need to strike a balance, as if you do "too specialized" then there might not be enough work to support you and you're also putting all your eggs into one basket if you don't manage to scoop up that niche.

Yet also you don't want to go "too broad" either, for instance "4K" or "drones" is waaaaay too broad (also "too late", as if you'd got into it a decade ago then it would have been a much better niche to be in!).

Sometimes I think underwater cinematography would be fun to get into, as I love the water/swimming/triathlons.

But for now I'm "specialized" in audio, which is going great for me, but also doesn't take me anywhere specifically down the camera path of work in the long term.
 
With the specialized work, it's usually once you're in you're probably staying in only for that (as far as production) because of the money. If it's low/regular money like other stuff then there is no point and one should just freelance and do a bit of everything as you mention (or get a normal job). The people with the high-speed cameras were supposedly producing the commercials for $100K+. So a few a year with a few people on the crew...

And this was for like McDonalds and Taco Bell like companies (I don't remember which ones exactly) where those costs are nickels and dimes for the corps. But it's near impossible to get in now...needed to get in like 20 years ago and stay in. I imagine it's the same for a lot of other similar crew jobs for big things. A lot of time it's who you know too.

Heck, maybe some of those big food companies even do stuff in house now (I don't know).

Want to split one? https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1063304-REG/for_a_ft_one_opt_full_4k_variable.html
 
fboonzaier said:
The other thing to keep your eyes open for is terms manufacturers make available....for example you may buy a Varicam or Sony Venice....Certain companies probably finance at a better or competitive rate to banks/credit unions....it of course depends on your purchase but in say the case of a Cinema Camera the item itself provides good security for the loan...I would look at all the various manufacturers financing packages....especially after the item has been released for say 6 months or more. This would be a way of getting the really big ticket items you feel you need to round out your kit...even in the case of a good lighting package it would'nt take much to run up between 10 and 20 thousand....
Click to expand...

At this point, that would be scary. I have worked occasionally for bigger clients that can afford those camera rentals, but it would be a big jumnp for me. maybe worth it. will check it out.
 
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