Live concert-small stage-single acoustic guitar+vocals-how to mic?

E

eco_bach

Well-known member
Hi
Will be shooting a live concert in 2 weeks. Renting a C300 for the show. Have no idea how to best mic the event.

What combination of mics would be best for a live acoustic guitar show with vocals?

On camera shotgun + lav or???

I own a Zoom H4n but that's it. Will rent everything else.
Also might not be able to afford a sound person so will be handling all the audio as well.
 
Is the person playing the guitar and singing completely acoustic? Will they have a mic to sing into? Will there be a PA? Depending on these answers your best bet is to record the vocal mic and guitar on separate tracks and a live (hippy mix) with the best stereo mics you can find. You can use the Zoom to do this but you are in for possible surprises with not having a dedicated sound man.
 
There is several 'depends' situations here, but would need more details to give proper advice.

but a camera mounted shotgun and a lav are deff NOT part of the best solution.
 
recordingwhiz said:
There is several 'depends' situations here, but would need more details to give proper advice.

but a camera mounted shotgun and a lav are deff NOT part of the best solution.
Click to expand...

Thanks yes, acoustic guitar, and yes, a small club so I assume some type of PA.


So if not a lav and shot gun mic then what are the alternatives?
 
Check if the PA mixer has direct outs... Or even Aux outs will work. Send the vocal and guitar to separate H4N inputs and you can mix those later. Try and get a good feed to at least one camera for syncing in post. Should work ok. As for mics, so many options...

Most sound guys will have more than enough gear to accomadate it plus you don't have to worry and can focus on video!
 
If you're using an H4n with conventional mixer line outs, you'll need some sort of attenuator - the H4n 1/4" inputs are way too sensitive for standard line outs and the Zoom doesn't have sufficient range of control over the sensitivity.

If you're operating the mixer you have a lot more flexibility, but if you're borrowing a connection you'll need a bag of adapters and some kind of attenuators.

Fran
 
Assuming you are chasing a great sounding mix since you are also going out of your way to rent a realy nice camera package I would highly recommend hiring a sound person for the gig who can bring his gear package along with him. but not only for his gear but because he or she can actually work entirely focused on getting you great audio and not worrying about operating a camera and also allowing you to focus on great imagery.

I would recommend having a separate mic for singer as well as a separate mic for the acoustic guitar, both feeding a your Zoom or the sound guy's recorder with a nice stereo pair of 'Audience" mics being recorded into the camera but NOT on the camera itself. this will give you a total of 4 tracks to deal with in post, giving you entire control of the final product, as well as taking it out of the hands of the guy who only cares about making it sound nice in the venue rather than your recording.

On the other hand coordinating with the venue sound guy will be the next best thing since he can give your recorder separate mic and vocal feed to your recorder and if you butter him up nicely he may also watch to make sure you have good levels without clipping. (again, having some one dedicated tothis is still the best as it will be their entire job to keep an eye on levels as well as monitoring on headphones to be assured you are getting the best sound.)

Having a great sounding live recording is NOT an easy endeavor even if it seems easy because its only a guitar and a singer. great audio is an art form on its own and requires great skills and know-how. and it also helps to have the proper mics for the job, the shotgun and lav may work in a pinch but again not the right tools for the job.

Good luck
 
Thanks! Could you give some specific mic recommendations for the guitar and vocals? I suggested lav and shot gun only because it seemed like the most portable solution
 
I DO have a zoom H4N and am experienced in using lav mics with it. My thinking is that I could use 2 lav mics as well as the 4 channel mode. Use the built-in stereo mics to record audience ambience for 2 tracks, and the other 2 tracks would be used for 2 lav mics, 1 for vocals and 1 for guitar.

A good solution?
 
NO, not good solution, Lavs and Shotguns are designed for very different uses than a live musical show. (They are best at dialog recording)
and the mics you would use would depend on what your rental company has available.

If I had my choice and I wanted a great recording I would use a splitter box and use a nice condenser vocal mic like a Shure Beta 87a using the splitter box to send one feed to my recorder and the other to FOH mixer, then I would add a small diaphragm condenser on a separate boom stand to mic the guitar something like a Neumann KM184 or a AKG C451 or something similar , now this all depends on how still the performer is, then feed each one of these separately into the Zoom, If the guy is using a pick up out from his guitar, he more than likely is going into a DI box that should have a second output from it but getting DI acoustic guitar to sound good takes some serious ear skillz so I prefer the mic, it just sounds better.

Dont fool yourself into believing that you will get decent use of the 4 track feature out of the Zoom's built in mic in 4 ch mode. unless you can mount the Zoom 12' up in air in the middle of the room safely and get all the wires to it. so because of this I would not even consider that the Zoom has any built in mics.

I would then get a pair of decent condenser "Audience" mics one in each half of the room aimed towards the audience, with these two mics sent to the camera which I believe has the proper hook ups for this. this will be your 'audience / ambiance' tracks and will also give you the sync track for the video. keep in mind you will laso need a slew of mic cables and a few mic stands to accomplish all of this as well.

and again I will say it yet one more time, on a situation like this it is CRITICAL that some one besides the camera operator, and that has a clue about audio is constantly monitoring the recording levels as well as monitoring the sound with good headphones. not having this person is like setting focus on your camera and expecting good focus as you move around, not gonna end well.

keep in mind what this whole project is about... not video, its about music.. and what is music? its sound... give it the priority it deserves,.. crappy audio will make the entire project not worthwhile.

Good luck
 
+1 to the above. Recordingwiz nailed it... If you want to do it properly follow that guideline. Can't stress the value of having a dedicated sound guy. Even a local who runs a small studio will have the gear to do this properly and probably very economically!


Goodluck!
 
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