Lighting plan for scene

L

Lynos

Well-known member
Hi all

A question (and probably one of a few to come):

I am about to shoot a very tricky scene. The scene takes place in a bar, but we actually shoot at some sort of party room which contain a bar in it.
The place does not look like a real bar.
The scene is a dialogue scene, no elaborate movements or anything.

But I am having trouble with the lighting scheme. I am not a DP, I'm directing this, and my cameraman doesn't have any extensive experience with lighting. We are all basically rookies.

My objective: To make the room look swankier than it is by making it fairly dark and use warm lighting in red and orange hues. further more, I have one white actor and one black actor which could have effect on how we decide lo light the whole thing.

there are a lot of lighting kits out there for rent. I can't use a big one, I'm shooting at somebody's place of business and I don't want to burn his circuitry or anything (is 650W per light is too much?). but i'm really not sure which of them will serve our purposes.

I know I'll need gels (although these I can't rent - anybody know where to get these?) Red or orange ones.

I want to have some "christmas lights" in the background which will seem to be the lighting source and then light the actors in a way that will correspond to that.

I want warm, moody lighting. I'm taking the lighting thing very seriously. As far as technical concerns go, this is my no. 1 concern after sound. I know that the quality of lighting can make or break a scene and it can help greatly in "selling" an illusion.

Any kind of advice, thoughts, ideas, about a lighting sceme for this would be greatly appreciated.

We are shooting on DV.

Thank you.
 
create depth with light, then dark, then light, then dark, then light areas. Multiple planes. Use 15w practicals and your xmas lights in your frame in the bkg. Warm things up with CTO on your key lights. flag spill. just throwing this out there but maybe try to shoot for a 4:1 contrast ratio to keep it bar/moody. good luck.
 
Thanks.

Actually, I changed my scheme from orange and red to blue and red. Furthermore, I'm having trouble getting those christmas lights I so desire (in the colors I need).

What is a flag spill by the way? I'm not a DP and have very limited knowledge in lighting... I'm basically building this whole scheme with almost zero experience in that field.

If there's anyone here who lives in Toronto and would like to come and help us as gaffer on this production we will welcome him with open arms.

Thanks again for all the input. I'll consider it all.
 
Lynos,

I highly recommend that you invest in Rush Hamden's DCT course. (Digital Cinema Training)

Do a search on the DVXuser site.

Rush has a dvd dedicated to lighting included in the set. The other dvds contain lessons on lighting as well. I believe Rush sets up 2 or 3 scenes like you are envisioning.

Even though you will want to watch it all from the beginning, the dvd menus will allow you to skip around looking for specific subject matter.
 
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I'd first concentrate on set-design. As you mentioned, it has a bar, but does not look like a bar.

Start the process now in physically transforming this small set into a bar. Hire (for free even) an interior designer to do this job. No pay, but copy and credit and an introudction into the filmmaking world might get someones attention

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Lighting should be minimilistic I'd think ? China balls hanging just our of frame ? Gels to mimic Neon ?

See Mean Streets, Goodfellas, Cop Land, et al to study the atmosphere of a bar to inspire you.

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I'd love to see some photos of the set so we can help you !
 
I already have a set designer. Not someone professional - i.e, no film experience, but with enthusiasm and ideas.
I'm thinking minimilastic too, if for no other reason that I don't really have a choice.

The problem is that when you don't have any experience of your own, you get a lot of contradictory advice. Yes, I read somewhere that china balls can be very effective for this kind of shot, but when I asked some cinematographer about it he said that it's probably not enough and that the picture could be too dark and grainy. So go figure.
Bouncing 650W lights off the ceiling? Using 200W lights in china balls? My main concern is lighting the actors faces. I think I can handle the ambience thing. Just pour some soft light in the background. I got some good suggestions here. But I don't want the actors to be too dark (and one of them is dark-skinned to begin with).

Here are some photos:
 

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What a great location ! Much better than I was thinking it was gonna be !

I'd use the existing light as practical sources and light for realism on the talent. I'd smoke it a bit.
 
If by practicals you mean those lights that you see on the bar, then I don't think it'll work. As you can see, they are pretty harsh and bright, and a bar is supposed to be a bit dim. I might leave some of them in the background if it will be possible to turn some off and some on separatley.

What is to "smoke" something? I'm guessing you don't meant literally.

Thanks :-)
 
Chinese lanterns w/ 250watt bulbs with a home depot dimmer. You can hang them on a c-stand arm to place them where you need and have soft light to light faces for your coverage on dialog. A great cheap trick. That practical up in the drop part of the ceiling (that rakes across the ceiling fan), you can use a party gel maybe a dark blue or red it will cut it down a bunch and if you need more some 216 or 250 diffusion will cut it more (I've taped gel right to the bulb before leave some air space, but you can figure a way to get gel up there). The drop down might be a cool way to hide lights. Johnny1968 has the right idea- think layers- one way to help see this more defined is to use a fogger you can rent one for about $15 a day. Just a nice mist will give you even more of a canvas to paint on with your lighting. Just mtcw hope this helps.
Good luck
A.G.
 
Hmmm... those are some neat ideas. Only thing is I'm not sure I can turn off only some of the practicals. If I can turn some of them off and leave those in the foreground on, and then diffuse them with gels, then that could be great.

I'm renting a whole kit just in case. 750W, 250W, the works. But if I'll find a simpler way of doing it without cooking everyone (the set is hot and stifling as it is), then I'll go for it.

As for smoking, it's tempting, but it's not the look I'm aiming for. It's not supposed to be a seedy, 1940's style bar... just your run-of-the-mill local watering hole. I've been to those places and they aren't smoky. I would love to do it but it's just not right for the scene, I think, it would be to stylized. Maybe I'm not understanding correctly, but when you say "smoke" I imagine, well, smoke. Like in a film-noir bar...

Thanks for all the suggestions, you guys are great.
 
Not necessarily. Many times the foggers or diffusion in a can are just used to soften up the area a bit. It can be a very subtle filter like effect depending upon how much you use.
 
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