Legality of using pro team / athlete's names in dialogue

K

Kent OGP

Active member
In the feature I'm shooting this summer, some of the characters mention the names of NFL and MLB teams, is that legal or would I need permission from the NFL and MLB to do that? If it's not allowed, would it be okay if the character just said "the Skins game" instead of "the Redskins game" for example? Or "Nats" instead of "Nationals"?

Also, there's a part where a character talks about Brett Favre specifically...and in a negative light, though it's only a couple of lines. Could I get in any trouble for that?

I just don't want some NFL lawyers knocking at my door!
 
My non legal opinion is I don't think you have a problem unless what the character is saying could come under libel or defamation of character. But as long as it's a fictional character saying it I kind of doubt there would be grounds. You should put the boilerplate clause that you see in all big films about all characters being fictional and any similarity being a coincidence. You could get some scrutiny if your implying that the negative stuff is true, but as long as it's a fictional characters opinion I think your safe. Though I also would be very interested in a real legal opinion.
 
I think you have to be careful with name references like that because people overseas and who don't follow the sport won't get it. Some guys don't even know who he is.
 
It's just with all trademarks and copyrights -- freedom of speech. You can mention any celebrity, any sports team, any franchise, anything you want, in a film, novel, whatever. But I would be careful if you're going to make it negative, then you can run into some problems, even if you're in the right, you may not have the legal funds to defend yourself anyway.

But if a character just says, "Hey man I can't make it on Friday night, going to the Yankees game!" you can't get in trouble for that. You have every right to say that in real life or otherwise. Now showing brand logos and whatnot? Totally different story, you need permission for all of that from a distributor's perspective, though from a legal perspective you can show logos and brand names as long as they are incidental, like a Coke can lying on the table behind a character. A distributor doesn't want to take risks, though, which is why all of us cover those kind of things or get clearance before-hand. Distributors don't always care about legality either, it's more about protecting themselves, and better safe than sorry *even if you're in the right* legally.

I will say, however, I had a distributor in Canada on my short film tell me they couldn't acquire it because I referenced things like Yankees, Star Wars, etc. I told them that's nonsense and it's perfectly legal to do so, and they agreed that in English-speaking countries they're sure that's true but they distribute to 100+ countries and aren't aware of the laws in every country in which they distribute. They were friendly and nice (loved my film, very positive comments) so I didn't push it, but I wanted to say well maybe it is your attorney's job to learn the laws in countries you do business! But whatever.

My feature has numerous references to famous people, franchises, whatever. I'm not concerned, you don't need permission for things like that, just look at how many films have Star Wars references. You think Lucas clears that? Of course not, Lucas is one of the most protective people, they sue everyone who is even close to a breach of copyright, trust me, I've written two books on Star Wars (unauthorized non-fiction, but I don't need authorization to write about a subject in public) and I follow the Lucasfilm empire closely. But you can't sue someone else for mentioning your brand. If you could, imagine someone from the Wall Street Journal trying to write about Coca-Cola stock, but they can't write "Coca Cola" without getting sued -- makes no sense.
 
Jonathan, you are no attorney. That is very clear!. Journalism and entertainment falls under two completely different rules.

You should never offer anyone legal advise, unless you are certified to do so.

Kent, search out a proper legal decision. It is well worth have all your bases covered.
 
Excuse me douchesickle who are you? Journalism and entertainment are NOT two entirely separate things, I've read numerous entertainment law books, you don't get some magical status conferred upon you by having a legal degree that grants you divine powers of understanding you can't get from just reading exactly the same laws and information that are widely available. Don't speak when you have no idea what you're talking about "Paul," leave that to people who actually do the research.

And thanks for your OPINION about not offering anyone (legal) advice unless I'm certified to do so, your OPINION has been noted and rejected for being moronic. We all have opinions, yours just happens to have no value to me whatsoever -- congratulations!

When you're writing a non-fiction book FOR PROFIT, it is still considered a "non-commercial, editorial use" when mentioning brands, and it's no different in entertainment. If you think that you have to clear permission to have a character mention a brand you are completely wrong. If you're such an authority, how about giving us a link or showing us why we should care about your opinion?

Next time you want to say something to me that has no value and wastes my time, I got a better suggestion, go to nobodycareswhatyouthink.com and then promptly remove your head from your rear. Thanks!
 
Jonathan, you once again prove yourself to be a complete pro. Thanks for your valuable input. We will all now ignore you and your useless posts.
 
No need for a vacation. I have remained professional. I will not visit here again as long as this be sophmoric behavior is tolerated.
 
Thanks for the help guys!

All I'm really saying is that Favre switched teams and that the character couldn't stay loyal to NFL football after that, so I don't think it's too bad.

One more question, would it be okay to see something like an Iron Man toy next to some other toys lying on the ground? What if it's in the foreground (and doesn't look incidental)?
 
JonathanLB said:
Excuse me douchesickle who are you? Journalism and entertainment are NOT two entirely separate things, I've read numerous entertainment law books, you don't get some magical status conferred upon you by having a legal degree that grants you divine powers of understanding you can't get from just reading exactly the same laws and information that are widely available. Don't speak when you have no idea what you're talking about "Paul," leave that to people who actually do the research.

And thanks for your OPINION about not offering anyone (legal) advice unless I'm certified to do so, your OPINION has been noted and rejected for being moronic. We all have opinions, yours just happens to have no value to me whatsoever -- congratulations!

When you're writing a non-fiction book FOR PROFIT, it is still considered a "non-commercial, editorial use" when mentioning brands, and it's no different in entertainment. If you think that you have to clear permission to have a character mention a brand you are completely wrong. If you're such an authority, how about giving us a link or showing us why we should care about your opinion?

Next time you want to say something to me that has no value and wastes my time, I got a better suggestion, go to nobodycareswhatyouthink.com and then promptly remove your head from your rear. Thanks!
Click to expand...


You do have to clear for brand names in dialouge....

Just watch this interview: http://www.thestream.tv/watch.php?v=874

6:00 minutes in.
 
Please do yourself a favor and do not seek legal advise here. We would like to help you but are grossly unqualified to do so. Find an attorney, a belt and suspenders guy. That is what I do. I could tell you what my attorney has told me in the past but it may not relate to you.

These are not questions that should be asked lightly. The consequences can be extreme.
 
What, pray tell, is a douchesickle?
I really must get back in touch with these new terms that keep popping up in our language!
 
If you rip on Brett Farve and say he sucks because he throws interceptions during crucial moments of a game, how is that libel?
 
Kent OGP said:
In the feature I'm shooting this summer, some of the characters mention the names of NFL and MLB teams, is that legal or would I need permission from the NFL and MLB to do that? If it's not allowed, would it be okay if the character just said "the Skins game" instead of "the Redskins game" for example? Or "Nats" instead of "Nationals"?

Also, there's a part where a character talks about Brett Favre specifically...and in a negative light, though it's only a couple of lines. Could I get in any trouble for that?

I just don't want some NFL lawyers knocking at my door!
Click to expand...

Kent, I've checked out your blog and looks like you're on your way- good luck with the shoot this summer. Now is the time to get an entertainment attorney involved with the film. That is if you ever want to sell it- a distributor is going to want paper on everything in other words a clear title. Meaning a deal memo/contract with everyone who works on it (actors and crew), clearance on any logo's that may appear in the film, etc.. Unfortunately in this business you have to CYA (cover your a%$). Of course if you're just making a film for your friends to see on Saturday at your house then don't bother with attorneys. I imagine you are wanting to make this your career. Then you'll need to get to know an entertainment attorney and you'll be miles ahead of the game.
We are in the post process of our film and deliverables are just as much of a headache as any other part of production. I guess you can say it's a necessary evil- lol. Keep us updated on the film.
A.G.
http://www.killingstrainmovie.com
 
How crucial are location releases?

What if no one can tell what the location is?

Would a location that is unidentifiable need someone's signature?


"What, pray tell, is a douchesickle?"

Wouldn't that be douchesicle, like popsicle?
 
polfilmblog said:
How crucial are location releases?

What if no one can tell what the location is?

Would a location that is unidentifiable need someone's signature?


"What, pray tell, is a douchesickle?"

Wouldn't that be douchesicle, like popsicle?
Click to expand...

I would have a release for as many locations as possible. Our film had a corn field, interior house location and exterior house location as well as a warehouse that was dressed as a basement. Every location had a release even the farmer that owned the corn field. Reason; Lets say we sell the distributor buys our film and it has some success, and the guy who owned the exterior location sued the distributor to get paid something because we used his house in our film without paying him. In our case we have a location release that he agreed to and signed and we paid him for his electricity and a small fee or no charge. So most distributors are going to want releases for locations. Believe me when it comes to films and people thinking there is money on the table out come the lawyers and everyone wants to get paid.

Example; we negotiated a deal for the location and everything was cool until we showed up on first day of the shoot with a grip truck, full crew and a motor coach for the actors. All these items I negotiated a very low rate or they were free because of favors -when the guy's wife seen our set up the next day he wanted to renegotiate our deal. His wife had a friend who's house was used as a film set and she remodeled there house with the money the film paid her ($75,000). We explained that that was most of the budget of the film and no way we could afford it. BUT we had a signed location release and he understood but his wife made our lives hell for the next 10 days. Like I said once someone sees your DVD for sale someone will put an idea in there head that they make some money. After all everyone knows that filmmakers has so much of it (money) LOL. So my advice is get location agreements done before you shoot anything! Just my 2 cents
Allen
 
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