LED Panels and 26 Volt Batteries

S

superbassface

Member
I posted this is in the wrong forum before, but I think it should be here...

I've got a 200 Watt LED panel that requires 26 volts. I didn't buy the dual battery plate that takes two 14.4 volt batteries and outputs 26 volts, I instead got a single 26 volt battery. The battery is gold mount, but now I'm trying to figure out if I need a specific battery plate with a dtap that outputs 26 volts. Most gold mount plates are rated for 14.4 volts. This one says 11-17volts and up to 50 watts, https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...ock_plate.html. So I'm trying to make sure that I won't burn through the plate if I run the light off a 26 volt battery with a dtap to 4 pin connector. The batteries themselves do not have dtap connectors. I only found that out after purchasing. (this is the battery, https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1515145-REG/shape_g26lc_full_play_26v_260wh.html)
 
morgan_moore said:
Did you answer your own question?
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No I have not. I've been looking for gold mount plates that are rated at 26 volts, and I could not find one. I'm looking to see if anyone else has used them, and if they used specific plates.

I tested the battery with a gold mount plate from a monitor (I do not have info on what that is rated) and it worked. But just because it works doesn't mean it's safe.
 
Honestly probably be better to return everything and use the two batteries as the light was designed instead of all this rigamarole.

In layman's terms when you exceed a power rating, it heats up. As it gets hot it creates more resistance, getting even hotter, until the resistance rises enough to prevent the device from receiving the power it needs, or it starts a fire. It could also trigger a safety fuse in the battery. It most likely will work so buy the adapter and see what happens. Sounds like a fun experiment.
 
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Peter C. said:
Honestly probably be better to return everything and use the two batteries as the light was designed instead of all this rigamarole.

In layman's terms when you exceed a power rating, it heats up. As it gets hot it creates more resistance, getting even hotter, until the resistance rises enough to prevent the device from receiving the power it needs, or it starts a fire. It could also trigger a safety fuse in the battery. It most likely will work so buy the adapter and see what happens. Sounds like a fun experiment.
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That's what I was thinking, but don't know much about the inside of battery plates or the limitations of dtap connectors. When I first bought the light, I spoke to the manufacturer and they said that the light wasn't meant for use with batteries unless you get 26 volt batteries specially made. This was before you could just buy them from B&H. The dual plate option was something I only learned about from a rental house in NY that custom made the plate for using skypanels on location off of battery. Either option is a third party option.

ahalpert said:
Hmm it seems like these are the only 26V gold-mount plates at B&H: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/sear...gold-mount+fct_a_features_4000|26v-capability

I dont suppose the LED manufacturer sells a plate for their light?
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Ouch, that's expensive hahaha. I was hoping not to spend that much on the battery plate. And no, unfortunately the plate they included is not meant for use and has no dtap out.


This is the light, https://www.intellytechusa.com/products/super-nova-200-watt-5600k-daylight-panel-1x1-60-degree-flood. I work for a lot of photographers that use film and shoot natural light, and I was hoping to use this panel for fill as it's easy to set up and I can hand hold it. With a single battery, it's manageable. If I have to rig a dual battery plate, it becomes less manageable.
 
superbassface said:
That's what I was thinking, but don't know much about the inside of battery plates or the limitations of dtap connectors. When I first bought the light, I spoke to the manufacturer and they said that the light wasn't meant for use with batteries unless you get 26 volt batteries specially made. This was before you could just buy them from B&H. The dual plate option was something I only learned about from a rental house in NY that custom made the plate for using skypanels on location off of battery. Either option is a third party option.



Ouch, that's expensive hahaha. I was hoping not to spend that much on the battery plate. And no, unfortunately the plate they included is not meant for use and has no dtap out.


This is the light, https://www.intellytechusa.com/products/super-nova-200-watt-5600k-daylight-panel-1x1-60-degree-flood. I work for a lot of photographers that use film and shoot natural light, and I was hoping to use this panel for fill as it's easy to set up and I can hand hold it. With a single battery, it's manageable. If I have to rig a dual battery plate, it becomes less manageable.
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Lights that require two batteries usually have two slots, Yours has only one, that's an odd design. I'm confused in your first post you have a 26v battery https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...play_26v_260wh.html?SID=kd56822pqk000axm02fa9 does that not power the light?
 
Strange - that light says "Because this light is so powerful, if battery (DC) power is needed, a separate 24V-14.8V Battery Converter is required." I'm not even sure what that means. Does that mean they expect you to rig a 2-battery plate to the plate on board? If so, the implication is that you could stick a 26V battery right on there. Have you tried that?

PS I'm pretty sure that no d-tap port can output 200w

Also - make sure your 26V battery can output at least 8A or I dont think it can power your light at full
 
Peter C. said:
Lights that require two batteries usually have two slots, Yours has only one, that's an odd design. I'm confused in your first post you have a 26v battery https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...play_26v_260wh.html?SID=kd56822pqk000axm02fa9 does that not power the light?
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I have the Shape 26V battery. But the battery does not have a d-tap out (thought it did when I bought it). So I have to use a gold mount plate with a d-tap out port. The gold mount plate that's mounted to the light doesn't have a d-tap out and it's not actually wired to power the light for some reason ... I was able to test it using another gold mount plate that I have that has a d-tap out port. I used a d-tap to 4-pin xlr to plug into the light's 26V 4-pin XLR. I was just a bit worried as the plate I have doesn't seem to be the most robust of plates, and I could smell things warming up.

ahalpert said:
Strange - that light says "Because this light is so powerful, if battery (DC) power is needed, a separate 24V-14.8V Battery Converter is required." I'm not even sure what that means. Does that mean they expect you to rig a 2-battery plate to the plate on board? If so, the implication is that you could stick a 26V battery right on there. Have you tried that?

PS I'm pretty sure that no d-tap port can output 200w

Also - make sure your 26V battery can output at least 8A or I dont think it can power your light at full
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I tried sticking the battery on the gold mount, and it didn't turn on. I don't think it's wired. Very odd design. I think when they made the light, these things were the easiest way to get 26 volts, https://dynacore-battery.com/portfolio-item/d-2bs-a-24-battery-extender/. Or like a custom made battery. The Shape batteries do 10A. The lack of d-tap is what's making this difficult. I think I'm going to return these batteries, and go for the FXLion as it has d-tap that outputs 26V 12A. But probably better to go with a dual plate system and not have another set of single use batteries hanging around. Then I just have to figure out a way to rig it for hand holding.
 
superbassface said:
I have the Shape 26V battery. But the battery does not have a d-tap out (thought it did when I bought it). So I have to use a gold mount plate with a d-tap out port. The gold mount plate that's mounted to the light doesn't have a d-tap out and it's not actually wired to power the light for some reason ... I was able to test it using another gold mount plate that I have that has a d-tap out port. I used a d-tap to 4-pin xlr to plug into the light's 26V 4-pin XLR. I was just a bit worried as the plate I have doesn't seem to be the most robust of plates, and I could smell things warming up.



I tried sticking the battery on the gold mount, and it didn't turn on. I don't think it's wired. Very odd design. I think when they made the light, these things were the easiest way to get 26 volts, https://dynacore-battery.com/portfolio-item/d-2bs-a-24-battery-extender/. Or like a custom made battery. The Shape batteries do 10A. The lack of d-tap is what's making this difficult. I think I'm going to return these batteries, and go for the FXLion as it has d-tap that outputs 26V 12A. But probably better to go with a dual plate system and not have another set of single use batteries hanging around. Then I just have to figure out a way to rig it for hand holding.
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You might want to return the light. It's a very odd design, using the gold mount to only hold the battery and not to power it.

Be careful mounting a heavy battery on the light, it makes it top heavy and prone to falling over. Like some have suggested use a clamp/mounting bracket at the bottom of the light stand.

I own a pair of Astora 1300d that I'm happy with. Only 86watts so they don't need multiple batteries and plenty bright (16,000 lux @1m) $399. It uses one v-mount battery but I've only used AC so far. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...22303_ps_1300d_daylight_power_spot.html/specs
 
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My initial reaction to that battery is, what a terrible idea using the same mount and connectors as a 14.4v battery, so someone could accidentally put this battery onto any other device and blow it up with overvoltage (like, ya know, a camera). Looking at the product page for these batteries and chargers I see the typical interface for a gold mount battery so there doesn't seem to be any protection in place to avoid this scenario. Terrible, terrible idea.

As is often the case these days, it seems to be all about re-inventing wheels that already existed. We've had 24v devices in the film industry for years (most late-model film cameras) and the way to manage powering and handholding was simple. Run a cable and remote the batteries. If you want to handhold it, use a battery belt--if you want to homebuild, a fanny pack with two gold mount plates in it would not be difficult. Or hang it off the stand if not being handheld. The nuisance of having an extra component with a cable is offset by the less weight to hoist and maneuver on the unit itself, plus swapping batteries is a lot easier if the instrument is extended up above your head on the stand.
 
CharlesPapert said:
My initial reaction to that battery is, what a terrible idea using the same mount and connectors as a 14.4v battery, .
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This has always crossed my mind. But then we have (reasonably reputable)Hawkwoods https://www.hawkwoods.co.uk/Cine/P/RP-100H which look like 14.4 but are 26v or whatever. I think they are standard fare for alexas.

There is of course a possibility that while the V is the same the connectors at the bottom may not be :)

I have a fuzzy memory that I suggested (to you once) that BNC for SD and HD was a poor idea but you suggested that keeping the same cable stock simplified moving from SD to HD ?

Edit.. "Hawkwoods (26v) are not cross compatibille (with 14.4v) due to mechanical differences.."
https://www.hawkwoods.co.uk/downloads/userguides/Reel-Power Userguide.pdf
 
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morgan_moore said:
I have a fuzzy memory that I suggested (to you once) that BNC for SD and HD was a poor idea but you suggested that keeping the same cable stock simplified moving from SD to HD ?]
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The difference being that you can't damage a component by connecting an HD and SD device together with a common BNC, but you certainly can attaching a 24v battery to a 12v source, unless it has overvoltage protection that covers that range.

Even in the SD days, the same BNC could carry composite video, a section of component or RGB data, or SD-SDI, so HD-SDI was no big deal to add (and now we have 3G, 6G, 12G...) It's actually really convenient that didn't have to change over to a new architecture of signal cable, that venerable BNC has served us well. Certainly easier to deal with than HDMI!

Interesting to read about those Hawkwoods but good to know that there are safeguards to keep them from being swapped out with the other voltage types. I never use V-mount so I'd not heard of those. Wasn't there a new mount that was being angled as an improvement on both legacy mounts a few years back? Was BeBob the manufacturer? Guess that hasn't caught on.
 
Yeah B-mount is a collaboration between Bebob and Arri. Given Arri'is imprimatur I'm surprised it hasn't seen wider adoption. Maybe it's just early days
 
Clearly the OP has an interesting conundrum. As 26v is becoming more common in our industry with the proliferation of high draw LED lighting. But no apparent standard to cover it.

The Shape AB battery should be rejected as dangerous unless it has some form of safe to ensure it is not not plugged into a 14.4v plate. Although BH seem to have a good selection of 26v plates (linked above) stripping the Phantom plate seems most cost effective. But do those 26v plates have a safe to not fit the 14.4 batteries - one would think that OEM Anton Bauer would not make such a schoolboy error.

26v is also good as we see that 14.4volts require thicker cabling (my link)

The chap on Gaffer and Gear youtube has some chunky batteries, and doubtless a video explaining them.

Im currently looking to power my 26v Movi from Vlock and will be using 2 in series (thats what im building)

--

On a side note 5v usb seems to be cropping up more too. I have on my 'Movi Station' 14.4 batts with many Dtap outs but also using small step downs two 5v usb outputs, one to power the Mimic the other to power my remote focus. Some cameras run or at least charge from usb C (5v)
 
A second note is that 14.4v lights seem to standardise on 4pin XLR, I note that the dynacore 24v system seems to use 3pin XLR this is something Ive heard before for the 24v (26? 28?) systems. Here intelligence is stopping over voltaging.
 
3 pin XLR is the most common output from block batteries that can output 12 or 24v. There were some 4 pin XLR things back in the day that ran 24v as well but not as common.
 
Just to clarify since Sam brought it up paranthetically, 12v and 24v is just shorthand for the range of voltages grouped around these standards (14.4v and 28.8v). It became apparent to battery manufacturers that adding an extra cell to provide slightly higher voltage would keep components running longer vs cutting off as soon as voltage dipped below nominal. Anyone remember the gawdawful NP1 batteries that were true 12v? As soon as they started to lose voltage, the attached component would switch off instantly.
 
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