LA: actors for short films, SAG?

Randall_Oelerich

Randall_Oelerich

Veteran
If I wanted to make a few short films in the LA area, would I be able to find dependable actors, perhaps even SAG actors (and if SAG, what sort of legal constraints would I be in for, would I have to sign as a signatory, would I have to form a LLC to avoid personally being committed to using my name as a signatory in any and all future films?).

I have had it trying to make short films here in northern MN. I have a very professional actress and her daughter, but I am having horrible experiences trying to work the amateurs wanting to try acting-- can't get commitments, or get a commitment and then backing out because of someone's bday party, or an actor takes the script to consider and never even emails me or calls me one way or the other. So tired of unprofessionalism.

So I am thinking-- what if I decided to make 2-3 short films out in LA where there must be buckets of actors and wannabe actors, some SAG, looking for acting experience and credits, and willing to be professional and find time to show up for a short film. I could get a timeshare cheap for a week or two (trading my brother's timeshares), cast in advance, go out to LA and make a couple of shorts.

Are locations difficult to find and have legal usage-- I mean is the LA area pretty friendly towards short filmmakers in terms of if I wanted to shoot a short on a beach, in a park, shoot quick footage along a public sidewalk guerilla style?
r
 
Why don't you write a script that uses the dependable actors you have access to? I know the thinking, the grass is greener. If you want to go the LA, Austin, Chicago route you might want to hook up with a filmaker in one of those venues that digs your stories(co direct, coproduce). Parachuting in for a production seems a little dicey.
Look at JDS "shed", think simple and local, write down what you have access to actors, props, locations and build a story around those elements.
As far as La you should be able to find buckets of actors if you go that route without going sag. If you do want to go sag you'll need some time in advance 3-4 weeks at a minimum,
Insurance, (it can be done but it takes a bit of work and good org skills).Good luck.
 
Fair question. Actually I have. I have two shorts already filmed and produced with my dependable actors, and a third one ready to shoot in a few weeks. So that is 3/3 of my shorts thus far that will be the same [dependable] actors. I need variety. I only plan to shoot 2-3 more shorts, then will make the leap to an indie feature.
 
Reach out and speak to a sag rep, the two I have worked with were extremely helpful.

Although daunting at first, the paperwork requires a little effort on your part and is not that hard.
 
J Davis said:
Reach out and speak to a sag rep, the two I have worked with were extremely helpful. Although daunting at first, the paperwork requires a little effort on your part and is not that hard.
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Seems like SAG does not want to hear from filmmakers-- on the SagIndi site I must be blind, I just do not see their contact info (email or phone), why do they want to hide contact info so interested filmmakers like me might contact them? For one thing, I would like to ask them what the benefits to the filmmaker are for hiring SAG actors, one would think they would put that in their FAQ section for filmmakers, right at the top of the list, but I do not see that anywhere in their FAQ. Hmm.
 
What about using a payroll company to handle the SAG contract as well as the workers comp insurance requirements? Or are their fees just too completely outrageous? I'm thinking some place like http://www.abspayroll.net/

I think there are a few companies like this in the LA area.
 
Writing a story using local props, locations, is not the issue-- I have plenty of screenplays, I am a screenwriter/filmmaker (2 shorts produced [many written] so far, 1 will be shot in a few weeks; have written several features). The issue is finding actors, and finding actors who will be dependable. For example, I was all geared up and jazzed to film a 4 person short film drama in 2-3 weeks, then find out my friend's son who was going to play the lead can't do it because of his sister's bday party, and some 'hill fest', I mean WTF does he want to do acting or not (he did just play the lead in a school theater)? Apparently not. So now that short is scrapped because the season is ending for that short that takes place on the beach here, including some water play (and the water in Lake Superior gets icy cold fast, we are already wearing winter jackets in the mornings here). So I am kind of disappointed all of a sudden with amateurs. Up here in northern [Duluth] MN finding actors just is not an easy thing, this is not Chicago, or LA, or even Mnpls. I want to the do the filming, so hooking up with another filmmaker is counterproductive; the purpose of my doing the filming is to learn the craft of filmmaking to gear up for an indie feature in 2-3 years.

But as for SAG actors, I need to see what benefits are to the filmmaker. As I look at a SAG contract for even a no-budget short, at first glance it seems to read like nothing but commitments and all give from the filmmaker. What does the filmmaker get from hiring SAG actors>

lambert said:
Why don't you write a script that uses the dependable actors you have access to? I know the thinking, the grass is greener. If you want to go the LA, Austin, Chicago route you might want to hook up with a filmaker in one of those venues that digs your stories(co direct, coproduce). Parachuting in for a production seems a little dicey.
Look at JDS "shed", think simple and local, write down what you have access to actors, props, locations and build a story around those elements.
As far as La you should be able to find buckets of actors if you go that route without going sag. If you do want to go sag you'll need some time in advance 3-4 weeks at a minimum,
Insurance, (it can be done but it takes a bit of work and good org skills).Good luck.
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msorrels said:
What about using a payroll company to handle the SAG contract as well as the workers comp insurance requirements? Or are their fees just too completely outrageous? I'm thinking some place like http://www.abspayroll.net/

I think there are a few companies like this in the LA area.
Click to expand...

Nice link, thank you, bookmarked it! Although they might considering adding some actual content on their website. :-/
I hate paperwork and especially would not want to do payroll paperwork, I would definitely want to farm that out to someone to handle all that, witholding, etc.
 
Pretty much all major professional screen actors and many aspiring actors want to be in SAG. In theory, you would be getting a better and more serious class of actor.

These are the people who want to be actors and most of them have at least some experience and have probably at least studied acting a little bit, if not a great deal.

The benefit to the filmmaker is that you will, on average, be working with a more dedicated group with a higher caliber of talent.
 
There was another payroll company that had more info and a real website, but of course I couldn't find the bookmark I thought I had for it. That link was all I could find at the moment. But the idea is they are the one that sign the SAG contract. Not you.

Of course you still have to do some of the SAG paperwork, but you wouldn't be tied down to the contract for life. Of course I have no experience with it, it might just be a silly idea.
 
Perhaps somewhat common sense, but it might be nice if a discussion of such benefits were posted in the FAQ to Filmmakers on the SAG Indie website.

robotsound said:
Pretty much all major professional screen actors and many aspiring actors want to be in SAG. In theory, you would be getting a better and more serious class of actor.

These are the people who want to be actors and most of them have at least some experience and have probably at least studied acting a little bit, if not a great deal.

The benefit to the filmmaker is that you will, on average, be working with a more dedicated group with a higher caliber of talent.
Click to expand...
 
Randall_Oelerich said:
So I am thinking-- what if I decided to make 2-3 short films out in LA where there must be buckets of actors and wannabe actors, some SAG, looking for acting experience and credits, and willing to be professional and find time to show up for a short film. I could get a timeshare cheap for a week or two (trading my brother's timeshares), cast in advance, go out to LA and make a couple of shorts.

Are locations difficult to find and have legal usage-- I mean is the LA area pretty friendly towards short filmmakers in terms of if I wanted to shoot a short on a beach, in a park, shoot quick footage along a public sidewalk guerilla style?
r
Click to expand...


Almost all of California is 'movie aware', and most jurisdictions have film boards, and film permit regulations. If your short films are 'small' then perhaps you could find private space which is enclosed enough that 'neighbors' would not be aware you were making a film, and not call the cops...

On public property, that is city parks, state parks, etc. all require some form of permit, unless of course, your so small that you can get in and out before someone really notices... What most government places require is a insurance rider, naming the municipality or government agency on the rider as one of the covered entities for your project. The governmental entity may also charge use fees of one sort or another.

In LA itself, I've heard that depending on the type of shoot, the city has required a 'on site fire marshal' for the days of the shoot... which is paid by the production company. If your film involves 'street traffic'... more fees for a traffic cop to manage traffic control...

Technically one is required to have a permit even on private property, but as noted above, if the production is so minimal, you could just get away with not doing the permits... not recommended, but done frequently enough... further, because of the 'movie industry', many places are aware of the 'film' value of their locations, and will charge 'rent' for use.

A few years ago I attended a meeting with a presentation by the San Diego Film Board spokesperson, and San Diego, while having a few less 'regulations' than LA, had plenty enough for me not to feel like I want to make a movie here for less than 'no-budget'...

As for SAG issues... There is a SAG option for low/no-budget film making where a SAG membe is involved. Again it is pretty much of a 'major' hassle to my mind, and really all that you do is 'defer' SAG standard wages to 'if and when' the film makes money. In a word, you can't get a SAG member to work totally gratis. While other states vary on union members and their ability to work outside the union, and not impact their union status, as far as I can tell a SAG member in California... especially in the LA area, can have a detrimental impact on their SAG membership for working outside of SAG approved projects (obviously provided your short film rockets them in to 'known stardom'...)

If on the other hand, you do have the budget to setup a company, setup insurance, pay some of the initial portions of SAG deferred pay rates... you probably could get connected with a better group of talent than what you indicate you have in your area.

Personally... I think about learning to use 'raw talent of dubious quality'... than putting up a 'California or Bust' sign...
 
SAG is tricky...

These two books talk in depth about signing with unions:
http://www.amazon.com/Indie-Producers-Handbook-Creative-Producing/dp/1580650376
http://www.amazon.com/Pocket-Lawyer...=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1284110125&sr=1-1

SAG has quite a few low-budget options that are affordable to most anyone making a film. There are lots of annoying rules though (my personal opinion). Things like, if you sign with SAG, all actors must be SAG (with a couple small exceptions). If you want to have a scene with hundreds of your friends as extras, the first ~50 must be SAG extras (exact number changes for each state). You pay large fees for overtime, late meals, not enough time off, etc. It can be frustrating.

I will say that the people I have met who work for SAG have been extremely nice. Once your company is a SAG signatory, you'll basically have somebody always on call to help you out with the details. I've never actually worked with SAG before, but the people from the Texas branch seemed to genuinely consider my best interest when we spoke.

Anyway, my primary beef with SAG is the all-or-nothing approach. Since nearly every actor I know is non-union, I wouldn't dare sign with SAG and risk being sued for also casting actors I know. If you go non-union, you can still try to cast a SAG actor... they'll just have to break their contract with SAG on their own.
 
Hey Drew, my last production (link) had a mixture of SAG and non-SAG.
We also added non-SAG roles as extras towards the end. No issues so far.
 
'Since nearly every actor I know is non-union, I wouldn't dare sign with SAG and risk being sued for also casting actors I know."Not really an issue Drew. Your prod company would sign the contract with sag (on the low budget stuff I don't believe you would be a sigantory, just for particualr production.) Unless your over 200k (500k deferred) you can have one sag actor(or more) and as many non-sag as you want. If your shooting in Texas Drew (right to work state) many many fine actors are ficore (that is able to do films that are sag and also able to do non-union films). Sag contracts are set up to protect the actors. One issue with working with sag is that many distributors may be leery to buy your film because of the deferrments, residual obligations and threat of sag seizing the film for not meeting contractual obligations. Sag actors can work defered on shorts less thn 35 minutes. If you talk to agents in right to work states they'll tell you what sag won't that many many ficore actors who land high profie parts (series, major features) are quietly able to be fully reinstated into sag as full members so sag won't be embarrassed.
 
J Davis said:
sent u a PM with email for my sag contact
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I emailed that SAG contact at the SAG website. Finally, about a week later, I just got a reply in my email inbox:

"Dear Randall, Please give us a call if you have outstanding questions or issues."

That was it, the entire email reply from SAG, to my request for more info on what the benefit to an indie filmmaker is for hiring SAG actors and signing SAG agreements. Wow, what a joke email reply. Pass. I will skip using SAG. I guard my (cell) private phone number. WTF can't SAG give some info in writing by email or on their website regarding benefits to filmmakers? Seems they want filmmakers to have everything in writing, sign agreements, but SAG is not willing to even reply in writing in an email on just some basic information. Unbelievable.

I will pass on SAG.
 
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"WTF can't SAG give some info in writing by email or on their website regarding benefits to filmmakers?" The only real benefit of using sag actors is that you can get name actors if you can afford/attract them to your project. Name actors, that's the real benefit. Without those name actors you have a very slim chance of finding a real distributor.
 
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