JVC 60p 4K ~$10,000 large sensor interchangeable lens cam - this year?!

bruceallen said:
Canon has announced a C-series 4K (PhotoJPEG 24fps) DSLR in development, likely coming out in 2012. That's what I'm talking about, not the C300.



They had the fixed prototype out last year (at Cinegear etc) but not the interchangeable one.



This thread is not about the $5K cam.

It's about the $10K interchangeable cam (hence the words "~$10,000 large sensor interchangeable lens cam" in the subject!)



Um... "broadcast spec" will very, very likely be 4K @ 60p... and Scarlet-X can only do 60P that at 2K :)

Sure, films may still be 24 (except Hobbit at 48 and Avatar 2 at 60). But "broadcast spec 4K"... 60p, man.

Also, the Scarlet can't output 4K in realtime, so you can't "broadcast" live from it at any frame rate.

Scarlet-X is awesome... but it's not a "4K broadcast spec" camera. Hopefully they will make a module in the future that can realtime debayer at 4K and output HD-SDI 4G or HDMI 1.5 or whatever (HDMI 1.5 looks like it's going to be announced sometime later this year)... but I'm not sure if Scarlet will ever do 4K 60p. That's actually what knocked it out of the running for me.

JVC's camera seems closer to what an eventual 4K broadcast camera will be (once HD-SDI and HDMI catch up and don't require 4 damn cables). Sony's weird "rotated Bayer" sensor looks like it will easily debayer in realtime to 4K so I imagine that they will have a range of cameras with realtime 4K 60fps output... hopefully Panasonic (and eventually Canon) will follow suit in making 4K 60fps broadcast cams. IMHO, >24fps is where you really see the 4K difference. Otherwise, it's mostly a bunch of high-resolution motion blur with the occasional nice-looking landscape shot!

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
Click to expand...

I don't know of a 4K broadcast spec yet, though I think you will probably be right about 60p being included in some form.

For downres from 4K Red RAW to 1080p, the Red Scarlet-X
meets Current 1080p broadcast codec specs anywhere on planet, as far as I've heard.

Ultimately, I assume the next HDMI standard (V1.5?) being finalized later this year
will accept 4K 60p signal over a single cable, as well as 3D, hence making JVC's current offering
an interesting sidenote, as was their original "HD" camcorder.

I think JVC history will repeat itself in this regard...
 
OK…this thread got me out of ‘lurk’ mode into post mode for the first time in 4 years. I have posted over at RED User occasionally, but up until now, only there.

Bruce…I absolutely, positively agree with you on the “motion blur” (and your other assessments)…and I will add ‘strobbing’ to that list of bad stuff about 24fps (one in the same?). It never bothered me shooting film, but (there have been several suggestions why it is worse) on digital, those “artifacts” drive me nuts. Watching action at 24p makes my head hurt.

This camera excites me more than any this time around, beyond the 60P capability, as it is one I can probably justify for my personal use (if it stays at the proposed $10K level). I have an Epic (stage 3) coming soon, but I really need to keep it in a rental program to be able to afford it, along with a financial partner…not having it available for spur of the moment shots negates its usefulness to me. And I agree also with your assessment of the Scarlet…anything less than 60 fps is just not “future proof” in my opinion…heard that one before? (I do appreciate other advantages of the Scarlet, of course…RAW being the big deal)

If the 4K, 4/3rds Interchangeable JVC has decent dynamic range and, just as important to me, smooth roll-off into clip (where Film still has a lead). It will be a real winner. Dealing with 4 cards/cables…pisshaw…how about changing a film roll every 4 minutes? And dealing with all of that hoopla?…I’m soooo glad we are beyond that.

We do live in exciting times.

Anyway…just my 2 cents…go easy on me everyone…I’m new here.

PS…I have been reading your posts, Bruce, here and over at RED User faithfully for probably 4 years now…I appreciate your insightfulness and savvy…same with others here (Barry Green, et.many al.). Thanks to all.

Larry Gebhardt
Cinematographer for longer than I care to admit
 
I didn't realize the history with Panny and JVC. I remember the JVC TVs years ago.
I applaud the idea that they would just release a 4K cam. Someone has to be bold and just do it. It will not be the best or optimal cause its the first. It kind of perks me when
the technology is out there and a company 'holds on to it' cause of 'marketing reasons' or whatever. Just release the new thing anyway....so thats what excites me with this cam. It will hopefully open
the doors for others to release the newer technology. This may not be the best and have its faults but its great to see this at $5K! I'm sure there will be a niche for this at such a good price
 
JVC, you had me at 4K.

I'm loving what JVC can accomplish, and at very reasonable costs, considering. I prefer the HMQ10, but only because it will probably cost half as much, and that's as far as my budget can go. I can live with a 1/2.3" imager.
4K for under $5,000. That's just...crazy.

sidenote - did you notice how the HMQ10 is pretty close to the original Scarlet design? A small, fixed-lens, single chip camera (okay, 1/2" is smaller than 2/3") that records 4K video, for around $6,000. Even better, $5,000!
 
J Bellari said:
Ultimately, I assume the next HDMI standard (V1.5?) being finalized later this year
will accept 4K 60p signal over a single cable, as well as 3D, hence making JVC's current offering
an interesting sidenote, as was their original "HD" camcorder.

I think JVC history will repeat itself in this regard...
Click to expand...

WHO cares ?

Do you use your HDMI to offload footage ? You just take your tape/card and plug it into your favorite reader since years now.

Even the RED cams only offer HDMI, they don't need a special cable nor HDMI to use their footage.
 
well,
very soon there will be already people shooting with epics at rates you couldn't rent a decent wirking oackage at a decent rental house...so i'd not bet my money on the rental business on a red camera...just my opinion... no disrespect meant to anyone or red.
 
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