Just a few....bear with me.

V

vizitor

New member
Hey all. A fine wealth of info you guys have here. I have a few questions, as I don't have a whole lot of time to search the site to find the answers.

The first is the topic of consumer cams for capture and playback. I've read that they work, and that's great. That's what I wanted to hear. Now, do any of you use one to capture with Xpress Pro/ Mojo? Are there any special tweaks you have to do to get it to work, whether capturing 24p or advanced? It's a concern because I have 4.5.1 and the only consumer cams I could find in the deck config. page were the Elura (doesn't specify which) and the zr10 (long gone as far as I know). Avid's site for compatible dv devices doesn't turn up any cheap alternatives that I've found either. And if you do have this set up, which little cam do you have? I need one preferably with an external mike hookup for filming read -throughs and auditions and also has dig/anal pass through. Suggestions, model numbers?

Question two:

Color corrected bulbs. Needed if you have color correction capabilities in your software? Or will white balancing solve the problem. Yes, I'm going for Home Depot specials. Oh, and by the way, if you need reflector clamp lights rated for 250 watts, the only place I can find them locally is Walmart for 7.50 a pop. Other wise, you have to go to B&H where they are 12 to 18 bucks. And what about using Lutron 600 watt Skylark dimmers with these lights?

Question three:

Gen Jer Dan, those barndoors on your site, Awesome. I checked the HD specials and saw that the bottome faceplate
hinges were a little to close to the front. Did you have a special trick for mounting the bottom hinge? Maybe they've changed the design a little huh..? Let me know.

And...

Question four:

For Barry Green, I want your book and DVD, but I'm interested in overnight shipping and paying with either credit card or money order. Can you give me and address, phone #, or email.
I'd appreciate it.

Pardon me if all this has been discussed ad nauseum. Your answers would be much appreciated by a fellow DVX user
guys.

Thanks, V
 
Re: Just a few....bear with me.

You’re going to want color corrected light sources for several reasons.  

First, it insures accuracy in the color of light.  If you’re starting from a specific baseline, you know exactly what color the light is and what options you have to balance and mix that light with differing sources and situations.  A 3200 degree Kelvin light is reliably within the “tungsten orange” range of light, as a 5600 degree Kelvin light is reliably in the “daylight blue” range of light.  You’re not often going to find deviation beyond +/- 200 degrees with correctly balanced sources, greatly increasing your ability to accurately gauge and mix light without repeatedly checking your scene on a monitor.

Furthermore, working with a corrected or balanced source generally insures that you’re receiving a full spectrum of light.  Many discharge and arc lighting sources are not truly full-spectrum, which can cause some seriously altered color reproduction on camera.

Second, you want color corrected light because you can’t really time out color differences within your scene.  You can use correction windows to some degree to apply localized color correction to certain areas of the picture, but light has the nasty habit of illuminating nearly everything in it’s path.  If you’ve got blindingly blue daylight coming through your window, and three 60 watt Sylvania bulbs in your table lamps, you’ve got a distinct mismatch of color within your scene.  The orange from your tungsten lights is going to spill all over and the blue from your daylight is going to spill all over as well, making it essentially impossible to arrive at a neutral white within the entire scene.

Working with color corrected lighting sources allows you to time out the mismatches, or create them where desired so that you are in control of the light color in your scene rather then in your post production.

Third,  Yes you can white balance your camera, but if you’re working with lighting of a discontinuous spectrum, you can’t color correct that with a white balance.  Your colors will still not be accurate, and for your white balancing to have any consistency, your lights must all be of the same color temperature…again, we’re back to the need for corrected and consistent lighting.

Just get a bunch of photofloods if you want to go the cheap route, you already mentioned 250 watt clip lights, and there are daylight and tungsten balanced photofloods rated at 250 watts.

Instant solution.

I wrote up a short introduction to color temperature on my crappy website (which is being redesigned, I promise).  It's far from complete, but it will give you a basis from which you can start thinking about color temperature theory.

Link:

http://www.filmmakersunion.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=35&Itemid=1
 
Re: Just a few....bear with me.

J_Barnes,

Thanks. I wanted to go the photoflood route anyway for a few clip lights for the background stuff, so that means I will be buying some FDN's for my halogen worklights to match for key, etc... You can only go low budget but so far huh?

I guess that means I will have to gel the windows with color correct gels with this set up to get the daylight to match these lights, or use bounce cards?

Again, thanks. And if you or any of the other veterans have advice on the other stuff I mentioned, have at it. I'm about to place an order for my camcorder (deck?) and bulbs.

Thanks, V
 
Re: Just a few....bear with me.

Its all what you want your scene to look like. It's rare in a film where all the lights will be corrected to the same color temperature. You want to learn to play with the lights and make them work together to suit the needs of a given scene.

If you want your scene to be completely color neutral, you'd have to gel your windows orange or use daylight balanced photofloods and leave the windows bare.

Other approaches involve using perhaps a 1/4 to 3/4 CTO on the window and leave the room bare...or use a 1/2 CTB on your lights.

You might even like the look of the cool light coming through the windows with a warm interior...it's about personal choice and your "artists eye".

In general, the camera sees daylight in a tungsten scene as almost "super white" rather the directly blue. It's far easier to let blue light into a scene balanced for tungsten then it is to let tungsten light enter a scene balanced for daylight.

I'd answer more in depth, but I've got to take this wad of cash I have down to the rental house...so my mind is preoccupied on this rediculous deposit burning a hole in my khaki's. Besides, I know nothing about consumer cameras, so I can't help.

PS. - I'm nothing close to a verteran, I just have a tiny bit of professional lighting experience.
 
Re: Just a few....bear with me.

Now, do any of you use one to capture with Xpress Pro/ Mojo? Are there any special tweaks you have to do to get it to work, whether capturing 24p or advanced? It's a concern because I have 4.5.1 and the only consumer cams I could find in the deck config. page were the Elura (doesn't specify which) and the zr10 (long gone as far as I know). Avid's site for compatible dv devices doesn't turn up any cheap alternatives that I've found either.
Click to expand...

Now I'm not familiar with your software but it shouldn't matter what make/model the camera is, all long as it's a DV camera with a firewire port when you plug it in it should capture from it no questions asked. It's a standard protocol they all use. As for 24p, it should be able to capture it fine (as everything on the tape is in reality stored as 60i), but I'm not sure if your editor can actually edit in a 24p timeline and treat the files as 24p. Might want to check the Avid forum for that one, I know there's at least 1 version of Avid that can edit 24p, not sure if it's Xpress.
 
Re: Just a few....bear with me.

Think Eternity,

Thanks. I checked out the pv dv on Circuit City's website and it doesn't have pass through or a mic input. I actually went there and took my 24pa recorded tape and played in the pvgs 120, and there it was in all it's strobing glory. So it looks like it works fine on playback. Any body here use the 120 as a capture cam? I thought I read in another post that someone referred to it as a "dud".

Sir Allen,

Xpress Pro 4.5.1 does allow real time reverse pulldown with Mojo as well as editing a 23.97 timeline, so the software will work fine with 24p or advanced. I just want to be sure of a capture mini cam that works for all of you, specifically if you use Xpress Pro and capture with Mojo. Thanks.

Anybody else feel free to chime in. I'm gonna be ordering next week.

Gen Jer Dan and Barry G, still eagerly awaiting your replies.

Thanks to all.

V
 
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