Doug Jensen
Carbonite Member
I can't even remember what the old version looked like. I remember some growing pains after the change, but not the look of the old one
Is the forum slow?
- Thread starter firehawk
- Start date
I can't even remember what the old version looked like. I remember some growing pains after the change, but not the look of the old one
rob norton
Veteran
I'm struggling to get on board Chris. Like Doug, I couldn't tell you what the old site looked like. The actual transition was rough but it's all good now. Plus as if that would upset people so much that they would vow to never check back in the future.
What about the forum feeling slower because people hardly post their work anymore?
Peter C.
Veteran
I don't think the forum update had much to do with it. My experience with other forums the pattern of behavior is this younger people join a forum then as they grow older settle into a career there isn't much need to learn and explore. The younger generation entering the industry don't use forums, so as members age and retire the forum users slowly dwindles, at some point there's only a handful of people left and not enough diversity to support a forum. You get a bunch of crabby old guys arguing the minutia of tech.
Also, it says “filmmaking” in the title. If it said “pro video” or something, it might not be so disjointed and confusing.
I was on a thread for the FX3 Cinealta fw2.0 release, and the regular members seemed more interested in non cinema use cases. broadcast, wedding, youtube etc. In fact, one member was surprised i don’t shoot broadcast style interviews. So, if this forum more fully embraced its current membership, it might attract other like minded video professionals. There are plenty of film making sites already, but few for all things pro video tech.
Just a thought.
Doug Jensen
Carbonite Member
As someone who certainly qualifies to be a member of the "Crabby Old Guys" club, I would like to point out that most of us in that club are pretty upbeat about the state of the industry, the work we are doing, the fantastic and amazing gear we now have at our finger tips, the people and clients we work for, etc. In our defense, much of our crabbiness only comes out when have to listen to the "Young Crybabies Club" whine about the world not being fair, the "man" is out to get them, corporations have destroyed everything good, camera manufacturers are deliberately hobbling their products just to spite them, everything should be free, any profit is too much profit, all employees are being taken advantage of, etc. That kind of "victim" attitude really gets old fast and shows nothing but immaturity. It is hard for some us to read that crap and sit on the sidelines.
I'd much rather talk about tech, mastering our gear, building our businesses, and dealing with the world as it is -- not how we dream it should be.
Sincerely,
A Crabby Old Guy
Peter C.
Veteran
Yeah but imagine how boring the forum would be if we all held the same opinions. To some degree we are all prisoners of our perspective. We then filter out things that don't support our thesis and emphasis those that do. This is why you seldom will win an argument because in order to do so you are asking the other person to admit their view of the world is wrong.
cpreston
Veteran
Where are people actually going, now? DVXuser definitely has less traffic, but it also appears that places like reduser has less posts than in the past. I find myself relying on blog style sites like Newsshooter and Cined more. It also seems like there are now FB pages for every piece of equipment as well. I find youtube to fairly tedious as a method of learning information. Are there certain discord or Reddit or other blog sites that people find useful?
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Doug Jensen
Carbonite Member
All true, but conversations about social issues and perceived injustices don't really have much to do with the nuts and bolts of TV/film/video production, do they? The more we stick to facts, the less perspectives and personal agendas matter.
When a thread goes off topic, eventually it alienates most readers and ends up with two or three people arguing over something irrelevant to the topic. Most people stop participating.
DVXuser, as a filmmakers forum has gone off topic and alienated its user base. Now it is just a few people arguing over things that have very little to do with filmmaking. Most people stopped participating.
DVXuser, as a filmmakers forum has gone off topic and alienated its user base. Now it is just a few people arguing over things that have very little to do with filmmaking. Most people stopped participating.
cpreston
Veteran
True. Panasonic needs to hurry up and release its DVX300 so we can get back on topic.
Nice!
That is just more to my point. Dvx is an old camera that few use, and anyone new might not know about. so being a user of the dvx is already a bit of a turn off.
If you get past the name and look at the subline “The online community for filmmaking” then new people get the expectation for one thing, and met with another.
Newshooter, CineD, and Gearspace changed.
LOL. That would temporarilly prompt some discussions on the specific camera.
The forum really is seldom about the DVX line of cameras or filmmaking anymore.
Not only that but DVX cameras are rarely used for film making anymore since most people are using interchangeable large sensor cams of some sort.
cpreston
Veteran
It is a bit interesting the "DVXuser" became "The online community for filmmaking". I'm not sure how many forums like BMCuser and REDuser were created by the group, but DVX became the catchall while others like BMCuser appear to be dead. And then you had forums like Cinema5D and EOSHD that were stuck with the Canon branding while ultimately turning on the brand itself.
In any case, DVXuser is the only consistent forum that I have found for discussing video equipment. I know some people wish this site was more about filmmaking than video equipment. I think CineD and NoFilmSchool and maybe Newsshooter all tried to set up forums but it seems like they've died. DVinfo is mostly dead. And DVXuser has slowed down.
My hunch is that a lot of the discussions that used to be on DVXuser have switched over to FB groups and youtube comments and Reddit forums. I've joined a few of the FB groups and most of them have quite a bit of activity. Also, almost all of the questions can be answered with "read the instructions", so the groups are tedious.
My other suspicion is that there was a huge influx of people into digital filmmaking due to the releases of the DVX100 and 5D, but a lot of those people have matured or moved on. The new market is TikTok and influencer videos and understanding video equipment isn't of much use to that market.
In any case, DVXuser is the only consistent forum that I have found for discussing video equipment. I know some people wish this site was more about filmmaking than video equipment. I think CineD and NoFilmSchool and maybe Newsshooter all tried to set up forums but it seems like they've died. DVinfo is mostly dead. And DVXuser has slowed down.
My hunch is that a lot of the discussions that used to be on DVXuser have switched over to FB groups and youtube comments and Reddit forums. I've joined a few of the FB groups and most of them have quite a bit of activity. Also, almost all of the questions can be answered with "read the instructions", so the groups are tedious.
My other suspicion is that there was a huge influx of people into digital filmmaking due to the releases of the DVX100 and 5D, but a lot of those people have matured or moved on. The new market is TikTok and influencer videos and understanding video equipment isn't of much use to that market.
That’s the new slogan!:
DVXUSER.com
”THE only consistent forum for discussing video equipment”
Absolutely the opposite! I wish the is forum dropped the filmmaking aspect. it is part of the reason this place has an identity crisis. I came here to celebrate a cinema feature added to the FX3 and got asked to supply proof i could shoot a 60min interview. Not exactly an expected experience for a filmmakers forum within a thread about a cinema camera adding more cinema centric firmware. this forum should stop pretending and embrace its current membership and run with that. there are tons of benefits to discussing video tech. Heck, i bet a lot of filmmakers would end up joining just to get insights from the video tech experts here. So many good minds here.
just imho
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filmguy123
Veteran
Yeah it’s an interesting line to ride. The whole “stop focusing on gear” style of posts seem to spring up due to frustration that everyone is discussing gear and not the art of story and technique, and I get that. If you hang here long enough you’d get the idea that no one shoots we just talk specs and all have bad GAS.
I know for me, the creative part of the process is done internally and/or with a team, and I may find videos online or in my library for inspiration. Usually when I have posts or questions they are of the technical nature. Only on occasion do I find I really need help with something creatively in the field. We do have a section of the forum pertaining to that but it doesn’t seem to see the same use as the cafe or industry news sections, and hey, maybe that’s fine.
Whenever someone does share work or ask a creative technique question, there does seem to be engagement - maybe that’s enough?
I suspect all of this is also tied to the fact that 20 years ago when things were first becoming accessible, a lot of people dreamed of being an independent film director, the next Robert Rodriguez. But fast forward to now and most of us still in the industry are shooting paying gigs so we aren’t here asking about how to make sugar glass and fake blood sprays for our homemade action flick. We’re shooting talking heads, live events, and b-roll… which is how we have any money to ask any questions about gear here at all! And I’ve just sort of run out of questions about the craft of shooting a standard interview or b-roll.
And the independent director dream is sort of dead for me. I used to dream about a 90 minute feature, maybe a coming of age movie or a home brewed action flick. But there is such an incredibly overwhelming amount of high production value streaming content now, I don’t really get proud or excited to think of making a 2nd rate low budget poorly acted movie anymore. My own pet project(s) will ultimately be more documentary focused, where I feel the work would actually matter and contribute something into the world that’s not disposable. Maybe I’m pessimistic about being an independent filmmaker, but I also don’t have the feeling that I’m giving up on any dream; more so that I’ve matured into an adult vision of that early dream. When I started out, I was making John woo inspired kung fu shootouts in parking garages. Now I’m telling stories about the refugee crisis, sex trafficking, etc. and that seems more meaningful to me.
Long story short - I suspect there is fair reason why there is less talk of craft and more talk of gear today, not just a bunch of gear heads who don’t shoot as some might posit.
But, all of that said…
As I gear up again after a couple years of pandemic slumber, I will do my part to try and ask + encourage more craft oriented questions. I know I need to improve quite a bit on my color grading, sound, and lighting - and I will say, despite what I wrote above, that for a few years I was very focused on gear, primarily because it was such a time of rapid change and growth in the industry, and because my business was growing and I was building out my kit. It would be healthy to refocus on questions pertaining primarily to quality image and sound creation, not the tools. Maybe that’s not true for all of us, but it is for me.
I know for me, the creative part of the process is done internally and/or with a team, and I may find videos online or in my library for inspiration. Usually when I have posts or questions they are of the technical nature. Only on occasion do I find I really need help with something creatively in the field. We do have a section of the forum pertaining to that but it doesn’t seem to see the same use as the cafe or industry news sections, and hey, maybe that’s fine.
Whenever someone does share work or ask a creative technique question, there does seem to be engagement - maybe that’s enough?
I suspect all of this is also tied to the fact that 20 years ago when things were first becoming accessible, a lot of people dreamed of being an independent film director, the next Robert Rodriguez. But fast forward to now and most of us still in the industry are shooting paying gigs so we aren’t here asking about how to make sugar glass and fake blood sprays for our homemade action flick. We’re shooting talking heads, live events, and b-roll… which is how we have any money to ask any questions about gear here at all! And I’ve just sort of run out of questions about the craft of shooting a standard interview or b-roll.
And the independent director dream is sort of dead for me. I used to dream about a 90 minute feature, maybe a coming of age movie or a home brewed action flick. But there is such an incredibly overwhelming amount of high production value streaming content now, I don’t really get proud or excited to think of making a 2nd rate low budget poorly acted movie anymore. My own pet project(s) will ultimately be more documentary focused, where I feel the work would actually matter and contribute something into the world that’s not disposable. Maybe I’m pessimistic about being an independent filmmaker, but I also don’t have the feeling that I’m giving up on any dream; more so that I’ve matured into an adult vision of that early dream. When I started out, I was making John woo inspired kung fu shootouts in parking garages. Now I’m telling stories about the refugee crisis, sex trafficking, etc. and that seems more meaningful to me.
Long story short - I suspect there is fair reason why there is less talk of craft and more talk of gear today, not just a bunch of gear heads who don’t shoot as some might posit.
But, all of that said…
As I gear up again after a couple years of pandemic slumber, I will do my part to try and ask + encourage more craft oriented questions. I know I need to improve quite a bit on my color grading, sound, and lighting - and I will say, despite what I wrote above, that for a few years I was very focused on gear, primarily because it was such a time of rapid change and growth in the industry, and because my business was growing and I was building out my kit. It would be healthy to refocus on questions pertaining primarily to quality image and sound creation, not the tools. Maybe that’s not true for all of us, but it is for me.
Liam Hall
Veteran
I don't know what you mean by "drop the filmmaking aspect" but FWIW lots of people use FX3's as B or C cams on interview set-ups so, to me it seems a perfectly reasonable question to ask on a gear forum if a particular piece of equipment is capable of delivering in a particular situation.
Peter C.
Veteran
I think the only way to "fix" the forum is to create some sort of connection to the social media sites where current film and video people hang out. Then those people would have to see some value in communicating here. But if forums are viewed as an out of date method of communication (which is probably the case) I don't see anything helping.
I love you. It’s ok, hmm, let’s say this was a community for gay men, and it was run by straight men contributors. Then one day, a guy said, “you probably can’t even find the g spot, dude!”
i’m sorry. that was probably confusing too.
Let’s say this was a forum about football, but a bunch of lazy americans got confused and overran the forum and now it is about NFL. Then someone visits to talk about football and another guy says to him “you probably don’t even know how to throw a pigskin dude!”
dah! i am still being confusing. i’m sorry.
Well written and well said!
I agree, there is a need to talk gear and technique as much as there is a need for art and story. Every single tik toker film maker and sports coverage shooter needs to handle certain situations with technology.
With filmmaking, however, i can throw a stick and hit 15 different people proficient at tech, but none of then have made a good movie yet. So, whenever a forum is titled: “filmmaking” people get tired of hearing about tech because they rarely see it translate to better movies in any direct way.
However, by a forum or magazine being about tech, it doesn’t have to apologize or bow to the “story”.
The community and regular contributors here are fine. a lot of different backgrounds that anyone can learn from.
The last thing an excited new filmmaker is looking for when joining a filmmaking forum, is to talk to people who chose to not do filmmaking.
However, a filmmaker will still visit a forum that is specifically about tech.
does that make sense?
Like you don’t need to start talking about tik tok to get new people here. You just need to be a video tech forum instead of a filmmakers forum. Why would a tik toker go to a forum of broadcast and wedding people under the banner of filmmaking? it doesn’t entirely make sense. but all types of media people would go to a video tech forum.
And it would only require the one inage file used in the upper left hand side of the website to change the words under dvxuser. wouldn’t be a redesign of the website or anything. just a jpg or png replacement. done.