Is majoring in Film in college necessary?!?!?!

Well, the problem is that while I'm at school, I'm always working. Sometimes as many as 80 hours a week between extracurriculars and classwork, but usually closer to 40-60. Toward the end of the semester I got up to 7-8 cups of coffee a day and started smoking cigarettes so now I feel like **** all the time from withdrawl anyhow. I'm not even kidding--film studies is one of the hardest majors at the school I go to and I have tons of other junk in my schedule, too. The other issue is that while I can afford some stuff (my dvx, from cashiering for four months full time), the loans I'm taking out are so massive that I can't afford a lot without driving myself into serious debt post-graduation. (A fellow film studies major says he's lucky to make six dollars an hour.) I'm lucky to have some financial aid, otherwise my education would cost about $200,000--but it's still pretty tough.

During the summer, my parents flip out if I don't have a job all the time, so I'm always working then, too, though usually averaging just 25-30 hours a week. I do what I can though--I read books on cinematography, gaffing, directing, screenwriting, old issues of American Cinematographer, and I've learned After Effects, Final Cut Pro, 3D Studio Max, Photoshop, what have you....doesn't do much good.
 
Policar - dont take this the wrong way at all - cause i mean it as advice.

Change your attitude about all this - yes you have debt - yes you work a lot - yes life isnt easy.

Ok - so all of that is a given - you cant change that right now - but there are things you can do and change.

There is a quote somewhere that goes something like "we all have the same time in a day that Einstein, Thomas Edison etc had". So we can all acheive greatness within that time.

Pick up your camera that you worked so hard for and shoot a film, and edit it, and then repeat.

I work a full time job, manage my production company, am financing a feature film, am shooting shorts - is it easy - NO WAY - NOT AT ALL - NOT FOR A MOMENT. would i have it any other way - NO - cause I am moving forward.

ok - i am off my soapbox - sorry - hope this helps somehow.
 
I went to USC film school and graduated 2 years ago.

The only thing I have to show for it is a $27,000 bill and a hot, sweet girlfriend.

They didn't help me AT ALL with work afterwards...I found my job on my own and the skills that I use at my job, USC did NOT teach me jack..

Film school is what you make of it. Anyone can pickup a camera and watch a good flick and learn the fundamentals of filmmaking. It doesn't take 4 years of school and 120K worth of debt to get to the same place.. The only benefit film school did for me was that it prepared me for life in Los Angeles.

Bah humbug..

Plus, the majority of USC Film students I encounted there were pretentious film nerds who didn't know jack about jack..

What film school doesn't ask to see your work prior to acceptance???? USC of course!! Un-freakin-believable the lack of talent in that place.

Enough of my ranting

If you want to be a filmmaker, move to LA, work in the industry like every other shmuck, rent movies, and sit in on classes at USC. SIT IN!!!!!! FREE!!!!!
 
Smelni, you're not me and your situation is not similar enough to mine for you to act all high and mighty beause you're shooting stuff and I'm not. I'm stuck on a college campus, no car, very little money, literally no free time. I went there to learn about film and it's totally killed my ability to work on my own. (Although I've learned a lot, to be fair.) Granted, most semesters aren't that bad, but it's a totally different situation. Congrats on getting your stuff off the ground, but just because hard work pays off for you, don't assume it does for everyone. (Though this summer, before I get a job, I'm going to try to shoot some stuff and it is my fault for not taking advantage of the few free weeks I have between school and work.)

I'm surprised to hear that about USC. I was dying to go there but my parents wanted me to go to a "liberal arts college" but that makes me think twice about getting an MFA there (or somewhere similar) which is my current goal.
 
Policar

Their MFA program is supposed to be hands down, awesome. The best in the world actually. I have a few friends that went through the MFA and they loved it. All you do for three years is eat, drink, sleep, dream film. I am talking about my specific experiences with USC undergraduate studies. That was a crock. I would re-think the MFA though. If I could rewind time, I would have gone to a small school from my bachelors then transferred to USC's MFA if I still felt that I needed more schooling..
 
Policar - i am very sorry if i came off as high and mighty- that is not at all what i intended to do. I was hoping to be a bit inspiring,

The thing is, if you really have no time to do what you need to do, then advice will not help. What I am trying to say is that you, or anyone else, should and CAN find a way to succeed in what they want to do. You can find a way.

Thats all that I am saying. You are right - our situations are very different - and so is everyone elses - But the only person who can find a way to make your situation work is you.

So again I am sorry - I have no idea what you go through on a day to day basis and I am not saying I do.

humble apologies
 
No, it's okay. I must have come off as too harsh, too, and I apologize. A lot of my free time was actually spent crewing for other student films, which is why I was so busy, so I guess I did get to do some work--just on nothing of my own or at least nothing where I had significant input. Next year hopefully I'll at least get to work as a DP on something.

I guess I'm just whining about how odd the whole idea of film school is, particularly film studies, which is what I'm majoring in because my parents didn't want me at a "professional school." Anyhow, I understand what you're trying to say and I agree, I'm just exhasperated currently. Ah well, it's winter break and I do have some free time now....maybe I'll go shoot something after all.
 
film school

film school

i went to film school.. found out the hard way that it is a waste of time and money..
i am now at a university majoring in communications with an ephasis in film/tv... this way i have a real degree to fall back on.. but im still taking all the fun classes
 
the-lyons-den.com said:
One HUGE benefit to being in film school ... is that if you want to work in FILM that they pay for the stock and equipment.
That's a false benefit - your tuition pays for the film stock and equipment, whether you go to film school or DIY you're gonna have to pay.

Another route that may be more beneficial is to get experience working first, then take targeted classes to fill in your education. I did this with my computer career and it was way more beneficial, plus many times I got my employer to foot the bill.
 
Michael Wisniewski said:
That's a false benefit - your tuition pays for the film stock and equipment, whether you go to film school or DIY you're gonna have to pay.

Another route that may be more beneficial is to get experience working first, then take targeted classes to fill in your education. I did this with my computer career and it was way more beneficial, plus many times I got my employer to foot the bill.

nice!
 
From what I've heard, it doesn't seem necessary to take completely surround yourself with film in college, however I choose to. :)
 
the-lyons-den.com said:
One HUGE benefit to being in film school (may not apply to all film schools but at least to FSU students) is that if you want to work in FILM that they pay for the stock and equipment. Which to me, is the major reason I am using a DVX and not using 16 or 35 or whatever - the cost.

By FSU are you talking about Full Sail? They're a film tech and recording school. They are great at what they do, but not the same thing as SC or NYU. My wife went to Full Sail and I go to SC, so we've compared notes :)

BTW, tech schools are where they will give you film etc. That ain't happenin at USC. Sure they give it to you, then they tack a fee to your bill :) If your only motivation for going to school is to shoot 16 or 35, go rent a package, it will be cheaper in the long run.

the-lyons-den.com said:
Do you (or your parents) have a lot of money and movie-making is definitely what you want to do? Then I say go to school.

umm.. no they don't. I payed/pay for all my undergrad and grad education by working, getting loans, grands, scholarships, etc. If you want an education, go for it, money is only a limit if you make it one.

the-lyons-den.com said:
Personally I went to college for something else, Computer Science, and now I have an IT-like job and some $... Sometimes I wish I would have went to film school, but then again I like having money NOW too.

Again, what do you want to do in life? I tried corporate life. I wanted to die. That's just me. Do you like money more than learning about or making film? If yes, then go for the civilian job. You really have to know what you like. But if you are "wishing you would" have done something else, watch out, that means you're settling. America loves it when people settle. Before you know it you'll have worked 25 years at the same place, wishes well tucked away, three kids, big pink house in Phoenix, Arizona, same job, bigger TV, same 10 shows you watch every night, and more hamburgers and beer in your gut. :)

the-lyons-den.com said:
I also find, in general, that film school students have a bit of an attitude towards those of us that are making movies that havent spent the time in the classroom for it.

I'm glad that you generalized all film students into one lump sum. Is it them with a superiority complex or you with an inferiority complex? Your sentence reads a little defensive. Are there jerks in film school, sure. Are there jerks out of film school, sure. Are there good people everywhere working hard just to try and do what they love, sure. We're all humans, don't judge or generalize.

If you go to film school, or any school for that matter, you have to make it what you want to make it. You have to make sure it's what you want. If you don't know what you want yet, that's ok, search for it. Maybe it is a regular job and a steady income. If that really makes you happy, then go for it. But if you ever feel like you are "settling" on something... don't do it man. Fight that, that's the easy way, the common way. It's tough in this place. This country does not reward or respect the vast majority of artists, not our culture. When I was in theater school, it was amazing how many kids stories were about their parents being in shock that they chose theater over law or something. Parents were scared about what? Their kid not fitting in? Not making enough money? Not being respected. Come on.

So I can see where "fitting in" may seem like the right choice, the safe choice. It's up to you man. Do what feel is right, but trust your gut. And ignore generalizations and simplifications. Read between the lines.
 
Policar said:
I'm a film studies major and it's pretty useless in terms of learning to make movies or getting a job. You do learn a lot about watching movies, though, and about how to get 20 grand in debt.

20 grand in debt? I envy you. Unfortunately, I owe a LOT more dough for school. A LOT more. ugh.
 
in general hollywood doesn't really care if you have a degree .. for most production jobs with or without a college degree you'll start off as a runner or PA .. bottom line in hollywood is WHO you know and what you have to SHOW .. if you have nothing to show you're a PA .. if you have something to show you're probably still a PA BUT you'll meet persons on the crew that you can show your reel/work.. it will take time to work your way into the business .. if you can't take hearing NO for days/weeks/months then do NOT go to hollywood.. you have to put yourself out there ... hollywood can be very creative, you can learn something new everyday,
and it is very rerwarding ...

college is more then just a film degree .. you have to take classes in other areas so take advantage of getting the most useful info .. Hollywood is a BUSINESS - learn some basic 's on it ... the film business is fast .. you meet persons on crew , shoot end - on to the next crew = long time friends in hollywood are few .. i think you find many friends from college are life time ... also depending on the film school you may have some contacts as your student friends work their way up in the film business ( a good number of USC & UCLA studends end up in film business)

i have a BA/MA .. when i went to hollywood back in the early 80's -after 2 weeks i took my degree off my resume and have never listed it since. i went to LA with the understanding that i was going to give it 2 years to learn all i could about
lighting.. it took about 3 months before i was working steady ( PA , art dept , casting , electrician , gaffer ) any job where i could observe lighting .. on weekends and when ever i could i shot short films ( for free on 16/35mm) after 2 years i had a sample reel and i started shooting commercials ..at end of 2 years i moved away from hollywood but kept a LA address/phone # and worked out of there till 1997 ...

the normal hollywood way to DP is loader, 2nd AC , 1st AC , operator - DP ..
i just started shooting ... A DP does not need to know how to put a lens on the camera , how to load , or even how to turn it ON/OFF = which i don't know any of em ... so you can just do it ( your specialty) or start at bottom and work your way up - there's are many ways to get to where you want to be .... hang in there
 
There is a lot of decent info in the film school vs no film school threads
on here. Having said that, there is an aspect that I havent really seen
pointed out yet.. where did people end up, having taken specific paths.

I've worked on a few hollywood films, mainly as a member of the
camera union in a visual effects capacity and I've noticed three things.

The bulk of folks I worked have been in the industry since the 80's
on average. They were generally 'self-taught' and came up through
the ranks via a LOT of different paths.

Of those in my age group (now mid-thirties), the vast majority
went to some sort of formal film program... ususally film schools. I
myself am in this camp.

Those that 'came up through the ranks' tended to have family
contacts already established in the industry OR they grew up
in California and had family and social connections that got them
in.

The whole film school/no film school question really has at its
core, what do you want to REALLY end up doing? If you want
to make no/low budget indies on the side, while doing regional
production, possibly even some TV work for the growing cable
market... I'd say you can pretty much get that camera, start
shooting and build toward that goal w/o much in the form
of film school or formal schooling.

On the other hand.. if narrative film, either in or out of the
Hollywood system is your goal, you're really stacking the deck
against you w/o film school and even more important, some
serious time working and being in Los Angeles. The 'success'
stories we hear are simply dwarfed by the 'silent' volume of
working professionals in southern california and a very short
list of other 'production' cities.

If you werent 'born' into the industry and arent already a
local... I'd say film school, ideally in LA, is a good investment.
 
I didn't go to film school, I think I'm doing all right. I don't think film school would hurt you, except for paying a lot of money in student loans, not being able to find a job, going broke, and screwing up your credit, but that's just me.
 
smelni said:
Policar - dont take this the wrong way at all - cause i mean it as advice.

Change your attitude about all this - yes you have debt - yes you work a lot - yes life isnt easy.

Ok - so all of that is a given - you cant change that right now - but there are things you can do and change.

There is a quote somewhere that goes something like "we all have the same time in a day that Einstein, Thomas Edison etc had". So we can all acheive greatness within that time.

Pick up your camera that you worked so hard for and shoot a film, and edit it, and then repeat.

I work a full time job, manage my production company, am financing a feature film, am shooting shorts - is it easy - NO WAY - NOT AT ALL - NOT FOR A MOMENT. would i have it any other way - NO - cause I am moving forward.

ok - i am off my soapbox - sorry - hope this helps somehow.


Amen!!!

Kev
 
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