I hope you can help me. MKH416 or MKH50?

canciones

canciones

New member
Hi everyone, I'm new here, I am a student from Argentina. I like the forums and how this community works. Also here there are people who know a lot and you can learn a lot. I have several questions for you, I hope you can help me.
I want to purchase equipment and I have some doubts...

I'm buying a microphone and thought in MKH416, because I think is a versatile mic.
Actually I need is mainly capturing indoor dialogues, for that thought in MKH 50. Is my first microphone, I don´t know whether to buy 416 versatile mic or internal dialogue mic. The work I am doing is taking direct sound in shorts.

Another question: In the case that purchase 416, what is the best shockmount? inv7? K-GPSS?
Boompole: K-tek KEG60 or KEG100? Uncabled or not?

Finally, I need headphones for taking direct sound. I have the opportunity to buy HD25-1 II.
I want one that isolate much sound and work well with a DR-100mkII.

Excuse my english y muchas gracias.

Diego.
 
Some shotguns can work well indoors, but the mkh416 is from what I've heard not one of them. I would go for the 50.

The HD25 (not the SP-version) isolates a lot and is a good headphone - it's something of a standard in europe.
 
David W. Jones said:
Depends on the location, but in general I tend to use the MKH50 indoors and the MKH60 outdoors.
Click to expand...

This is a good choice as the 50 and 60 are pretty-well identical except for the polar-pattern.

Personally I would never buy a 416 nowadays and would go directly to the new MKH 8060 which is much better (and better indoors).

You are right in your suggestion of the HD 25-1 II headphones.
 
Thanks guys.
Using a MKH 50 internal audio in a boom. What is the range of distance from the actor speaks? I can do a long shot?
 
Canciones,

It doesn't really matter what mic you use, the farther away you are, the worse it gets.

Another wild card might be the Sanken CS3e. Several here have mentioned it as an all in one solution - go to mic, even indoors. Wishing I could afford one.

Grant
 
canciones said:
Thanks guys.
Using a MKH 50 internal audio in a boom. What is the range of distance from the actor speaks? I can do a long shot?
Click to expand...

About 1.9 times the distance you would use with an omni.

A cardioid would be 1.7 times omni distance.

IE: a cardioid at 1.7 metres or a hyper-cardioid at 1.9 metres would pick up the same sound as an omni at 1 metre.

In the same situation a short gun would be at 2.2 metres.
 
Hi guys.

ggrantlly the Sanken CS3e looks very good, but I got $1200 to buy only one mic and shockmount.

John Willett said:
Personally I would never buy a 416 nowadays and would go directly to the new MKH 8060 which is much better (and better indoors). .
Click to expand...

Could you explain more this please?
 
canciones said:
John Willett said:
Personally I would never buy a 416 nowadays and would go directly to the new MKH 8060 which is much better (and better indoors).
Click to expand...


Could you explain more this please?
Click to expand...


The 416 is an ancient mic. Introduced in about 1975 as the phantom powered version of the earlier 415 - the design is almost 50 years old.

It does have a lot more off-axis lobes than the newer MKH 60 and 8060.

Someone at the BBC who had used only the MKH 60 and never used a 416, the first time he was given a 416 thought it was faulty as it was "low output and noisy".

The newer mics have a much lower self-noise than the 416, they also have much lower distortion due to the symmetrical capsules (the 416 is an old mic. without a symmetrical capsule) and modern design techniques mean that the interference tubes on the newer mics are much better designed and have less off-axis side lobes.

Today I would buy the MKH 8060 - even though the 8060 has the same length interference tube as the 416 it is much shorter in overall length - and if you dispense with the XLR module and use the remote cable instead it can be even shorter. :thumbup:
 
Mr. Willett,

Would you recommend the 8060 or the Sanken CS3e as preferred for outdoor use? I know they are both good options.

John Willett said:
This is a good choice as the 50 and 60 are pretty-well identical except for the polar-pattern.

Personally I would never buy a 416 nowadays and would go directly to the new MKH 8060 which is much better (and better indoors).

You are right in your suggestion of the HD 25-1 II headphones.
Click to expand...
 
canciones said:
Thanks so much. Very interesting.


What do you think of MKH50 vs MKH 8050?
Click to expand...

The MKH 50 is ruler flat and falls off very fast above 20kHz, the 8050 is a little more "oganic" and extends to about 50kHz.

They both have a 16mm diameter diaphragm (despite the 8000 series being in a 19mm dia. body).

I think you will find these PDFs good reading:-

The MKH Story

VDT magazine - Microphone technology today and tomorrow - Part 1

The first one is written by the designer of the MKH microphones and the second is an interview with him and others involved in the design.

I don't have an MKH 50 or 8050, but I *do* have pairs of the MKH 40 and 8040 (and also pairs of MKH 20, 30, 800 and 8020).
 
lasikdenver said:
Mr. Willett,

Would you recommend the 8060 or the Sanken CS3e as preferred for outdoor use? I know they are both good options.
Click to expand...

For outdoor use I would always go for an MKH series microphone over any other as they are RF condensers and are not affected by moisture like normal AF condenser mics.
 
Thanks John Willet.

Appreciate that you take the time to answer. People always ask the same questions about mic, year after year.

excuse my English, is a 6 38 am here on a Saturday and I'm too young jaja. Also I do not speak English very well.
 
canciones said:
Thanks John Willet.

Appreciate that you take the time to answer. People always ask the same questions about mic, year after year.

excuse my English, is a 6 38 am here on a Saturday and I'm too young jaja. Also I do not speak English very well.
Click to expand...


Thanks, no problem.

3 hours behind the UK - so that puts you probably in South America - Argentina, Brazil, French Guiana or Suriname - or Greenland or the Falklands??? :thumbsup:
 
John Willett said:
About 1.9 times the distance you would use with an omni.

A cardioid would be 1.7 times omni distance.

IE: a cardioid at 1.7 metres or a hyper-cardioid at 1.9 metres would pick up the same sound as an omni at 1 metre.

In the same situation a short gun would be at 2.2 metres.
Click to expand...

John,
What about the MKH 8070 - which is supposed to be long shotgun?
 
Many pro mixers including myself, find limited use for a long shotgun, though it's nice to have when needed. If one can only afford one or two mics, I would recommend: 1. a short shotgun. 2. a hyper cardioid for interiors. 3. additional funds would be wisly spent on lavs, unless for a series special application.
 
John Willett said:
For outdoor use I would always go for an MKH series microphone over any other as they are RF condensers and are not affected by moisture like normal AF condenser mics.
Click to expand...

Mr. Willett,

At B&H they recommend the Rycote Windshield kit 4 with the 8060 but based on the length of the mic it seems that a Windshield kit 3 might be a better match, do you have a recommendation? Thank you for all your experience and advice.
 
lasikdenver said:
Mr. Willett,

At B&H they recommend the Rycote Windshield kit 4 with the 8060 but based on the length of the mic it seems that a Windshield kit 3 might be a better match, do you have a recommendation? Thank you for all your experience and advice.
Click to expand...


B&H are wrong.

For the 8060 with the standard MZX XLR module, Rycote recommend the Kit 3 - see HERE.

If you use the MZF filter with the standard MZX XLR module, it would still be a Kit 3 - see HERE.

You only need the Kit 4 if you have the MZD 8000 AES24 digital module - see HERE.

If you use the MZL remote cable, you can actually go very small and use a Kit 2 - see HERE.

To be really light and mobile, I would use the remote cable and go for a Kit 2, personally. But otherwise it's a Kit 3 unless you are going digital.

Rycote list all the part numbers on the links.

John
 
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