How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key"

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

I'm not the biggest fan of MIDI, but that's just my personal preference. I think that recording an out of tune piano would be the best bet. Just go to your local university's music department, and go to the piano practice rooms. I'm sure some of those pianos will be out of tune...at least they were where I went to school.

-Dave
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

I agree, a high school would really achieve the result!!
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

If I were to do this, I'd load up a piano SoundFont in Vienna, detune some of the notes in one direction and some in others, then save it.

Then play the MIDI with a device that can use SoundFonts, of course.  ;)

Dan

EDIT: Actually, if I was smart, I'd ask a piano tuner how a piano goes out of tune...randomly? All in one direction? But by different amounts?

If I had to guess, I'd say the wrapped strings go sharp while the plain strings go flat.
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

You know it's been so long since I've worked with SoundFonts I completely forgot about that. THAT, GenJerDan, is an excellent suggestion!!

I'd still try to figure out a way to make a few "clunky" notes though...

Pianos don't tend to go sharp, even the wrapped strings slip and stretch but they may slip and stretch less so they maintain their original tuning longer and may sound sharp because of this.

Matt
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&a

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&a

[quote author=MattC link=board=audio;num=1101629888;start=15#23 date=11/30/04 at 08:00:47]Pianos don't tend to go sharp, even the wrapped strings slip and stretch but they may slip and stretch less so they maintain their original tuning longer and may sound sharp because of this.  
Matt[/quote]

I was just guessing based on made-up-physics.  :)  High-end loses tension due to stretching of thin strings, low end then gets more tension because frame isn't being compressed as much.  Most likely nonsense.

But this is coming from a guy who used to put thumbtacks on the hammer felts to get that honky-tonk sound.  :D

As to "clunky" notes. Hmmm... A ring modulator would do it for you, but I can't think of a way to get just one note in the midst of the others to do it.

Dan
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

..I like dans idea as well.  Its doing the same thing that MAttC and I suggested, only editing the actual software instrument rather than the midi file. either way would be really easy. it should only take about 5 minutes or less to go through the scale, and detune each note you want either way you do it.. only if you do it like dan suggests, you would be able to use that out of tune instrument  any time you wanted from then on, instead of having to go through and "de-tune" the midi file on any other thing you wanted to do.   its a great idea.  

once you have a nice out of tune midi file, or a software or real out of tune piano. play the song..whether its live on the out of tune intrument youve created through software, or a real out of tune intrument.. or just being played back from the out of tune midi file -    record the song as a 32bit 192k master in Audition or Cubase or whatever Audio recording/engineering  program youd like to use, and tweak your effects and mix from there to a final output in the format of your choice.

I completely agree with MattC that you should not fear MIDI.  midi is DEFINITELY your friend.   its very very easy to use and learn, and is probably the single most powerful composing tool  since it was made. most people dont understand midi beyond the crappy sounds it makes from their soundblaster 16 or whatever, but in reality its very powerful, fast, and easy to use and learn. it would be well worth you time to learn  how to use it  for the purpose of this project, and any future projects you have involving creating music.
:)



edit: as far as how to go about creating certain notes on the instrument that clunk or make any other sond you want. you would create a multi-timbral instrument(which is an instrument that is capeable of playing different samples or different combinations of samples depending on: the velocity which you strike the key- the hold pressure applied to the key after it is depressed- the time between attack and release of the key- the release speed- what sort of pitch bend you apply- whether or not the notes are played overlapped - and alot of other factors... anyway you wouldnt have to get into to all that, you would just assign a clunky piano key sound or whatever sound you want to play to the notes that you want to clunk on another layer of the instrument, and then that note on the instrument would play the piano note + the clunk that you put there. by default the clunk should play right away so it sounds at the beginning of the key strike overt the top of the piano note there. ..so it would sound like a clunky piano key.

...so to simplify this blather.. just add another layer to the instrument you make, and use a clunk sound.. then specify only certain notes that that layers sound will play with. ..you would also have to transpose all notes on the clunk layer to one single note..(should take about 5 seconds) say c4 this way the clunk wont be really high if its on a high key,, and really low if its on a low key.


if you are detuning a midi file. you would just copy that one single note line for the whole song(this is done in one little click) then paste that into a new midi track. this will make a midi track that only has that one note every time it was played in the song. -copy each other note you want to sound lunky to the same new midi track.. so all the notes that clunk are in the second track. then make the patch for the second track a clunk.. so each time those notes are played on the original detuned piano track.. they will be played on the "clunk" track as well making a clunky key sound. ..you would also have to transpose all notes on the clunk track to one single note..(should take about 5 seconds) say c4 this way the clunk wont be really high if its on a high key,, and really low if its on a low key.


hope all this makes sense.. ..its pretty simple once you get into midi a little
 
Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Re: How to make mp3 of piano sound "off key&q

Great post Neil.

Remember guys not all soundfonts are the same, some are more lame than others and generally I try to stay away from them, but for this purpose, it's a fantastic idea.

So Matthew, how have you gotten on with this little project?

Matt
 
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