How much for Netflix?

Brian_Rice

Brian_Rice

Carbonite Member
So I've always wondered, how much does Netflix pay indies? (And is it less or more when the film is a Play It Now?)

I remember a while back when The Guild was just getting on Netflix they sent out a message to everyone to please put their disc in queue as that would increase their profits. (Though that may have been prior to them being Play It Now).

Anyone have any experience with Netflix?

Thanks!

:)
 
Tough finding specifics on this, but this indie blog talks about Netflix purchasing 1/3 to 1/2 as many DVDs as people have in their queues and about 1,000 (possibly) being the number for a small film.

http://www.diysucks.com/2011/02/secrets-of-netflix-distribution-and-revenue.html

That seems odd to me, though. Like, if Netflix is willing to purchase DVDs from you, why wouldn't you put it as an ADD-only DVD and then switch to PLAY IT NOW down the road for the tiny additional streaming profits? I see most indie filmmakers putting their films up in the Play It Now section without even starting in the ADD-only section.

Perhaps X amount of people have to have your film in their queue before Netflix is willing to purchase X amount of DVDs? Maybe if you don't meet that quota then your only option is Play It Now. And in PIN it sounds like you get some insignificant dollar amount depending on how often the film is streamed.

That number shouldn't be such a challenge to locate. Like, how much per unique stream does the filmmaker make?
 
Reading this article just left me vomiting in my mouth a little. lol I've assumed for awhile that Netflix was a terrible option for indies. I didn't realize just how terrible. Here's a bit from the blog.


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And instead of rental stores like Blockbuster ordering several thousands of copies of indie DVD's for their many individual stores we now have NetFlix ordering typically just a measly 60 DVD's for the entire nation! The latest rumor is that NetFlix has actually stopped ordering new indie DVD's. All of this amounts to huge lost revenue for indie filmmakers. Still thinking about going to film school? Still thinking about remortgaging the home to finance a movie? Are you crazy?​



Seems like the best path will continue to be 1) enter festivals 2) if no reputable distro is found, sell on Amazon and 3) don't ever rent.

Honestly for the indie, self distro renting seems like lost revenue. The person who was willing to rent your film via Amazon for 2.99 is probably just as likely to purchase your film for 9.99.

I think if you're going to rent your film, you might as well just give it away like the folks at Ink did and *hope* that people will turn around and buy your film in support. I bought the film after watching it on Netflix Play It Now, but I've a vested interest in indie filmmakers. The average viewer might not feel that same vested interest.

I still believe that the best route for the self made indie, if they believe they are not going to be able to find distribution for their product (and you should probably know that before you shoot even the first frame, right?) the best course of action is a free web series and then a film based on that web series. If you can combine crowdfunding with your strategy (as have many very successful indie crowdfunding campaigns), if you've got a decent built-in audience, I see no reason why an indie filmmaker can't have a completely decent career navigating this path. I've felt for a long while that if The Guild decided tomorrow to hang up the web series and just start making direct to DVD films, they'd probably create a windfall of cash for themselves. But assuming they have a relatively lucrative deal with Microsoft, such a move might not be relevant.

Another approach I see people do are behind the scenes webseries that follow the creation of a film.
 
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I think Netflix now just pays a one or two year license to have unlimited streaming of your product via their service. There's no per-view price or anything. I would assume the amount of the license varies greatly depending on names, talent, known entities, genre, rating, production value, etc. It seems nearly anyone can get their stuff on Netflix, so I'd assume the prices are all over the map. Nobody's in business to lose money.
 
I recently talked with a director who's film got onto Netflix. Initially they were self distributing and Netflix offered them something like 5K for 1 year of streaming. After they started getting more festival buzz and got picked up by a distributor who then did a group deal with Netflix his cut for 1 year went up to like 15K. In the end it's always a case by case negotiation where the more percieved demand there is for the film the higher price you can command at the bargaining table.
 
Good information guys, thanks for the feedback.

It does seem that Netflix is the place to go when you've literally exhausted nearly all possible sales.

I like the overall message that an indie should never make their film available to rent, they should only ever make their film available for purchase.
 
Netflix ordered about 1300 copies of my film. You get a pretty great price per copy, but obviously they only pay once for each DVD they buy. Haven't gotten another order for quite a while...I think I'm maxed.

Licenses totally depend name actors, box office, festival success, etc. Basically anything that proves your film is worth something. Honestly based on my research, smaller indie movies can benefit from being available on streaming early, with DVD sales being boosted. I look forward to mine getting to streaming, because it's likely to give me a bit of a boost.
 
Kyle, do you have a Netflix streaming deal in the pipeline, or is that something you have yet to talk to your distro about?
 
KyleProhaska said:
Netflix ordered about 1300 copies of my film. You get a pretty great price per copy, but obviously they only pay once for each DVD they buy. Haven't gotten another order for quite a while...I think I'm maxed.

Licenses totally depend name actors, box office, festival success, etc. Basically anything that proves your film is worth something. Honestly based on my research, smaller indie movies can benefit from being available on streaming early, with DVD sales being boosted. I look forward to mine getting to streaming, because it's likely to give me a bit of a boost.
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How long ago did they purchase the hard copy DVDs from you? From what I've been reading it looks like Netflix has almost completely stopped buying hard copies from indies and most times maxing out at around 60 purchases.

I think streaming only makes sense if you're willing to give the product away for free anyway as a means to promote yourself or your product/series. To me Netflix streaming is like a more mainstream Youtube/Hulu. I have a love/hate relationship with Netflix streaming. On the one hand I think most of their streaming catalog is made up of crap, on the other hand there are some films (like Ink, as I mentioned previously) that I probably would have never seen had it not been for the streaming option.

I still believe that Netflix streaming is where films go to die (or, in some rare cases, be reborn), but if you've exhausted all other potential profits and are looking for what could turn out to be a new spark, I do think it's a better (more reputable) option than just putting it up on Youtube.
 
It's not where films go to die, at all. A film in the Christian market called The Encounter, was put on streaming immediately around release time (as do all the releases from PureFlix Entertainment) and it took off gathering more then 120,000 ratings by now, and its DVD sales have been stellar. At least in the Christian market, making yourself available on streaming seems to give you a tremendous boost, because lots of people buying in the market want to know what the movie is before buying. They already have a hard time paying normal prices for things (annoying I know).

They didn't purchase the DVDs all at once, it was in stages. They only ordered 120 at first, and that was because as soon as they added it to their system, I asked every friend I had online and offline whether they'd planned to buy the film or not to add it to their queue box, so they had people adding it from all around the country...which proved demand. Wasn't too long after they ordered quite a few more and I got more bank. The last order I got was last fall, and I think they have enough now to keep up with the demand. A decent amount are rented every month, but just enough for the amount they've ordered thus far to satisfy.

Maybe streaming is the last thing on the list for a lot of bigger movies, but smaller indies can thrive on it IMO.
 
Michael Traven said:
Kyle, do you have a Netflix streaming deal in the pipeline, or is that something you have yet to talk to your distro about?
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Well I did sell off the VOD rights to FilmBuff, so I do need to work with them to get it placed on there for streaming now, but they're pretty easy to work with. I probably could've gotten it placed without them, but I needed them for a few of the other avenues at the time, so I compromised to get that advantage.

Also you don't have to give it away for free. With a decent record of sales and such or proof the movie has a fan base (in my films case, 280,000+ fans on Facebook) I can leverage it all to get a better streaming license price. It's all about the selling points. Also when you're spending lower amounts on movies, these "small" deals are actually very helpful. Peanuts for a lot of people, but for me, at this point in the game, anything I can get from Netflix is all gravy...so it goes right into the bank or savings. Win/Win for me.
 
KyleProhaska said:
It's not where films go to die, at all. A film in the Christian market called The Encounter, was put on streaming immediately around release time (as do all the releases from PureFlix Entertainment) and it took off gathering more then 120,000 ratings by now, and its DVD sales have been stellar.
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Ha!...I cut the trailer for that film. Hopefully that contributed to it's success. The film must have done well because I just cut the trailer for part 2.
 
Batutta said:
Ha!...I cut the trailer for that film. Hopefully that contributed to it's success. The film must have done well because I just cut the trailer for part 2.
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You're kidding...very odd they're going out of their post-house to have the trailers cut. They spent more dollars on part 2...nice locations. Still feels like corn to me. Oh well.

My film recently went on Netflix streaming and has done pretty well so far based on the surge in ratings. I haven't seen my DVD sales spike though. In fact, it hasn't helped them at all from what I can tell, but I did come out on streaming right as the yearly low was about to hit in Christian DVD sales...meaning summer. When the movie hit Cable VOD and things of the sort, my DVD sales skyrocketed. I was able to secure a 1-year license for $10K...still have yet to be paid by FilmBuff but I've been in close contact. Will let you all know when the check comes in.

Don't ever make a movie and bank on the revenue from this stuff to pay you back IMO. It's a last resort including the DVDs. I was really fortunate to have 1300 eventually ordered, and they haven't ordered any in about a year. I'm assuming 1300 is more then enough for the traffic the film gets. Still the revenue from those discs matches my streaming so it's a decent chunk of change.
 
Brian_Rice said:
And instead of rental stores like Blockbuster ordering several thousands of copies of indie DVD's for their many individual stores we now have NetFlix ordering typically just a measly 60 DVD's for the entire nation! The latest rumor is that NetFlix has actually stopped ordering new indie DVD's. All of this amounts to huge lost revenue for indie filmmakers. Still thinking about going to film school? Still thinking about remortgaging the home to finance a movie? Are you crazy?
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This is why video stores like Blockbuster are falling by the wayside. They can't keep buying thousands of copies of an indie film to stock stores in the hopes that some of them will rent. It just isn't the optimal business model anymore. If Blockbuster is going to stay in business as a video store, they would sooner or later have to stop this practice and focus on the movies they KNOW are going to rent over and over again. The market is more competitive than ever. Indie filmmakers have to learn to adjust, just like everyone else.
 
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