Hitting a wall & Trouble plotting out my stories

J

JJ Alexander

Active member
I have two script stories I am working on. Each very different from the other.
One is a big "Chinatown" type story in which a cop thinks he is working on a small case that becomes huge. As the cop gets deeper into the case it reveals secrets to him about his own family that are unpleasant but ultimately make him a better person.

The other story I have mentioned here before. It is just two characters (a black guy and a white guy) in one indoor location ( a closed pool room). They are locked in with no way out for the next 8 hours. It's about the many forms of racism. The pool playing is very much part of the narrative and will be at an extremely high professional level and not simply for excitement purposes.

In both stories I have hit a point in creating my beat sheet or plotting out my story where I don't know what's next in the story.

In the first story I got as far as the start of Act 2 (beats and plot points) and I just hit a wall with my imagination.
In the second story I'm only 15 pages in and the same thing happens.

A friend said I need to get more specific with my characters goals and objectives and obstacles also more detailed char. description. I feel I know the chars. very well.

Since I'm having the same problem twice I know it's a big thing I'm not doing correctly.

Anybody have ideas what I can do to get my stories going?

If necessary I'm happy to give more story details.

Thanks,

JJ
 
I think I agree with your friend.

You say that you know your characters very well, but maybe that is preventing you from making the changes necessary to make their stories as compelling as possible.

Try rebuilding your characters from a thematic perspective, what they are trying to do and why, and who is trying to stop them and why. You can probably keep a lot of what you all ready have, but you need to look at it from the foundation up. Maybe you are missing something simple that will allow you to change your character's story a little bit, and make it more exciting.
 
Make REALLY detailed bios for the characters if you haven't already. And even beyond that, think of them as real people not just characters and why they're doing what they're doing. The idea of rethinking it from the ground up is good advice. Also watch watch watch movies. Not for copying purposes obviously but you'd be surprised with the very minor details of certain films that can inspire you to take your own film in a whole new direction. Not that I'm the best person to give advice on this subject, being an amateur myself, but these are things that have helped me in the past when I've gotten stuck. Hope this helps.
 
I have heard it said that sometimes a writer does not know what to write because s/he does not know what to write. In other words, research is needed, to better know the characters and the story world in which the story takes place.
 
Two things: First, you have to BELIEVE IN the story you are telling. Ask yourself "how does this jibe with my world-view ?" E.g. if you believe that people don't change, that they are only unmasked, then write something that reflects this--a classical tragedy or an odyssey story. If you believe ppl are basically evil, this is a theme you can explore in a "Chinatown" type of script. ETC.

Two: I walk my two Bassets when I am stuck, or take them to the dog park and hang out, or go out and walk along the river while enjoying a good cigar. Something about getting out in nature does it for me. The cigar imposes a time limit (and settles the nerves). The tired Bassets crash-out and I can work.

I realised the one I was stuck on was a classical tragedy while out w/Bassets. Got me unstuck. I was trying to force "Hollywood" stuff on a script that wasn't having it. Now writing from my worldview, much easier.

Hope this is useful. :beer: Jeff
 
I have always had a problem with fleshing out complex plots. It's a hooker! A fat hooker...with sores!

The DOWNARD SPIRAL is a method I came up with to help, and it does. On a piece of paper...draw this. (EDIT: The formatting is messed on the board. They should not all start on the margin line, but fall under the top line sequentially. So if a plot point starts on page 50, the line should start halfway down the top line.)

Page 1 Page 120
I-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------I

Page 20 Page 95
I----------------------------------------------------------------------------I

Page 60 Page 80
I-------------------------I

Or something to similar, using as many lines as you need. The top line is your A Story. This is the journey line from point a-b. So on this line, write a brief description of the story.

The second line is the sub-pot line, this is where you will mark where your subplot begins and end.

Now, for complex stories, you can layer as many subsequent lines as you want. Just be sure to estimate a duration. The page numbers are never set in stone, but you should definitely know, "Around half-way, Johnny finds out that Dean is a crook and will tussle with this until the climax." So guestimate. I've filled a full page of paper with these lines to keep track of my ins and outs sometimes. It works for me, but your brain may fire on a different spark plug.
 
I post this article from time to time to help people gather ideas. It covers the story structure of the top 6 gurus...and is a great idea generator. Print out the beat sheet of these gurus and go through each one...it will help pop ideas into your head.

http://filmschoolnow.com/gurus.html

Don't try and force your script to fit a page count or structure. You might be limiting yourself from creating a unique script.

Several other ideas to help.
1. You know the ending right? Work backward and keep expanding as you go.
2. Interview your characters. What are you thinking?
3. What do you have to do to get to the end goal?
4. What do you need to learn to get that goal?
5. What or who do you know that can help you get there?

Curtis
www.filmschoolnow.com
 
Kess said:
Several other ideas to help.
1. You know the ending right? Work backward and keep expanding as you go.
2. Interview your characters. What are you thinking?
3. What do you have to do to get to the end goal?
4. What do you need to learn to get that goal?
5. What or who do you know that can help you get there?
Click to expand...

These are golden! I used to make the mistake of thinking up the ending as I was going along and it never turned out the way I wanted. Working backwards helps TONS
 
It is like going on vacation. You know where you are going...you have to figure out how to get there...and along the way everything is going to be tossed in your way...but your sights are still set on that destination...and you won't be smiling until you get there. Every step of the way...it looks like you won't make it...the audience wants to get to that vacation spot too. They are along for the ride...but all appears lost until the final moments of the journey. And remember you will have to make some tough decisions along the road to get there. No easy decisions. Often times you have to give up one thing to get another....that always makes it interesting. Make life and death decisions...if possible. In the first script the Chinatown script...decisions will have to be made that reveal the family secrets...going against family for the truth. Those are tough decisions.
 
Kess said:
I post this article from time to time to help people gather ideas. It covers the story structure of the top 6 gurus...and is a great idea generator. Print out the beat sheet of these gurus and go through each one...it will help pop ideas into your head.

http://filmschoolnow.com/gurus.html

Don't try and force your script to fit a page count or structure. You might be limiting yourself from creating a unique script.

Several other ideas to help.
1. You know the ending right? Work backward and keep expanding as you go.
2. Interview your characters. What are you thinking?
3. What do you have to do to get to the end goal?
4. What do you need to learn to get that goal?
5. What or who do you know that can help you get there?

Curtis
www.filmschoolnow.com
Click to expand...

Kess,
Thank you!!!

This is amazing help! Added to the other help I have no excuses!

Thanks to all!!!
 
A few things that always help me...

Remember there are usually 3 plotlines interwoven throughout the story--and each needs to be developed fully.

  1. "A" story: the plot or the external conflict
  2. "B" story: the subplot storyline that exposes the internal conflict (fatal flaw)
  3. "C" story: the subplot storyline that explores the relationship issues a protagonist must face to achieve the overall goal of the plot
Character drives plot most of the time (except, for example, when the characters are mere chess pieces in a complex game, such as in Identity, which I liked btw), so don't spend too much time creating/pondering the external side unless your character puts you there.

Also, write from THEME and you'll discover that the possibilities are endless.

Also, write from CHARACTER FLAW--as PILAR ALESSANDRA points out in her On the Page DVD/Course--which can literally fill your script with all the necessary scenes! (Usually more than you need, so you just have to pick the best.)


Check out her awesome DVD and techniques.

http://www.onthepage.tv/
 
Last edited:
kylekmd said:

Also, write from CHARACTER FLAW--as PILAR ALESSANDRA points out in her On the Page DVD/Course--which can literally fill your script with all the necessary scenes! (Usually more than you need, so you just have to pick the best.)


Check out her awesome DVD and techniques.

http://www.onthepage.tv/
Click to expand...

hey ho kyle: as opposed to books, which would you say have been the most helpful dvds to your growth as a screenwriter?
just curious!
pax
 
DVD courses I recommend (in no particular order)
  1. Pilar Allesandra's On The Page DVD Course
  2. John Truby's Great Screenwriting Class
  3. The Hero's 2 Journeys by Hauge & Vogler
  4. Syd Field's Screenwriting Workshop
  5. Karl Iglesias' Writing for Emotion Impact Master Class
  6. Chris Soth's Million Dollar Screenwriting Course
  7. My soon-to-be-published Neo-Horror Sequencing DVD (3 months realistically, due to other deadlines)
  8. And don't forget to check out the Creative Screenwriting website for their 100's of Screenwriting Expo DVDs (I'll look at what I've enjoyed and post it later)
 
kyle: thanks for the list.
btw, all/ be careful when ordering dvds from creative screenwriting. i ordered a few quite a while ago and haven't rx'd them, nor heard a peep from cs. they don't answer their phone, and they don't answer emails. from what i've read over on the donedeal forums, my experience is not unique.
 
Kyle
Any chance you will be selling your neo-horror sequencing DVD through Amazon, or some way like that, where we could sign up in advance to be notified when it is available, have it shipped, etc? I see that often on Amazon, very helpful. I for sure want to buy a copy when it is out.
Randall
 
Interesting overview of Dramatica VS the others. The one that I actually like wasn't in your comparison and that's Blake Snyders SAVE THE CAT. STC is all about structure and sounds like it would fall closer to Dramatica than the others but? I would recommend STC it is all about screen writing, Dramatica seems more universal, and not as film specific. Personally I do think you have more flexibility in a novel than you have in a screenplay. And while I'm not 100% in agreement with STC it does come from a very pragmatic screen writing perspective and like you say about Dramatica it's from the writers orientation.
 
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