Help me pick a 3-Axis pistol-grip Gimbal!

D

dylansmith

Well-known member
I currently film with my 6D+ 24-70ii and find it lacking in many areas - particularly in terms of compactness and stabilisation. Here are some of my questions:

1. I am planning to purchase a separate system for my video rig. How much difference is there in terms of video quality between a hacked GH2 (driftwood) vs GH3 vs GH4? A used GH2 is selling dirt cheap right now, but I do see the extra details 4k has to offer in GH4 too. Tough choice.

2. I have looked through quite a few pistol-grip gimbals and shortlisted the following:

a. Beholder MS1 - nice grip and stands by itself, but afraid the payload of 800g is too little for a GH2 + 12-35mm combo.
b. CAME-Single - seems easy to fly right out of the box
c. Pilotfly H1+ - more stable than CAME Single, but requires a lot of tuning

which one would you guys choose based on the quality of stabilisation, durability and compactness?

3. For those that require thorough PID settings, is it a set-and-forget kind of thing? How does it work? Does it require hours of retuning? When does it need retuning?

4. If using on a zoom lens (say 12-35mm), Does any of the 3 gimbals above require rebalancing? Or is it automatic?

5. Heard the DJI OSMO is coming out soon and that it can be bought separately from the ZenMuse cameras. Does it mean that I can attach my own GH2/mirrorless cam on the DJI? It is so much cheaper than the 3 options above and it's a well-known brand in this arena.

6. If the options above are not the best ones for my needs, is there any other product (whether available now or upcoming next year) that would suit my needs? Ideally, I am looking at something that is less than 1000USD.

Thanks in advance for your help!
 
Maybe I'm the only one who feels this way, but I see compactness in a different way than most.

Sure you may get a camera body or lens which is smaller than another. But your overall footprint, or amount of space you take up on a shoot is still dictated by the size of your tripod for example. A tripod which takes up 4 feet in diameter still takes that amount of space no matter which camera you mount to it. In a similar fashion, no matter which handheld gimbal you get, the amount of space you take up on a shoot is still dictated by your body holding the gimbal. That being said, camera size is an important factor when selecting a camera, but is way down on my list in terms of importance when making a selection. Truth be told, almost any modern camera is capable of making pretty pictures in the right hands. It's just a matter of picking the right tool for the job at hand. I have owned all the cameras on your proposed list, and the GH4 is at the top.

Good luck with your quest!

Dave
 
Add the Filmpower Nebula 4200 to the list.
http://filmpower.us/products/pre-or...oscope-stabilizer-for-5drs-5d3-5d2-a7s-gimbal

You can go between single handle and dual. In the dual the springs dampen the "walking bounce" you get with most brushless gimbals. It seems to allow for a heavier payload even in single handle mode. There's no real world tests yet though.

The DJI OSMO only works with Zenmuse cameras. The handle only version are for those who already have cameras with their drones.

You should consider the payload capable with the gimbal. That can limit the lens options.

Filmpower also has the ROXOR on preorder which they seem to position as a competitor to the OSMO. There's no specs on it yet though and no camera options other than the one built in.
http://filmpower.us/products/roxor-handle-gimbal-camera-pre-order

Other things to consider are tool-less vs tools and whether it has an "encoder" which tends to improve battery life and "intelligent" balancing.
Came-TV single and DJI OSMO have an encoder.
 
I recently picked up the CAME single, and put it to use on a job for Red Bull with a Blackmagic Pocket. I'm SUPER impressed, seems really well built, comes in a complete kit (including case) which makes it really convenient - my pocket camera now lives in the CAME case with an 11-16mm Tokina attached.

The best thing about it is how easily it's balanced and up and running. Takes me about 60-90 seconds to have it up and running. I'm using it today to shoot some pickups for a feature from a car.

A really cool piece of kit, mostly idiot proof and really effective. On the Red Bull job I was wedging myself through the forward hatch of a small yacht on some really rough swell. Try as I might, I got throughly beaten up (bruises all around my torso from being bashed into the edges of the hatch as I held the camera/CAME up with one hand and pointed it at the yacht we were filming. The shot would have been literally impossible to get with any other kind of device, you couldn't have held a Movi style full gimbal up in swell that rough (you'd have been thrown overboard) and a steadicam arm would be dangerous in those kinds of conditions. But the little CAME single just held high over my head, made it possible. And the footage came out an absolute treat - smooth, useable, magic hour shots of yacht sailing through big choppy waves.

Highly recommended.
 
Grug, do tell!
I was told by several people that the BMPCC and Tokina 11-16mm would be too heavy for the CAME Single. Are you using a Metabones Canon (or Nikon) SpeedBooster?
Do post some of the video clips if you can.
 
I've used it with the 11-16mm f/2.8 Tokina, a variable ND and a Speedbooster, and it balances just fine. I've also got 11-20mm f/2.8 Tokina which I've used with the Aputure DEC (for wireless focus control), but that's significantly trickier to balance because you can't mount it from the bottom (due to the DEC's control box).

I can't post anything yet, but I'll put it up once Red Bull release it.
 
Thanks Grug. Came-TV has the Single payload at 1.2kg and the BMPCC, SpeedBooster, Tokina 11-16mm falls just under that. Despite that, several people had discouraged me. That you balanced it quickly is the kind of thing I'd need. I might, for example, move from the Lumix 12-35 to the Tokina during a shoot and need to be able to do it without clients getting antsy.
 
David W. Jones said:
Maybe I'm the only one who feels this way, but I see compactness in a different way than most.

Sure you may get a camera body or lens which is smaller than another. But your overall footprint, or amount of space you take up on a shoot is still dictated by the size of your tripod for example. A tripod which takes up 4 feet in diameter still takes that amount of space no matter which camera you mount to it. In a similar fashion, no matter which handheld gimbal you get, the amount of space you take up on a shoot is still dictated by your body holding the gimbal. That being said, camera size is an important factor when selecting a camera, but is way down on my list in terms of importance when making a selection. Truth be told, almost any modern camera is capable of making pretty pictures in the right hands. It's just a matter of picking the right tool for the job at hand. I have owned all the cameras on your proposed list, and the GH4 is at the top.

Good luck with your quest!

Dave
Click to expand...

Size and weight of the camera matters because it affects how comfortably you can hold the camera/gimbal and for how long. For me, the smaller the camera/lens/rig the more creative I can be.
 
dylansmith said:
I currently film with my 6D+ 24-70ii and find it lacking in many areas - particularly in terms of compactness and stabilisation. Here are some of my questions:

1. I am planning to purchase a separate system for my video rig. How much difference is there in terms of video quality between a hacked GH2 (driftwood) vs GH3 vs GH4? A used GH2 is selling dirt cheap right now, but I do see the extra details 4k has to offer in GH4 too. Tough choice.
Click to expand...

Can't answer the other questions but I used the gh2, gh3 and gh4 professionally and I can tell you I saw almost no difference in video quality going from one to the next. Using the GH4 i love 4k to crop in, but just quality wise i cant even remember which camera I used when i mix them and rewatch the footage. The gh2 was very small, cheap plastic and my flip out screen got loose and flimsy so I'd say at least get a gh3 just for the sturdy body. The features going from one to the next are helpful but its up to you if you need those or not.

Here is a video interview i filmed mixing a gh3 and gh4, can you even tell which camera is which?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4u7vM_l7pUs
 
PegLeg Media said:
Can't answer the other questions but I used the gh2, gh3 and gh4 professionally and I can tell you I saw almost no difference in video quality going from one to the next. Using the GH4 i love 4k to crop in, but just quality wise i cant even remember which camera I used when i mix them and rewatch the footage. The gh2 was very small, cheap plastic and my flip out screen got loose and flimsy so I'd say at least get a gh3 just for the sturdy body. The features going from one to the next are helpful but its up to you if you need those or not.

Here is a video interview i filmed mixing a gh3 and gh4, can you even tell which camera is which?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4u7vM_l7pUs
Click to expand...

Hi there,

I couldn't tell the difference from the link, presumably thanks to YouTube's compression? Perhaps we would be able to tell from the originals.

How about the GH series in good light vs smartphones like the S6?

I have decided to go a different route (use S6 to film moving shots on a gimbal, and 6d for the rest) because S6 is so much sharper than my 6D in good lighting (keeping to ISO50, 1/50s). If the GH series (maybe the GH2 since there's not much difference between the different generations) is sharper/renders better than the S6 in 4k, I'll replace it as the cam on gimbal - for ergonomics and better ISO performance.
 
Beholder DS1 much better than the previous MS1. Holds a hefty 3.8 lbs which is good enough for a Canon 5D and decent lens.
http://www.owldolly.com/products/beholder-ds1-camera-stabilizer

OwlDolly and iKan now distributing in US and will be available at B&H. I saw it at both PhotoExpo Plus and NAB East in NYC. Looks impressive. I'd love to compare it to the FilmPower Nebula 4200 but there's no user videos on that yet.
 
I hate to sound like such an inept video nube, but alas that is what I am. Watching a couple of these review vids, like the Darren Miles/Beholder one in particular, the rigs block your view to the LCD screen. I didn't see where any where using a secondary screen that they could see.

Do people just use WA and shoot more or less blind, or from experience, and not really look at what they are recording, when using these rigs?

I get that the rig needs a weight to counterbalance the lens, but it seems like this should be doable without blocking the LCD? Or am I missing something? Thx.
 
You need a light camera for a small gimball I would suggest you also look at the Panasonic G7. By all accounts the 4K is the same or slightly better than GH4. Of course you sacrifice some bells and whistles that to me were not deal breakers.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top