Help choosing a new tripod / fluid head! DV12SB?

swphotovideo

swphotovideo

Member
I'm currently using a Benro BV6 with their carbon fibre solo style legs. The fluidity of the head is actually not too bad, but it's made of a plastic composite type material and the QR plate sometimes gets a bit stuck trying to slide it in and out. This slows me down enough to bother me. It also seems to have a bit of flex when I try and use my slider on top of it (Rhino 24" EVO). I'm looking to upgrade to something that's not only better quality, but will speed up my workflow. I don't mind spending a decent chunk of cash as long as I don't have to do it again in the foreseeable future.

I'm using an FS5 (with Atomos Shogun Inferno and will soon be grabbing a Fujinon MK 18-55), sometimes an A6500 though. The tripod will mainly be used for corporate stuff, sometimes for weddings.

So far my research has drawn me to the DV12SB with the Speed Lock CF legs. I know there is the cheaper FSB10, but the DV12SB has a wider range for pay load (DV12SB 1-15kg, FSB10 4-12kg). This could come in handy if I ever need to use a lighter rig (eg A6500).

The legs, with only three locks, seem like they will be fast to operate. I love the look of Sachtler's mid level spreader where you can twist the knob for quick incremental adjustments in height. For the rig I'm using, I could probably get away with a FSB8 (or other 75mm head), but the 75mm version of the Speed Lock legs seem to get poorer reviews and don't have the awesome mid-level spreader from the 100mm legs.

The DV12SB has a touch and go style drop in plate (the plate is bigger than the FSB4/6/8 series), and this looks like it'll be quite fast. I have a smaller head that I use when on top of a slider, so I guess I'll have pick up a QR adapter to put on that, which adds another $350 USD.

I'm in Australia, unfortunately no one stocks Sachtler gear locally. I guess the questions I have are:

1. Does the DV12SB and Speed Lock CF legs sound like a good fit for me?
2. Are there alternatives I should be considering?
3. Is a 100mm bowl the right choice, or should I go for 75mm bowl? Sachtler are apparently releasing a "revolutionary" new tripod next month. Sounds like it will be a 75mm bowl.
 
1. Yes, DV > FSB. I have had the DV6SB, the little brother of the DV12SB for about 12 years and frankly, as someone who has owned half a dozen Sachtlers, the DV12SB is better built than the FSB series. The FSBs have a lot more plastic and the internals don't seem to be as beefy IMHO.
2. You could look at Miller or Vinten. IMHO, Sachtler is the best mid level product on the market, only bested by O'Connor and Ronford Baker, both of which cost many times more than the mid level Sachtlers.
3. If you have a choice, always 100mm bowl unless you backpack or fly a ton where weight matters a lot. I have 75mm but for using your Rhino 24" (I have the 24" and the 42" versions with the Motion and Arc) and they have some heft, even the 24". Add in your FS5, Shogun and the MK 18-55 are all pro level gear that are relatively heavy compared to just a camera. If you add a baseplate, VCT Plate, handgrip, extension arms, rods, etc. it really all adds up. I was amazed when I weighed my fully kitted C100 and it was over 14lbs! All of the this stuff we build up our cameras with gets heavy, you want heavy duty and something that holds a lot more than what you are using. What if you upgrade to the FS7 MKII or a Varicam LT? Get the 100mm.
 
Thanks for that. I think you're on the money. Since getting my FS5 / Shogun combo, I have noticed it's a little more challenging to level it in the 75mm bowl, probably because the centre of gravity is higher than what it was with my previous setup.

I'm now considering the Miller Arrowx 3 with Sprinter II CF legs: https://www.millertripods.com/en/system-arrowx-3-sprinter-ii-2-stage-carbon-fibre.html

Appears to be comparable to the DV12SB & Speed Lock legs. Might work out a hair cheaper for me as I'm in Australia and Miller are an Australian brand. Has the benefit of a longer warranty (3 years for Miller vs 2 for Sachtler).

I can't seem to find a QR receiver to adapt my older head though for using on the slider. It apparently uses a "Euro" plate. So I'm guessing this might work: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/880758-REG/cartoni_l884_universal_removable_camera_base.html
 
swphotovideo said:
Thanks for that. I think you're on the money. Since getting my FS5 / Shogun combo, I have noticed it's a little more challenging to level it in the 75mm bowl, probably because the centre of gravity is higher than what it was with my previous setup.

I'm now considering the Miller Arrowx 3 with Sprinter II CF legs: https://www.millertripods.com/en/system-arrowx-3-sprinter-ii-2-stage-carbon-fibre.html

Appears to be comparable to the DV12SB & Speed Lock legs. Might work out a hair cheaper for me as I'm in Australia and Miller are an Australian brand. Has the benefit of a longer warranty (3 years for Miller vs 2 for Sachtler).

I can't seem to find a QR receiver to adapt my older head though for using on the slider. It apparently uses a "Euro" plate. So I'm guessing this might work: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/880758-REG/cartoni_l884_universal_removable_camera_base.html
Click to expand...

I also have the Miller AIR, a small and light head and leg set I bought for travel, I shot a documentary in Brazil this past Spring and I was really trying to save a good amount of weight since I was bringing a lot of gear and trying to avoid overweight charges for my client. My Sachtler DV6SB head weighs 13lbs for the head and another 5lbs for the carbon fiber Miller Solo DV sticks I have it mounted on. It is rated to 19lbs. For travel, the Miller AIR only holds 11lbs max and only has two fixed counterbalance settings. But in comparison, it weighs only 3.1lbs. Amazingly great travel head as long as I use a more stripped down version of my camera rig.

As far as the Miller, for the amount of money you are contemplating spending, I highly advise you try at a store or rent both heads. They are both good heads but feel pretty different. Sachtler will have better resale if that matters. Miller stuff is good, very good, but so are Sachtler heads. I would want to try both before buying to see which has a better feel for your style and rig. Also, don't be afraid to mix and match. Personally I dislike Sachtler legs, they are okay but unlike you, I despise spreaders of any kind and have for my entire career. All spreaders are is a hindrance and I have missed many important shots while messing with spreaders. You might want to at least check out the Miller Solo VJ carbon legs, they are EXCELLENT and have no spreader. But they have twist lock legs which bug some people. Not me, I am fine with them but some people prefer quick release. I have the 75mm version, called the Miller Solo DV, I actually have a set in carbon fiber and an Aluminium alloy set too because I got a deal on them with the Miller AIR head. If I was in your position, personally, I would buy the Sachtler head and team them with the Miller Solo VJ legs. But I shoot a lot of quick paced documentary and I travel a lot. Losing the spreaders saves weight too and the Solo VJs and DVs go pretty tall too. I have used them with up to a 400mm lens and they were pretty good. But if you use bigger, heavier cameras and longer lenses, you probably HAVE to have a spreader for steadiness and rigidity.
 
I managed to find a store that stocked some of the Miller gear. Played with the ArrowX3, Arrow X5, CF Solo legs and Sprinter II legs.

The Arrowx 3 seemed to have some slight bounce back on the pans when coming to a stop, most prominent whilst trying to pan left. It was a rental head, so maybe it's had a hard life, but it didn't leave me feeling overly confident. Lovely head in all other regards. The Arrowx 5 didn't seem to have this issue, but it's another step up in price.

The Sprinter II legs were fast to deploy / pack up, but fine tuning was more fiddly than I was hoping, so I can appreciate your comments. The mid level spreader you have to wind up and down to adjust height and it was a bit too time consuming. I think the Sachtler mid level spreader would be more convenient in this regard, as you just twist the middle of the spreader and the spreader rods drop into pre-set notch heights. Hard to say without trying them in person.

The CF Solo legs were decent and I reckon I'll end up with a set at some point. The height of the 3 stage was impressive. Not crazy about the twist locks, but I could get used to them.

No luck finding Sachtler DV12SB or their Speed Lock legs locally.
 
There's several great features of the Miller Solo's but my favorite one is it slides easily onto my lowepro backpack's tripod mount for easy transport on smaller jobs. The other thing is depending on the type of work you do the 3 stage version gets up high enough to clear most people's heads (fashion week risers, brides walking down the aisle, press conferences, etc.). I have two sets of 75mm Miller Solo's, with Sachtler DV6SB and a DV8SB. I used to own the DV12SB, obviously if you're working with bigger camera setups, 100mm might be a minimum, but for small jobs where I'm the person moving all the equipment too, it's 75mm all the way. I can carry the two tripods and heads I mentioned before, in the same portabrace case that carried the DV12SB. I also think Miller heads are fine and if you look on the used market, tend to be undervalued for the performance they offer compared to a Sachtler.
 
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Death to spreaders... Like Puredrifting, I've hated them my entire career. I have a Dv8SB (75mm bowl) on older Gitzo CF legs. I prefer 75mm bowl heads unless otherwise needed. I had a Sachtler 44 back in the bigger camera days, but don't miss it.

Thumbs up for Sachtler heads!
 
I like mid-level spreaders as it's easy to lift them & quickly skinny up the legs in order to finesse the camera's height. Also a huge fan of Sachtler's Speed Lock legs for quick height adjustments too.

Hate floor spreaders unless working on a stage.
 
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Thanks for your help everyone. I ordered the DV12SB with the speed lock legs. Will post back my thoughts after giving them a whirl, in case anyone else finds themselves in a similar predicament.
 
swphotovideo said:
Thanks for your help everyone. I ordered the DV12SB with the speed lock legs. Will post back my thoughts after giving them a whirl, in case anyone else finds themselves in a similar predicament.
Click to expand...

Sweet! Let us know how you like your set up once you get it and put it to work. I was looking at possibly upgrading to the DV12SB from my DV6SB but now that I have decided to stick with smaller, lightweight cameras like my C200 and the EVA 1, I think I can make my DV6SB keep working fine, even when loaded up. I was contemplating buying the Varicam LT, which is a tank, but I talked myself out of it, just too much money for me. Since I do a lot of BTS, travel work, bigger and heavier just seems like an exercise in futility for me. I am pretty sure you will love the Sachtler, they are mechanical works of art.
 
I used the DV12SB on a job over the weekend. It was very run and gun, and the Speed Lock legs would not have worked for the gig. I needed very low and very high angles, so I picked up the 3 stage Solo legs. The Solo legs were quite good, aside from the occasional fiddliness of having to loosen/tighten 9 twist locks.

The DV12SB is a very nice head. Very fluid, a little nicer to use than the Miller's I tried out. I do sort of wish I went for the Video 15 head though. Even at the long end of an 18-110, the couple extra steps of drag resistance would have been nice. It's not too bad if I really try to be controlled, I know more drag would be more forgiving though. We'll see how I feel as time goes on. I could just need some practice.

I really like the Speed Lock legs, and think they'll be perfect for a lot of the stuff I do. The head and legs does a fantastic job of holding my Rhino slider, with subsequent fluid head and rigged FS5 etc, so I'm very pleased about that. The touch and go plates make changing between camera and slider a breeze.

Overall, quite happy, but may talk to the supplier and enquire if it's possible to swap the head to a Video 15.
 
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