Getting my music cleared...

M

markyf

Well-known member
I swear to you I dug through ten pages of the Business/Post Production thread to find answers and couldn't. I don't use the search function anymore as it causes migraine headaches.

Anyways, I've nearly completed a 35 minute short. I have about 6 songs that figure prominently in it. They are all by indie artists who have either self-produced cds or are affiliated with indie labels. Not a major in sight, I believe. I have solid connections to about 4 of the 6 artists.

I'm going to attempt to get all of the music cleared without paying anything. Firstly, because I have nothing to pay... I'm broke. Secondly, because this film will screen a couple of times and then be shelved, more or less. It was a labour of love and my 'film school' but it's got enough faults that I don't want to promote it much and would rather move on to the next project. Because of our funding system here in Canada, it is in my interest to have it play in a couple of festivals so I have some track record when applying for future grants.

So how should I go about this? Do I start off with just a general email telling them what I've done, what I plan to do with the film and a clip of where their song appears (or better yet even a clip of the whole film)? What about legal matters? How do I handle this? Is there a template for these sorts of deals? Is there a deferral agreement I could use so that if, by chance, someone wants to pay me for my film, I would then have a fixed proportion go to these artists?
What have people done before? What would you guys do in my shoes? Can I do this without employing a lawyer?

Mark
 
markyf said:
I swear to you I dug through ten pages of the Business/Post Production thread to find answers and couldn't. I don't use the search function anymore as it causes migraine headaches.

Anyways, I've nearly completed a 35 minute short. I have about 6 songs that figure prominently in it. They are all by indie artists who have either self-produced cds or are affiliated with indie labels. Not a major in sight, I believe. I have solid connections to about 4 of the 6 artists.

I'm going to attempt to get all of the music cleared without paying anything. Firstly, because I have nothing to pay... I'm broke. Secondly, because this film will screen a couple of times and then be shelved, more or less. It was a labour of love and my 'film school' but it's got enough faults that I don't want to promote it much and would rather move on to the next project. Because of our funding system here in Canada, it is in my interest to have it play in a couple of festivals so I have some track record when applying for future grants.

So how should I go about this? Do I start off with just a general email telling them what I've done, what I plan to do with the film and a clip of where their song appears (or better yet even a clip of the whole film)? What about legal matters? How do I handle this? Is there a template for these sorts of deals? Is there a deferral agreement I could use so that if, by chance, someone wants to pay me for my film, I would then have a fixed proportion go to these artists?
What have people done before? What would you guys do in my shoes? Can I do this without employing a lawyer?

Mark
Click to expand...

One of the first steps is to find out who actually owns the rights you need to clear. If the artist wrote and published the music themselves, as well as recorded it, they can grant permission to sync it to your video. But if they performed someone else's work, then you have to clear synch rights with the actual copyright owner. But the synch rights are only part of the process - that only gives you the right to use the words and music but doesn't convey rights to the recording of a particular performance. If you're going to record a fresh performance yourself you're set. BUT, if you want to use a pre-existing recording, once you cross that hurdle, you need to look to who owns the master rights to the actual recording of it you want to use and clear the master use rights with them
 
Look up the artists and contact them. Just tell them that you'd like to use their tracks in your self financed short film. Be prepared to provide a script or (easier and better) an online version of the finished film.

You don't need a lawyer. I've cleared music myself with publishers and labels. It's fairly easy. As long as money isn't being made (by you) they should be pretty cool about it. Hopefully your film is decent also, but I don't think a contract is necessary because it's doubtful (no offense) that much will ever happen with a 35 minute short.

.
 
Chris Santucci said:
Hopefully your film is decent also, but I don't think a contract is necessary because it's doubtful (no offense) that much will ever happen with a 35 minute short.

.
Click to expand...

But what evidence would I then have that they've granted their permission. And how do I stipulate that I won't sell the film without first negotiating a contract with them (moot point, I know, but they don't know that.)
 
I just have em send me a note saying it's cool. They usually don't dig contracts.
You probably don't wanna tell you have already pirated their music. Ask for the note then send em a copy.
 
markyf said:
But what evidence would I then have that they've granted their permission. And how do I stipulate that I won't sell the film without first negotiating a contract with them (moot point, I know, but they don't know that.)
Click to expand...


It's generally pretty hard to license music for free unless you're only talking about festival rights. I've seen even Indie unsigned artists very much not willing to grant rights for free when a filmmaker intends to sell the film.

The problem (one of 'em) is, if you get festival rights or some form of rights for only limited exhibition and THEN you decide to sell the film in any way, then, the artists need to get paid.

If you intend to make an attempt to profit from the film, don't even think about NOT getting adequate licensing for the music up front because you may end up having to replace tracks if you can't pay for them (pain in the butt). Certainly you could ask for festival rights only (for free) and inform them that in the event profit becomes an issue, you intend to negotiate for right$ beyond festival rights.

When I deal with individuals or even small companies and I need clearance for anything, I just make sure they send me some kind of letter or email stating that they in fact grant rights for some specific usage. Music is a little more involved, but really, all you need is an agreement/contract which may very well come from the artists themselves, or they may ask you to provide something in writing.

Just make sure they don't just say "Yeah, dude, it's OK" and try to leave it at that. Get it in writing. I'd guess there are contracts online floating around that would be useful.

.
 
How much more complex is it getting a go ahead from someone from the big leagues who is a well known performing artist? Same-same or another route to solve this?

Who would you go through?

Agent.
Manager.
Artist.
Label.
Lawyer.


Cheers,


DogDay.
 
You have to do 2 things. Find out who the publisher is (for sync rights) and find out the name of the record label (for master recording rights).

Start with ASCAP and/or BMI to do a title search.

Once you find the name and contact info of the publisher, which may be a huge company or it may very well be the artist(s) who wrote the music, then contact them and ask to speak to someone about licensing tracks for a film. Someone will ask you a bunch of questions, maybe fax you a form to fill out and generally get back to you pretty fast.

Then find out who the record label is and contact someone in licensing there and go through the same process.

Be prepared to answer questions about film budget, where and how it's going to be distributed, subject matter, whether you want a track in its entirety or just a portion of it, etc, etc.

One problem dealing with multiple artists who may hold the publishing rights is each one will want to be paid the same amount. So if 3 or 4 people share in the publishing rights (like a band), it could get pricey.

.
 
Is it easyier & more cost effective to go with an original recording using the window as a lure for exposer for them ( Even an established Artist ) or to get the rights/licence to do a re-make with an unknown using the same material?

I hope this isn`t considered highjacking if it is say so and I can start another thread but somehow I think these questions are connected and can also be helpful to MarkyF and anyone else reading.

DogDay.
 
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DogDay said:
Is it easyier & more cost effective to go with an original recording using the window as a lure for exposer for them ( Even an established Artist ) or to get the rights/licence to do a re-make with an unknown using the same material?

I hope this isn`t considered highjacking if it is say so and I can start another thread but somehow I think these questions are connected and can also be helpful to MarkyF and anyone else reading.

DogDay.
Click to expand...

I don't think artists are quite so hungry for "free exposure" as popular opinion seems to hold. Creating good material is just plain hard work and the talent to do it well is rarer than the proponents of "the democratization of media" would want us to believe. A working publisher and/or artist earns his living by creating and recording music that the public would want to hear and having people actually pay to hear it - he gets a royalty when a CD is purchased or when it's played on the air. Unless the music is world-class, freaking outstanding, a modern-day Beethoven, the public's desire to hear is it satiated pretty quickly and it disappears into the "yeah, so what else is new?" filing cabinet. Free exposure is satisfying the public's limited demand to hear the music (such as might exist) WITHOUT generating any royalties, while the ability to generate public interest in purchasing a CD by hearing a cut from the artist in a film, especially a low circulation indy film, is vastly overrated. The artists talent is his capital, the means by which he can earn a living and continue to practice his art. So why would any of them in their right minds want to give away their means of earning their daily bread? If your film is a strong documentary supporting a social cause the artist happens to be passionate about - maybe. But for the usual indy subject matter, what would be their incentive? Exposure? How many people do you know who read all the way through the end credit roll in a film to see who wrote or performed a certain piece of music in it? And especially when it comes to synch rights, which come from the publisher and are needed whether you use an existing recording or record a fresh performance yourself, how many people do you know that even KNOW who the publisher is of a piece of music they like and would go out and search for other music from the same publisher recorded by other artists to add to their collection?
 
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Hey I hear you...Believe me I am not one of those give me a free ride guys or stiff the Artist guys nor lets make Art for free why should you have to pay for it guys...I am an Artist I want to get paid, when dealing with other Artists I make sure they get paid...So I hear you.

Its for a short. It happens to be a very strong social issue...Its gonna get lots & lots of attention...It would be a good move for them to let me have it for a reasonable fee.

DogDay.
 
I agree with both you guys. Although, I would say that artists are a community. If I have no intention of selling this film and am not capitalizing on it, if the artist liked it I think that would be incentive enough to allow me to use it pro bono. Obviously if they don't like it, I wouldn't expect the same treatment. How many friends and guest artists and people who did the cover art, etc... get paid on a music project? They are kind of in the same boat and I'm sure try and leverage whatever the can for free. I paid my DOP because he invested a lot of time and energy in the project. Although a certain musician might have spent a lot of time and energy composing this music, it wasn't with this end in mind and if I lay into a movie that might be shown five times publicly, I don't see the harm in them signing off on that.

I will them know that I can't pay, not as some negotiating tactic, but because if I paid one I would feel like I had to pay all of them and there's no way I'm investing $1,000+ in a film that will be incredibly difficult (because of the 35 minute length) to get screened anyways. Would rather put the money towards another project.
 
Money is a means to an end and not an end in and of itself...There has to be something in it for everyone thats the nature of people and of business...Win-win just means that if you assist in fullfilling my needs I will do what I can to make sure that an equivalent is brought back to you. Money for more money, money for time, money for favors, money for sex, food, etc etc etc...If you don`t have money to pay for it then you still have to offer something even if it is in terms of how they can put a nice spin on a hand out...Hense the Kodak Moment aka The Photo Opportunity : )

Its case to case who gets what for what. Try to do the right thing boths ways. Do favors for favors but dont get used. Create opportunity but dont exploit. Pretty simple principles.

I want a song. Its famous by a famous Artist. Its perfect for the project. It embodies the intention of the work. I would be willing to wager with them that using it in this context will indeed effect an increase in sales.

And maybe just maybe if the disgrunteled masses who would rather destroy the possiblity of Artists actually rising above the rabble by amassing a bit of wealth...If those so called rebels knew for a fact that every penny was going to a particular worthy cause maybe they would be willing to actually pay for something out of their own pockets ...

Or maybe their so called activisim would be revealed as nothing more than the perfect cover for being spoiled selfish cheap-skates ???


DogDay.
 
If it's as perfect as you say it is they probaly wouldn't want you to pay. Would sully it in some way.
 
markyf said:
.... How many friends and guest artists and people who did the cover art, etc... get paid on a music project? ...
Click to expand...

For "music projects" that you hear in concert, see as CDs in record stores, are broadcast on TV or heard on the radio ... virtually all of them. Look up "Harlan Ellison - Pay the Writer" on YouTube for an interesting rant, er ... interview discussion, about the topic of creative artists contributing their efforts for free <grin>.
 
The rant is fair but it's hardly the same thing. Put it this way, if I made a music video for a band that I only ever kept on my shelf and they heard about it and they came and said they loved it and wanted to copy and distribute it to their friends, I wouldn't want a dime because I've already done the work and they are not causing me more work at all. If they wanted to sell it I would have to negotiate a rate for myself because that is a different thing altogether.

If a band wanted me to make them a music video, I would have to charge something although not very much because this would be my time and energy. Similarly, if I wanted to hire a singer/songwriter to write original songs for me, that would be classless not to pay them something.

But in my situation, finishing a personal short film with no distribution potential and at the max a few public screenings, well in that situation I don't think using pre-existing songs and asking the artists if I might have their consent to use it, I don't think that has anything to do with what that Harlan is talking about.
 
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