Foley Field Audio

tedwardo24

tedwardo24

Member
I am looking to record foley audio in the field, and am asking for advice for a cheap, easy, and GOOD way to record sound effects, wild tracks, etc.

I don't want to take my camera out and record with the lens cap on, and I also do not want to take my computer with me while recording in the street... I have looked at DAT recorders, but most are pretty high priced (yes, I know, quality).

Are there any mid-range audio-recording devices out there? It seems like there is very low end (stupid voice memo recorders) and there is very high end (DAT recorders) but there is not much in the middle.

What am I missing, what advice do you have, what do you all suggest....

Thanks in advance
 
By "foley field audio," I assume you're referring to "location sound effects recording" (ie. no picture reference), rather than "location foley."

You're in luck. The market is now so rich with solid-state field recorders that there's no compelling reason to go back to the bad old days when you're only real choices for high-end portable recorders were DAT or Nagra.

Even the least of the recent crop of field recorders will match DAT's 16-bit/48 kHz resolution, and most will give you the option to record 24-bit / 96kHz. Not only do they record higher-quality tracks, but they tend to cost a fraction of a comparable portable DAT. Here's a quick list (by no means exhaustive):
Marantz PMD-670
Tascam HD-P2
Fostex FR-2
Sound Devices 702, 722, 744
Zoom H4

Some of these will even provide time-code functionality.

If you're looking to actually record location foley, things get a bit more complex. I've worked on a few such projects (The Company was one), and it can get pretty complex pretty quickly. For now, I find that my rig consists of: a Mac G4 (cloistered in another room), an Mbox, a Mackie mixer, two MKH416's (that 2nd `416 will let you really take advantage of a location's accoustics), a DV transcoder, two video monitors, and an external A-D converter (because the Mbox's are terrible), and plenty of cables. The success or failure of the undertaking will depend on the location you choose, but a well-chosen location can give you extraordinarily transparent and natural results. Of course, it also helps to have an experienced foley artist and foley mixer. I've used this setup for live foley demonstrations as part of the workshops we've been teaching, and I've gotten to the point where I can get everything up and running in about 20 minutes.
 
Sure, there are lots of options. You could use a tape recorder. I've made field recordings using an old uher reel to reel. You could use a cassette recorder. I've come across decent ones on ebay that would fit the bill.
 
SMuir said:
By "foley field audio," I assume you're referring to "location sound effects recording" (ie. no picture reference), rather than "location foley."

You're in luck. The market is now so rich with solid-state field recorders that there's no compelling reason to go back to the bad old days when you're only real choices for high-end portable recorders were DAT or Nagra.

Even the least of the recent crop of field recorders will match DAT's 16-bit/48 kHz resolution, and most will give you the option to record 24-bit / 96kHz. Not only do they record higher-quality tracks, but they tend to cost a fraction of a comparable portable DAT. Here's a quick list (by no means exhaustive):
Marantz PMD-670
Tascam HD-P2
Fostex FR-2
Sound Devices 702, 722, 744
Zoom H4

Some of these will even provide time-code functionality.

If you're looking to actually record location foley, things get a bit more complex. I've worked on a few such projects (The Company was one), and it can get pretty complex pretty quickly. For now, I find that my rig consists of: a Mac G4 (cloistered in another room), an Mbox, a Mackie mixer, two MKH416's (that 2nd `416 will let you really take advantage of a location's accoustics), a DV transcoder, two video monitors, and an external A-D converter (because the Mbox's are terrible), and plenty of cables. The success or failure of the undertaking will depend on the location you choose, but a well-chosen location can give you extraordinarily transparent and natural results. Of course, it also helps to have an experienced foley artist and foley mixer. I've used this setup for live foley demonstrations as part of the workshops we've been teaching, and I've gotten to the point where I can get everything up and running in about 20 minutes.
Click to expand...

Yes, I mean "location sound effects recording"-- thank you.

And thank you for all the information and support, this gives me a good start to do some research and to look further into this area. Much appreciated!!
 
tedwardo24 said:
And thank you for all the information and support, this gives me a good start to do some research and to look further into this area. Much appreciated!!
Click to expand...

No problem.

Give some careful consideration to your choice of mic, as well as neccessary "support gear."

My effects kit usually consists of the following:
Fostex FR-2 recorder
PSC M4 mkII 4-channel mixer
NP-1 batteries (and an NP-1 cuff for the FR-2)
M-S stereo mic kit (Sennheiser MKH416t, MKH30)
Rycote modular suspension, windshield, windjammer
Boom pole
Sony MDR-7506 headphone
"Stunt" mic (dynamic mic, usually Shure SM-57 or AKG D112)
plenty of gaffer's tape
Safety equipment (road-work vest, steel-toed boots, hardhat, goggles)
Lightweight video tripod with thread adapter

The boom pole's in there because hand-holding a pistol-grip mic mount in a public place really puts people on edge (especially police). The safety vest is really important if you're recording near streets, and it further convinces local police that you're not up to no good. The boots and hard-hat are in the trunk in case I'm recording at a construction site or on a factory floor, where safety gear may be mandatory.

I'm very pleased with the results I've gotten from the `416/`30 combination. the `416 gives a nice, intimate centre, while the `30 gives a nice, smooth stereo image. The `30 does pick up more bass, though, so it's a bit more susceptible to handling noise and wind buffetting.

The "stunt" mic is in there when I have to put a mic in harm's way, or when I have to record high-SPL sounds.
 
I use a Sony portable mini disc recorder I got secondhand off ebay. Works really well. I import the sound using a lead from the headphone socket to the soundcard on the computer, and record it with Audacity.
 
12quidkidinnit said:
I import the sound using a lead from the headphone socket to the soundcard on the computer, and record it with Audacity.
Click to expand...

The newer solid-state recorders will let you connect them to your computer via USB (or firewire with the SD recorders), and mount the recorder as though it were a drive. This is a real time-saver, since the file transfers are no longer real-time. Also, you're making a 1:1 digital copy of the audio, thereby avoiding the generation loss that can otherwise occur.

This is a great time to be getting into field recording, since $300 will now get you a perfectly serviceable portable recorder. Good mics will still cost you a bundle, though.
 
SMuir said:
The newer solid-state recorders will let you connect them to your computer via USB (or firewire with the SD recorders.
Click to expand...
I did actually try one of those after reading a good write up on another forum, but I didn't have much luck with it. I'm not sure if it was faulty, or whether the quality was just poor anyway. Even when set to the highest quality mode (with and without a decent external mic), the sound was worse than with an analogue cassette recorder, and there was a ringing sound accompanying the recording. I took it back and got a refund. :crybaby:
 
I just bought the Tascam HD-P2 after going to NAB and looking at tons of devices and reading tons of articles on all of the new stuff out there at the moment. I bought mine from ( www.oade.com) Doug Oade with the super mod that they put into the unit. Its a little more money but adds 6db using new high quality pre amps. From what I have read by people that have used it with the super mod and what Doug says about it, it seems to be much better for ambient sound work and for shotgun work as well as being great for stereo music recording. With the super mod its supose to equal sound devices for audio quality but not features, but is better for ambient and music. Its list price for the unit with the super mod but this seems reasonable compared to the sound devices units. This fits my budget much better and still has all of the features that I wanted. I just recieved mine today so in a few days I'll try to give some results.:)
 
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12quidkidinnit said:
I did actually try one of those after reading a good write up on another forum, but I didn't have much luck with it. I'm not sure if it was faulty, or whether the quality was just poor anyway. Even when set to the highest quality mode (with and without a decent external mic), the sound was worse than with an analogue cassette recorder, and there was a ringing sound accompanying the recording. I took it back and got a refund. :crybaby:
Click to expand...


I think you must be talking about the "digital voice recorders". They all use a huge amount of compression and are only designed to us as note taking devices. The solid state recorders SMure was referring to (I believe) would be Marantz, Tascam, Korg, Zoom, Sound Devices, Fostex, Nagra et al. These range from prosumer to full on professional recorders and are all pretty good some are really good.
Prices range from around $300 - $5,000 or so.
 
Michael T said:
I just bought the Tascam HD-P2 after going to NAB and looking at tons of devices and reading tons of articles on all of the new stuff out there at the moment. I bought mine from ( www.oade.com) Doug Oade with the super mod that they put into the unit. Its a little more money but adds 6db using new high quality pre amps. From what I have read by people that have used it with the super mod and what Doug says about it, it seems to be much better for ambient sound work and for shotgun work as well as being great for stereo music recording. With the super mod its supose to equal sound devices for audio quality but not features, but is better for ambient and music. Its list price for the unit with the super mod but this seems reasonable compared to the sound devices units. This fits my budget much better and still has all of the features that I wanted. I just recieved mine today so in a few days I'll try to give some results.:)
Click to expand...

Is it really worth it the mod for a couple of hundreads more??
 
mlemaudit said:
Is it really worth it the mod for a couple of hundreads more??
Click to expand...

It seems a small price to pay for even a minor improvement in the preamps' noise floor.

One alternative would be to put a portable mixer such as a SD MixPre or 302 on the front-end (I use a PSC M4 mkII with my Fostex FR-2). Having a continuous gain structure simplifies field recording, and the limiters found on portable mixers tend to be far superior to those found on portable recorders.
 
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