Firestore questions

T

ThousandWordPicture

Active member
Hi everyone,

I have the opportunity to rent my camera out for a 10 day shoot coming up next week. Everything is kind of last minute, so we are just at the stage of renting a firestore now. Since I am not shooting (I would shoot P2), the guy who is shooting wants to rent a firestore. They have offered to rent it from me at the same rate as the shop, if I would like to buy one.

Unfortunately I have to decide tonight, buy or rent it tomorrow for them to fly out on Tuesday.

Basically it sounds like I could get the FS100 V3 w/ high capacity battery, an extra high capacity battery and the hot shoe cradle thing, rent it out to the shoot and walk away with $648 and a firestore.

I definitely wouldn't mind just keeping the cash, as work was slow over the summer, however it is a very tempting opportunity to reinvest into my package. It's hard to say how long it would take to rent it 28 times, which is when it would start making me money.

Another factor is that I have been using DVRack HD for my monitoring, and have enjoyed the use of a waveform, vector scope and spectrometer, even if the actual 720p monitor isn't that great. I'm wondering if the firestore can be set up to shoot and have the firewire cable plugged in at the last minute before rolling?

I envision a scenario where I am setting up a shot while tethered to my laptop for metering, and when I call 'camera ready', I just unplug my laptop and plug in my firestore. I know DVRack is fine with you unceremoniously plugging it in and unplugging it at your leisure, but how does the firestore respond to that kind of treatment?

I've heard that sound guys don't like the Firestore because of the noise, is that still an issue?

How long does it take to dump a full firestore?

Am I alright with 2 of the high capacity batteries? Does it come with a separate charger, or how does charging work? How long does it take to charge a Firestore battery?

V4 now has VFR, correct? That was one of the last things I didn't like about the feature set of the firestore, so if that's working now than that's great.

So I guess if you have any thoughts on this in the next 16 hours, let them rip!

Thanks you guys!
 
"I envision a scenario where I am setting up a shot while tethered to my laptop for metering, and when I call 'camera ready', I just unplug my laptop and plug in my firestore. I know DVRack is fine with you unceremoniously plugging it in and unplugging it at your leisure, but how does the firestore respond to that kind of treatment?"

YEAH, AS LONG AS YOUR FIRESTORE IS SET UP PROPERLY AND YOUR CAMERA IS SET UP PROPERLY - THAT SHOULDN'T BE A PROBLEM

I've heard that sound guys don't like the Firestore because of the noise, is that still an issue?

IT'S AN "ISSUE" BUT NOT REALLY. YOU HAVE A SHOT GUN MICROPHONE AND ARE SHOOTING THE CAMERA AND THE FIRESTORE IS CLOSE TO THE CAMERA. IT SHOULDN'T BE TOO MUCH OF A PROBLEM. IT DOES MAKE NOISE, BUT IT ISN'T AS NOISY AS PEOPLE MAKE IT OUT TO BE. IF YOU HAVE IT STRAPPED TO THE CAMERA AND ARE SOLEY USING THE CAMERA MIC - THEN YEAH NOT A GOOD IDEA

How long does it take to dump a full firestore?

I SAY IT TAKES ABOUT THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME AS YOU SHOOT. YOU SHOOT 100 MINUTES - IT TAKES ABOUT 100 MINUTES TO DUMP. IT'S NOT QUICK THAT'S FOR SURE

Am I alright with 2 of the high capacity batteries? Does it come with a separate charger, or how does charging work? How long does it take to charge a Firestore battery?

BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH FIRESTORE IS THE POWER. IT GOES THROUGH BATTERY LIKE WATER. I WOULD SAY GET THE LARGER BATTERIES LIKE THREE OR FOUR AND HAVE A CHARGER CHARGING THE DEAD ONES WHILE SHOOTING. ALSO TURN OFF THE FIRESTORE LIGHT PERIOD. THIS HELPS TREMENDOUSLY.

V4 now has VFR, correct? That was one of the last things I didn't like about the feature set of the firestore, so if that's working now than that's great.

So I guess if you have any thoughts on this in the next 16 hours, let them rip!

SORRY FOR THE CAPS (I'M NOT YELLING :) JUST TRYING TO DIFFERENTIATE MY FONTS FROM YOURS.

BEST OF LUCK,

OMAR

Thanks you guys!
 
Hey guys,

So I'm just back from the shop, and I'm playing around with my new Firestore. It ships with V3 these days, and includes the cradle that holds the large capacity batteries (it comes with 1 large capacity by default now). I'm just mentioning because the guy at the store was surprised that it came with the cradle, since he was going to sell it to my separately, as I gather he normally does.

The text is now black on gray instead of blue on blue. Thank the maker for that.

I was able to get 720pn working in P2, and I'm just now trying QT.

Do I need to upgrade to V4 to use quicktime with no import? When I select Quicktime PN the clips don't play back in quicktime on my mac, and they don't import into FCP 6, citing "Unknown file". They also don't play back on the camera... they have blocks of colours and audio pops and drop outs. Quicktime non native appears to work fine.

And then I guess another question: How long does it take to register the FS100 so I can download V4, which hopefully fixes the QTPN problem I'm having? I sent them an email with my info, as per the instructions on their website, but I would guess that means that it has to go through a human to work. Since it's afternoon here on the west coast, I'm concerned that no one will get to it until Tuesday next week, which is too late since that's when the show starts. I really need the QTPN functionality, since it will save time in editing when the editor doesn't have to convert anything.

Thanks for your help!
 
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Hmmmmmmmm to be honest, I always rent Firestores with the brand new filmware 4. I will say this - i did rent a Firestore one time (that wasn't updated) and shot at 1080 24p -which occasionally caused problems in post production in AVID. It basically made some audio and video clips at different lengths and wouldn't play the clips together. I was able to correct the problem by inputing the visual MXF clips only and importing the audio file separtely as QT or Wave fie and as opposed to a complete MXF file. When the firestore was updated, I never had a problem at all. But from what i hear to update the filmware doesn't take too long.

Alot of these questions seem to be more of a Final Cut questions though, which i can not answer. Hopefully someone on this board could help you better. You should go to a Final Cut forum to ask about the same questions regarding Firestore MXF clips in Final Cut and how to play/import. The Avid forum was immensly helpful on this topic of post work with the firestore.
 
- oh one more thing, You say you can't play back the clips on the camera? Did you make sure you set on your camera menu (other functions your firewire1394 on BOTH as opposed to EXT). Read the firestore manual carefully and make sure all the settings are correct.

here are the notes a rental (Tamberellin in NYC) house gives customers everytime i/we rent a firestore fs100

on the camera HVX200 menu
1) Free Run time code
2) VTR mode to change NDF or DF (Tc mode)
3) Other functions - 1394 Both, pc mode 1394

vtr mode menu
'Rec set up 1394 Regen OFF
1394 in Preset ON
PC MODE -1394 Device

FIRESTORE menu
Control - tapeless
Play From - Track List
Play - Play Clip
Functions - FA tapless
Set up: LCD LIGHT off
Alarm ON
Stop no video ON
External Control FILE
TC -EXT - TC non-drop
DVCPROHD rec

annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd that's basically what they recommend -hope this was helpful
 
Hi Omar,

Man, my post was horribly worded. The shock of spending $2800 rattled my brain.

I'm actually asking how long it takes focus to get back to me with a user name and password so I can get V4, or if anyone would be kind enough to email V4 to me. If it goes through a human at Focus, as it appears, I won't hear from them until Tuesday at the earliest, which would mean that everything for the 1st day will have to be P2 PN.

I was able to successfully edit the Quicktime right off the firestore in FCP, so that is working, as is playback of regular quicktime.

What's not working is Quicktime PN. When I go to play it back in the camera it's full of all kinds of blocks and noise, the picture and the sound pop in and out and the sound pops and drops as well. FCP will not accept the files. I have tried repairing the clips, to no effect. The QTPN functionality appears to be thoroughly broken on my Firestore. Obviously, if the V4 upgrade doesn't fix it, then I'll do a full exchange. I expect V4 to clear up that issue, though.

Thanks for your rundown of settings! That's great and concise!
 
It was more like $2650 I guess. $2075 FS100, $205 extra battery $62 ball head shoe mount, $310 tax :(

This is from Lorne Lapham Sales & Rentals in Vancouver BC. Do those prices sound about right? I was kind of in a situation where I needed to walk out of the store with a long form storage solution, and they didn't have any 16gb cards in stock, so I was stuck.
 
Omar67 said:
-

here are the notes a rental (Tamberellin in NYC) house gives customers everytime i/we rent a firestore fs100

on the camera HVX200 menu
1) Free Run time code
2) VTR mode to change NDF or DF (Tc mode)
3) Other functions - 1394 Both, pc mode 1394

vtr mode menu
'Rec set up 1394 Regen OFF
1394 in Preset ON
PC MODE -1394 Device

FIRESTORE menu
Control - tapeless
Play From - Track List
Play - Play Clip
Functions - FA tapless
Set up: LCD LIGHT off
Alarm ON
Stop no video ON
External Control FILE
TC -EXT - TC non-drop
DVCPROHD rec

annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd that's basically what they recommend -hope this was helpful
Click to expand...

User error :(

QTPN Works when I follow your setup plan there. Good stuff.

Ok! Now the last issue I have with this thing (aside from the price!): I'm getting some kind of subtle buzzing sound from the firestore.

I can hear it run, and that's fine, it seems to happen regardless if the fan is spinning. It's not the sound of the hard drive... I have an ipod and a laptop and a usb 2.5 inch drive, so I know what 2.5 inch drives sound like. It almost sounds like bearings that aren't quite lubed enough or something.

The sound will change and become louder when the device is tilted certain ways.

It's a quiet sound, compared to the roar of the fan, but my concern is that it is something that could potentially get worse.

Has anyone got any insight or thoughts on that?

The store I bought it from is closed for the long weekend, which is why you guys are getting all the newbie questions! Sorry!
 
I just purchased two hvx200's and two firestores. I was "thrown into the fire" so to speak when I learned I had to begin a shoot the next day with a camera I'd never touched and firestores I've never used.

Thank goodness, it all went smoothly.

My dumps don't quite take as long as Omar's seem to. But I organize the clips and simply copy over the lastclip.txt file and media folder over to the computer, format the fs-100, and go right back at it.

I only paid $1600 for each drive (but I realize you couldn't wait for shipping) from B&H.

I emailed my registration info and they replied the next day.

I unplug it all the time for dumps and it reconnects quickly with no problems.

The fan noise wasn't a factor for me (I didn't think was a "roar" anyway) because I used two wireless mics for talent through a board and into the HVX200's.

The other noise you describe... no clue. sorry. Neither of my drives do that.

The battery lasted all day for me. I DID get the extended battery because I just purchased it recently and apparently it's standard now along with the cradle.
 
Yeah, that noise that you are having is new to me as well. You should check with the store and see if there is a problem. I have rented many different firestores (probably 12 over the past year) at 2 different rental houses in New York, and never had that sound issue - so you should check it with your store. Does it consistently make a strange sound when the firestore is placed in a certain way? - its side, upside down etc.

either way definetely check the machine with the store.

Omar
 
Ug... $1600 :( With such a strong Canadian dollar these days that's a pretty significant difference. I hate getting forced into these things with no time to figure it out. That really burns me. Even if shipping it to Canada was pricey, it's still a $400 difference. Goddamnit.

Roar is maybe a bit hyperbolic, but I was pretty stunned to hear the volume of the fan when it kicks on. The worst part is that it goes on and off randomly. Sound guys are going to hate it for quiet scenes in small rooms. In fact, it sounds like it'll have to be P2 cards for that kind of scenario. What a disappointment, especially considering how much I shelled out for the unit. A metallic fin system with a larger 80mm fan or something would move the same or more air and spin at half the speed or less.

The other noise I'm hearing is very intermittent, and I don't think I can get it to stay on when I tilt the unit. It actually sounds like a neighbour down the block from me is using a circular saw, the way it sounds when you go in and out of the wood. It's obviously not loud like that, it just peaks out over the fan, but that's the type of sound it is.

My gear is gone for two weeks on a shoot, so I won't be able to deal with it until after that. I hope it's a case of it just being new out of the box, and after it's on for a few hours that goes away.

I doubt it though, since I don't have that kind of luck.
 
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