Film career

Re: Film career

I respect what you're saying a lot and I definitely haven't had to deal with any hardships so serious as you've been through, but I still think you're being a bit unfair to high school teachers and authority figures in general.

I do agree that the school system needs to be adjusted, but it is important that everyone have a foundation in both the humanities and the maths/sciences. Not everyone knows what they want to be from an early age, and having a well rounded education allows you to break free whereas a more vocational approach would further lock people into specific careers and the machinations of society. And while certainly there are many bad teachers who seem to discourage anything that doesn't conform to what is "normal," teaching does not pay that well, and most teachers have made a sacrifice to choose to go through college so as to educate others when they could have been lawyers or doctors and made far more money. I'm not saying all authority figures are sacrificing themselves for a better society (I actually think many just like positions of authority for the power trip) but credit should be given when it is due. That said, I went to a pretty decent high school (a public school, though...nothing too fancy) and really disliked a lot of it. I don't regret graduating for a second, though.

But education isn't so important as is what you make of it, and though a degree can help you "get ahead," so can self-taught skill. There are many ways to become successful, and all of them have their plusses and minuses. Still, I think none should be dismissed as right or wrong.
 
Re: Film career

Well put.

For the record, my hardships are no where near being HARD comapred to some people I know and other stories I have heard. Mine was a basic run of the mill kind. No violins needed here.

I completely agree with a solid foundation and by no way advocate a VOCATIONAL APPROACH. Most people NEVER know what they want to do much less having that approach at that age. I repeat, I by no way support a vocational approach.

One of the problems I think is that teachers make NOTHING in terms of salary. It is a noble gesture to become a teacher in todays world (My brother in law is a teacher in the Los Angeles school system and I hear it all PRO and CON).

I will always be the first to give credit where credit is due and I speak (as mentioned) in generality and do not state the NORM).

The reality is that the entire school system needs to be revamped; from the curriculum taught all the way up to the salaries handed out.
 
Re: Film career

I agree with both of you guys (john and policar). I've had some pretty awsome teachers in high school that got me motivated on subjects ive never even considered liking..and then i've had those teachers i hoped would get into a terrible accident on the drive over to school. Overall, I disliked high school to high degree. Not only could I not stand many of the classes, teachers and the long hours, I also couldnt stand most of the students within. I agree that high school doesnt necessarily focus on your strengths, but it does expand your horizons in a way... The teachers I've learned the most from wanted to be there because they were passionate about teaching and didnt (obviously) do it for the money. That is a pretty noble sacrafice, like Policar mentioned. I think most people would agree that high school is the most hated educational period in ones life.
 
Re: Film career

I can dig it. I hated High School as mentioned. Twas not the students though. There were plenty of arseholes of course but if my father told me one thing Ill never forget its that "No matter where you go in life, be it school, work or play, there is always going to be that one arse." I got along with everyone in school. I mean LITERALLY. If I didnt, no one else did either. I hung in all circles, jocks, skaters, surfers, geeks, preps, stoners. I got along with everyone it seemed and even at that age had the ability to recognize people for who they were and did not judge by click alone. (I was a Skaterboy :D )


Things that could help todays system?

1. Pay teachers more money

Serious. We trust these teachers with our children? NOt just to teach but to protect and basically 'babysit' all day? Have you even seen what the average teacher makes?

2. Pay them for the full year and not just 9 months

Pay them for the entire year and dont make them go get some job in the summer.

3. Hire more teachers so the STUDENT/TEACHER RATIO isnt 35 to 1

How can a teacher teach 35 kids in an hour a day?

4. Have the kids spend more time with ONE teacher instead of PERIODS 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 having a different teacher.

Perhaps if the ratio was lower and a teacher could spend more time with less students it could lead to a better structure and organization and not the BELL RINGS time to go, move on ot the next class mentality.

The government (State of Ca) needs to put more into the kids and more into the education of our kids. Not just the books, but the teachers, the system, the method, everything. If that means cutting back on other expenses withing the budget then so be it. Education should be a priority and Children really are the future. Need money? Make the DMV privatized and make these companies earn our business and not the joke of jokes that agency is and always will be.


My son starts 'K' next year and my wife and I are moving to Carlsbad (for those of you that know San Diego it is considerably more expensive that most areas). The reason? The school system in that district is better than where are currnetly at (80% proficiency comapred to 37% where we are at now).
 
Re: Film career

Wow, it seems i've got a completely different outlook of the education system being a Canadian. Very much like the US it is unneeded to go to filmschool to be successful in the film industry. That being said, I am going to filmschool this year at a university in Toronto (Hollywood North Baby!) but i am taking their evening courses (same as first year full course) because I didn't make it into their day course (competition was way to high). This doens't make any difference though, I can apply into second year next year knowing all the same profs who judge who can get into the program.

The reason I'm doing this? Not because I want to learn how to make films, or what makes a film good. Nor do I want to go simply to get a degree to fall back on. None of that is really important. I want to go for the experience. To share in other people's ideas and opinions. School expands your mind in more than just a way of learning technical skills. A school will teach you less technical skills than being on a film set and just watching them. A school is invaluable though in expanding your mind and allowing you to think outside of the conventions you lock yourself into simply by watching movies. It takes you from mimicking what you see to creating new things for others to see.

You don't need this to be successful but you definitely need it to be truly great. Post secondary education doesn't take up a large section of your life but the payoff can be great. Not in the amount of money you make, but in your self-improvement.

I myself wrestled with the idea of going to filmschool versus going into the workplace. Either one works. You can always go to filmschool later if you find out that you can't make it in without it.

My highschool life has been a very different one than you guys have described. I go to highschool in Canada, where our public education system is rated one of the highest in the world. Out of the top 10 schools in Canada, 1 is a private school and number 2 is a public school with private schools and public schools alike following underneath it. Our education system is capable of making extremely successful people right out of highschool. Our teachers pull in a ridiculous amount of money for the work they do... averaging 50k to 80k a year working only 9 months out of the year. They still complain too... my parents do more work than a teacher and make less money and work for the whole year.

I personally decided what I wanted to go into in my junior year (we used to have 5 years of highschool in Ontario and i opted to stay for the 5 years although it's switched to a 4 year program) i switched to a public school that specialized in the arts and ended up taking mostly visual arts and film courses. These courses helped make me a happier person and expanded my skills in ways I didn't think they could have expanded in. I ended up meeting a great deal of people all interested in the same thing as me and have already networked with a lot of people while still in highschool.

I myself have had quite the rough life at only the age of 19. I was diagnosed with Hodgkin's disease this past year and underwent 5 months of chemotherapy and 3 weeks of radiation therapy. It's cured now, but it's given me a new outlook on life. You really shouldn't waste it. Do what you really want to do and don't let other people tell you what you should be doing or how to do it. There's no right way to live your life. Other people will always press their insecurities and fears onto you. This is what your parents are doing when they tell you to go to filmschool or get a degree.

You don't *need* to do anything. John put it very well. You just need to be happy with yourself before you can really be successful. If you don't do exactly what *you* want to be doing then you're not a success even if you happen to make a lot of money. Money isn't everything. You can save your money for years and have it all set aside for the future or for school, but then in a split second it could all be taken away and it will have all be for nothing. Live your life the way you truly want to. If that means going to filmschool to learn and expand, great! If it means earning independence by going out on your own and making films or working on films that's also great. You need to do whatever you feel is right for you at the time.

Major cities offer a great deal more opportunity in the film industry regardless. A filmschool in one of those would be a good idea as they've probably got hookups with the industry there. I fortunately live in Toronto, third in the world for movies being made behind Bali and LA. I have tonnes of opportunities. Universal is donating $2 million to the university i'm attending to finance HD editing labs and HD cameras for the students. Will film school be worth it for me? You better believe it!

Another thing about filmschool too is that there's nothing stopping you from writing and working on your own films while you attend school... that's what I'm going to be doing. I did it in highschool, i can do it in university. With their equipment I might add.

Basically what I'm trying to say is: Don't let other people tell you what you should be doing. They're all wrong. You should be doing what you think you should be doing. That is the only way you will truly be satisfied with your decision. You'll be a success regardless, at least in your mind, if you follow that ideal.
 
Re: Film career

OK, here I go, I agree with John. I did go to College, I finished, but never graduated (by the way, in the college I attended Mexico, you need a Thesis to graduate, I passed on that).
I just turned 39 on Aug 30. If you are passionate for what you love to do, you will get it, but you really really have to know what you want and also want it bad enough. Riddley Scott said it once: It's not about the money or success. It's about how passionate you are about this, money and fame will come later. Follow your dream and don't let anyone tell you different. I graduated as a Graphic designer, I got a job in Advertising and climbed the ladder all the way to VP Creative Director (for whatever that's worth). Now I have the tools (My DVX of course), the support from my wife and a little bit of knowledge, which has come through the years (Not film school) of experience working with very talented people in the business. I am still learning the craft, but soon enough, I will get my reel together and make the jump. I moved from another country without a dime in my pocket, but I had a plan and a mission. I already got there. Now I have another plan, will I make it? I don't know, but what I do know is that I am gonna try as hell to get where I need to and hopefully my passion for this will overcome any obstacles I may encounter. Enough of this stuff. Learn as much as you can and get out there and start shooting, make movies, write them, shoot them. Tell stories. All you need is to really want it. "El que persevera alcanza" (In english it's something like If you persevere, you can reach). Look at Nike (those guys changed advertising forever), "Just do it!"

Good luck.
Eco
 
Re: Film career

It's a term for Americans who didn't graduate from High School but don't consider themselves drop outs.
Graduation Equivilence Diploma? Thats a close quess.
 
Re: Film career

Its not a 'term' its a test, specifically...

GED (General Educational Development) Tests measure the outcome of a high school education. The GED Tests consist of five tests, one in each of these subjects: Mathematics, Science, Social Studies, Writing Skills, and Interpreting Literature and the Arts.  


And I did drop out.
 
Re: Film career

Canada has something similar. I think it's a called a highschool equivilency test or something of the like. It's not considered the same in Canada as actually graduating highschool though.

There are a lot of small nuances in Canadian highschool that changes what kind of diploma you graduate with.

To get into certain post-secondary schools you need high marks in certain coded classes... there's O for open, W for workplace, C for college, M for university/college, and U for University. In order to get into a university's program they look at your marks and see if they're good enough to get into the program. There are no SAT's. Highschool equivilency tests I think are at College level...
 
Re: Film career

Interesting. Speaking of SAT's, one can take the GED and then, prior to entering College must take the SAT's.

Now, you can go to a Junior College (JUCO) but cant get any realy credit or advance beyond into A course of Major unless you take SATS.
 
Re: Film career

Yeah, SATs seem to be sepecific to schools in the US. If we want to go to a school in the US we canadians also have to take the SATs...

Luckily because i'm going to school here, I didn't need to take them... just bust my butt in my classes...
 
Re: Film career

I live in the US, (Virginia), and in this state, the SAT basically specifies whether you get accepted to a University or not. It really gave me a hard time. I received above average grades, but scored terribly on the SAT, (I'm no good at tests). This was the difference between going to a University and going to Community College. Also, two of my friends received much lower grades than me throughout high school, but scored higher than me on the SATs... So guess who got accepted to college, and who didn't... :(

Anyway, I'm 18 years old, and at Community College right now. After I transfer to a University, I'll get a Bachelor's in network engineering, or information systems, or something like that. I'm good with computers anyway, so, I can do pretty much anything with computers.

After college, I'm not sure what I'm going to do. Go to film school? Make films on my own? Both? Or just get a regular computer tech job, and work in an office for the rest of my life? It's my goal to do all of those. I shall have at least 3 occupations throughout my lifetime, ending with filmmaking...that's my dream at least. I'm scared...I want my mommy! :(

T-1000
 
Re: Film career

Hey, fellow virginian here.

You'll quickly find that your choices after school do more to define your life then your choices in school do. It's possible to make a living in film, even if it's inherrently difficult.

Here's an idea...graduate and move to New York, get a job doing what you know...in this case, computers, and spend the rest of your time assisting on every tiny film project you can get out to.

Even if you only work on a couple of films and barely scrape by, you'll learn a lot just by living and working in the big city.

No one has it figured out at 18, and if they say they do...they're either stupid or lying, but I can certainly say with experience that it's much more difficult to persue a dream when you're close to your 30's...so take advantage of the lowered expectations while you can.

There are a lot of us here who's lives have taken paths remarkably different from what we planned, so I'd say that this can be a good support group for those who are unsure about the future.

There's a point in every man's life when he has to reconcile dreams and necessity, but you're not quite there yet.
 
Re: Film career

this is an interesting post im glad i found it.  Ya i read earlier that you, john didnt agree with the school's systems and its lack of arts in many places.  I COMPLETELY agree and will go into detail below.  Also, Ive had a similar outcome to T-1000 above where i didnt do good enough on SAT and missed going to a state school by 50 pnts.  Unfortunately they dont consider film making skills on your transcript.  Now im at a community college down the street which cost me like 500 bucks.  Next fall however im going to SCAD so its all good but still the SAT system is wack.  I could be a genious but just dont like standardized tests.

on the issue of high school:
I went through a very film deprived high school.  We had a "video broadcast program" which I started for the school as a junior.  I had 2 main directors and sat back and taught people as well as smoothed out rough spots in the editing.  We started with next to no budget.  As the year progressed our show also become so censored that we dared to pick up our cameras of fear that our "librarians" would edit everything away.  It wasnt just frustrating it was WRONG!  The principle wanted to make everyone happy and avoid a situation where we could possibly affend anyone, when in reality he just didnt care for the arts or personal creativity, thus never fought for any advancement for our school.  I petitioned, debated, presented new approaches, and even got over a dozen staff members to lobby against this communist censorship.  It got us almost nowhere and the new system didnt even take effect until I graduated.

Point is unless you live in LA or new york these nice "schools of excelence" have awesome sports teams, nice facilities, and NO FILM PROGRAMS. Even the brand new schools have next to nothing decent. Theyre all a bunch of hokey professors who never got anywhere in their field and think they know the universe. Meanwhile theres people like me who have been lucky enough to have support of parents and work hard to learn. Or they also have 3 jobs like me and took a year to save for just a dvx. Anywho everything ive learned has been from self motivation and i have actually surpassed anything these schools have to offer. I actually started teaching the teachers who teach the film classes...if that makes sense. :) not that im here to boast but i truly wish the little guys like us could have the oppertunity to have nice (hd maybe ;) ) cameras and better equipment so that we dont spend all these early years sitting around wishing we had oppertunities. I know for a fact a few people who if they had the right goods they could produce magnificent work. But instead their $$$ for tapes, lights, and computers went to repainting our schools pool to yellow. Such a shame.

and ya, john, you brought up good suggestions for future changes in schools and unfortunately theyre all "if onlys". I believe teachers get paid year-round though its one of the advantages, not sure though. My mom has taught for over 20 years and has both hated and loved it. She is a good person and has good intentions when she teaches but im sure there have been students who just didnt favor her. Some people dont want to make the best of what they have and feel they either dont deserve the treatment they get or feel theres no point in staying in school if they have the power to decide. Some of these teachers deserve alot more respect than they get. Not that anyone contradicted this im just saying some people "hate school" thus hate anything involved with it. But i believe there is so much you miss without school.

I too was a friend to all, i never had a particular group and never avoided anyone. I loved the experience i had which is why i will love college. I get to live on my own but surrounded by people who, at filmschool at least, share a semi-common goal. We are all motivated and therfore bond togethor to form strong relations because obviously we are similar people in what we are passionate about. I look forward to a family too but i also wait for the day that i meet my future friends for life if not my industry partners. Yes theres the possibility you could all take seperate paths, but better to have loved than never loved at all right? (so to speak) Not to mention you begin a lot of networking.

So yes film school will cost over $100K and I could have just created a reel without college but it would have only been slightly possibily maybe half as good as one made in college. Its not just that though; in the time spent at school i also meet new people, aquire new skills and get my hands on all the equipment...for free! But also consider this...my tuition is a monster but giving high school my 2 cents and sticking to it i now have over $20,000 in scholarships. $4000 is from the state for the hope scholarship given to students with a B (80 gpa) average and i recieved $7500 for my SAT score after i retook it. another $7500 is coming from my existing reel which i compiled during high school (portfolio scholarship). so i could have blown off school but it gave back a lot to me. So now i get the fancy HD goods for next to nothing. Plus...my actors, script, and crew are all free. So why miss out on the college experience when it is just 4 or 5 years of your life. You have the rest of your life to get out into the industry and "work" for a living. These are oppertunities you dont get later in life.
 
Re: Film career

Well, instead of giving Billions of dollars to other countries who will never pay us back, the Feds could give that to the schools. Of course thats a whole new can of worms :-/

Yes, SATS are a joke and goes back to kids being penalized for not being good at math or art for that matter. Its a wacky world man. :P
 
Re: Film career

wow i reread my post above and realize its HUGE! sorry guys i kinda playin games and typing and didnt notice the paragraphs stacking up...thanks for readin tho
 
Re: Film career

The only other time I've seen posts as long as these is when the Michael Moore threads after Ferenheit 911. :P
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top