Fair rate for music videos...

[Kugar13]

Hello all,

Not sure if I needed to post this elseware, so please forgive if I'm in the wrong area.

Recently my pro-co shot a couple of music videos for a few bands who contributed music to one of our films. At the premiere we showed the music videos and now an overwhelming number of bands are inquiring how much we charge. I have no clue how to go about determining a fair rate for an indie film group making music videos for indie bands.

Anyone have any good advice for me? I've done some reseach and the answers vary greatly. Some people charge $100 per edited minute, some charge a flat rate, some by the hour, it is overwhelming.

Thanks guys and gals!

 

[capitalP]

First if you haven't read this thread http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=83958 you should.

And I'm pretty sure you've searched the boards here and found lots of topics on this. And third me personally I would charge $1500 flat rate if I do everything.

If I just come and point the camera and shoot then $500. I know that's pretty cheap but I keep in mind that The Bands are indie's like myself.

But I would stay away from the $500 route, usually $1500 can do it. When I say I do everything, meaning I will actually sit with them come up with concept and help locations, extras and etc...

But for $500 all they get is my physical presence and the camera.

But some people charge $5000 and their pretty much worth it, so it really depends on you.

 

[Kugar13]

wow!

wow!

Wow! Thank you for the informative post and link to an amazing post about building and maintaining clients! I am very-very thankful for the information!!!

 

[capitalP]

Glad to help.

 

[JonathanLB]

This is a depressing area of concern for me because I realized early on that I can't shoot really low budget music videos as first of all I'm not a DP, not a videographer, and don't want to be. I'm a music video director, and a director in general, though right now I would say my skills as a music video director are further along. I'll be posting my newest video on the HVX section next week, I have a rough cut but I don't like people to judge or see rough cuts especially when we haven't sat with the DP yet to color correct and we're still playing

What's tough for me is these guys on Craigslist offering music videos for $200 (seen it, trust me), or at most maybe $500. I think of myself as a guy who can make low budget productions happen, but it's not worth my time to make any music video with less than a $5,000 budget unless I'm doing it for my reel only. In other words, if a band gave me $2,000 and I love their music, I may at this point put another $2,000 of my own money into the project and make them the video anyway if I think they really have a great chance to make it and I feel passionate about the song. That will only be the case for another video or two, though, because I'm getting to the point where I have a strong enough reel I won't work unless I'm properly paid. I can't just do this for a hobby, especially not when I can get other work (corporate work, etc.) and make cash.

I'm not an idiot, using the HVX200 isn't overly difficult, nor is putting together my jib, dolly tracks, etc., but for me to film a video for a band myself would be strange as I am not a DP and don't know nearly enough about lighting. I just know what I like and how to communicate with a professional DP to get pro results. So the idea of a $500 music video is a joke to me, we spent significantly more than that on craft services on my last shoot. Even $1,500 is a joke, we can't do work like that, I'd charge almost that much for my equipment for one day and for my post-production equipment for however long was needed. That is without paying anyone, any food costs, any equipment rentals above what I own, any pay for myself, any insurance, any permits, etc.

A permit alone from FilmLA is $685 minimum.

So I guess I've come to the conclusion that once I finish building my music video reel (just one more killer video will be fine), I don't want to do non-label work anymore. Not unless the band has the cash, and 99% don't. I just didn't come here to make amateur work and if someone wants you to film an entire music video and edit it yourself, I mean, seriously that's a joke. No offense to anyone because the band gets what they pay for, it's not your fault they aren't paying fairly for a real shoot, but I (I should say "we," my business partner and I) just am not interested in doing work I can't be proud of and therefore really can't work with those types of budgets. A crew of 8 I consider to be as small as I can shoot with, that'd be like director, producer (my business partner, who would also drive the truck and help with paperwork, etc.), DP, 1st A.C., on-set capturing, gaffer, and two grips. That's as small as we can really do.

The last shoot we had director, producer, unit production manager, 1st A.D., DP / A Camera operator, B Camera operator, 1st A.C., gaffer, one electric, one swing, one grip, hair/makeup artist, on-set capturer, two PAs, two set dressers, behind-the-scenes videographer, actor, actress, and several unpaid extras (friends of the band). We were, by the way, supposed to have 6 total grips and electrics, it was scaled down to 5 and one was stranded in Chicago, leaving us understaffed with just 4, which was extremely hard but somehow we kept on schedule. Honestly we were still under the level of crew that we could have used, because we had no wardrobe, no art director or production designer (I served as both wardrobe consultant and art director, along with directing, so I had enough responsibilities as I also co-produced).

I can imagine shooting a music video with a crew of 4 I guess, like with the DP and director in one, maybe a 1st A.C., a grip, and a gaffer, shoot to enough P2 cards so you don't have to transfer, I suppose, or task the 1st A.C. with that. But to shoot something entirely by yourself seems insane to me.

Our minimum price is $5,000 and that doesn't get you much. If the budget is $5K you will have to provide your own location(s) and we likely won't rent any equipment, just use what we have, and hire a minimal crew (6-7 people besides us), probably simple editing, etc. It will look professional, I wouldn't make anything if it didn't, but it won't be highly complicated and won't be competitive with MTV quality stuff. For $10,000 we can do a lot more, that's more like we can find a decent location maybe with a standing permit to save costs, we can rent a few lights if necessary but nothing extensive, and probably be able to come up with a pretty killer music video but not a ton of bells and whistles. For $15,000 then we're talking, I can make you a killer video that competes with anything on MTV for $15K. But short of that you have to cut corners.

The sick irony is that the less money the client pays, the more work you have to do. If someone paid me $40,000 to make them a video I could task a lot of stuff out to other people, my UPM for instance could do all of the logistics, and I could just come up with the concept, hire my favorite DP, and worry about the story details. Yet I'd still make a lot of cash for the work I did. But if you pay me $4,000 now I have to figure out how we can get a free location, somehow, how we can maybe get people to work for a discount on this shoot, which takes more searching and more risk that people will flake or not be good enough for our standards, etc.

As long as people are willing to make music videos for $500 or even $1,500 I won't be able to compete with the prices there, I mean I just don't have any interest in that. It's impossible to make any money doing that unless you literally show up with your camera and record them a few times, hope for the best, edit it together, no story, performance only, etc. Then you can make a few bucks but it's sadly just a few bucks and no pride in your work, really, as you won't be doing anything special at all. So I have to compete in quality and hope some people, i.e. probably only labels, will be able to afford my work. Ah well!