DOF in Batman Begins

[Jay Laville]

Just watched this for the 1000 time, love the film. One thing I noticed however, is that nearly every single conversational scene shallow depth of field was used, over and over again. in fact its very rare do you you find many scenes in this film where everything is in focus.

Being new to the film scene, is it possible to over use this technique in a short film for example, or is there a general notion of when to use it and when not to. I know about it helps highlight what the audience should be paying attention to, but have heard comments when people have criticised another indie film maker for over using this technique. Be nice to know if there is a general rule of thumb, or if this is part of the whole creativity thing to figure out yourself :huh:

 

[Chris Santucci]

I was watching a scene in a film the other day where a character was walking down the sidewalk (toward camera) where she was framed from about the waist up. The background was out of focus, but you could make out cars, etc. I remember thinking how distracting it would have been if everything behind her would have been IN focus. There was just too much detail back there that would have drawn the eye away from the subject.

Certainly it's possible to make poor decisions about technique. The trick is to know WHEN you should have shallow DOF and when you should not.

.

 

[Jay Laville]

thats really what i want to get to grips with i mean take these snap shot examples, do you think they warrant the use of shallow dof, if it all had been in focus would it of given a different impact or a had different feel?

 

[bimdas]

i've noticed in the majority of films I've seen they use shallow dof for conversation scenes.
its been a technique in cinematography since forever to make focal targets for the audience. but notice most of the time it is used subtly and the background isn't totally lost in a sea of bluriness just like your examples of the dark knight which was my fave film for 08

 

[Kholi]

If you're using a system that mimics the way a "film" camera works, I.E. the 35mm Adapter, then what dictates this is composition. What's important in the "shot", what is not?

Is the shot being covered as a master only? All tights or close-ups?

I stopped thinking about DOF a while ago when I realized that it's really only one small part of the overall "picture". There're other pieces of said puzzle what effects the fall-off in a single frame. The amount of light, for example.

Savvy?

 

[Popsiclestand]

To me, shallow DOF signifies immediately what I should be focusing on in the scene. I think of it as a part of the story-telling technique. Because films generally move so quickly, one has to know exactly what things are important for them to pay attention to.

Particularly in dialogue sequences where the camera switches back and forth from person to person over and over again, isolating each character from the background with a shallow DOF indicates that the conversation they are having is important and personal -- that they are talking to each other and no one else. It brings the audience into that conversation much more naturaly, rather than making the audience an intruder on the conversation (since they obviously can't really focus on what's in an out of focus background).

I think for the scenes you posted, Jay, the DOF does just that. I don't find the DOF to be dramatic in those though, just very natural. Think about when you're having a real-life conversation with someone -- unless they're really boring, you're not paying attention to the things behind them, you're looking at their eyes, their mouths...that's what the shallow depth of field mimics -- intense concentration on a particular subject.

My two cents.

 

[Jay Laville]

To me, shallow DOF signifies immediately what I should be focusing on in the scene. I think of it as a part of the story-telling technique. Because films generally move so quickly, one has to know exactly what things are important for them to pay attention to.

Particularly in dialogue sequences where the camera switches back and forth from person to person over and over again, isolating each character from the background with a shallow DOF indicates that the conversation they are having is important and personal -- that they are talking to each other and no one else. It brings the audience into that conversation much more naturaly, rather than making the audience an intruder on the conversation (since they obviously can't really focus on what's in an out of focus background).

I think for the scenes you posted, Jay, the DOF does just that. I don't find the DOF to be dramatic in those though, just very natural. Think about when you're having a real-life conversation with someone -- unless they're really boring, you're not paying attention to the things behind them, you're looking at their eyes, their mouths...that's what the shallow depth of field mimics -- intense concentration on a particular subject.

My two cents.

Very informative thanks, so I guess the different degrees on how intense the bokeh is also helps? How much you want the audience to subconsciously identify the background or if you want it completely blurred out to then immediatly show in full view perhaps works best in horror films.As you said the bokeh in the above images are not that blurred out just softly done. Am I on the right tracks or am I talking garbage? :huh:

 

[Chris Santucci]

thats really what i want to get to grips with i mean take these snap shot examples, do you think they warrant the use of shallow dof, if it all had been in focus would it of given a different impact or a had different feel?

You also have to keep in mind that there are practical things to consider when making lens choices for shots. Sometimes you just HAVE TO use a normal to wide lens. Sometimes you HAVE TO have a certain amount of depth of field to accommodate movement of multiple actors.

You can't always throw the BG completely out of focus. Sometimes it's just not possible to do based on the configuration of the set, lens focal length, movement, and of course aperture.

.

 

[Michael Y Wong]

You also have to keep in mind that there are practical things to consider when making lens choices for shots. Sometimes you just HAVE TO use a normal to wide lens. Sometimes you HAVE TO have a certain amount of depth of field to accommodate movement of multiple actors.

You can't always throw the BG completely out of focus. Sometimes it's just not possible to do based on the configuration of the set, lens focal length, movement, and of course aperture.

.

Awesome point.

As said already, DOF is primarily used to direct the viewers attention in efforts to maximize impact in pushing the story forward. To me, closeups always have more 'leeway' in having more DOF and out of focus backgrounds. Medium and Wide shots with shallow DOF always seem 'unnatural' but if the story warrants it, why not.

If motivated appropriately via the story (where it doesnt become distracting, or perhaps a gimmick) I'd say you can take DOF control as far as you wish! (out of focus bokeh light circles always look sooooo nice)

 

[Postmaster]

I think the last one of the screengrabs is green screen.

Frank