Documentary Frustration (permits)

G

Giganova

Well-known member
Hi all --

I started shooting some test footage over the last week for my planned documentary about Jazz, but is has been very frustrating so far:

When I set up my tripod in the street to shoot a scene, drivers stop their vehicles and shout at me that I cannot film them. The police occasionally stops and asks me for my permit (which I don't have because it's a one-man project and I don't have the budget for insurance). When I shoot a jazz bar or a store from across the street, the property managers run across the street and say that I am not allowed to film their properties. My negotiations with jazz bar owners to get a location permit to film inside a jazz bar have been unsuccessful so far, and it's virtually impossible to find a jazz musician who isn't signed to a label that holds the copyrights to their performance, so I can't film a gig either.

It seems that for every single shot I need a permit that is very difficult to obtain. Have you guys had similar experience? I am surprised and frustrated that I need "permission" of some sorts for every single frame of my movie! I am temped to give up and drop this project because I didn't expect so many obstacles to shoot a documentary!
 
Yes you need permission to videotape people and places. People often try to avoid it but it is a reality. Preproduction and research is your best tool. Put together an outline of your project and create a 1 sheet that you can share with people to tell them what you're doing. If you don't have money you should still be able to get people to get involved if you come across professional and sincere. Contact managers or clubs that interest you and ask to meet with them to discuss your project. If they like what you're doing, then they may be in a position to help you get release forms and permission from musicians playing at their venues or the owner of the property. If you shoot without getting release forms your only setting yourself up for trouble down the road. If anyone is interested in purchasing your doc they will expect it to come with all of the release forms to avoid legal matters.

Yes it is frustrating. Music clearances can be extremely difficult. However, if there's a story that you want to tell, you should pursue it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
I am not an established doc film maker, but I have many years of TV experience and I'm working on my first doc now. It is a challenge. But, if you love what you do, I think the challenge is worth it. There's my 2 cents.
 
Thanks for your reply, tumbleweed. I love filming and are committed to that project, but I honestly didn't expect that it costs so much energy and time to get permits before the shooting can even start.
 
the production is only as big/compicated as you make it.
I shoot on a constant basis in public areas and not only do I never get grief, I feed cops one liners on occasion and use em comedy relief.
I seldom tote the sticks because they puts people in defense mode, as does a light kit and external mics. I shoot hand held, knowing I can tabelize anything that may need it in post. I shoot in preset knowing I wont be color correcting so much as color creating and an image is what I need in the field.
If done right, all of your shots are in the can by the time you have a release signed and if a good people person, they'll always be happy to sign this.
I have not asked permission in 20 years. I have found it easier to just get what I need and move on.
 
Grinner, do you shoot DOCUMENTARIES? I´m just asking because I never heard of a broadcaster that would buy your doc if you don´t have all releases in place. Even CurrentTV wouldn´t...
 
Giganova said:
Thanks for your reply, tumbleweed. I love filming and are committed to that project, but I honestly didn't expect that it costs so much energy and time to get permits before the shooting can even start.
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Put yourself in your subject's position ... how would you react if a stranger was obviously shooting you and/or your property without consulting with you before hand and getting your permission. Say you looked out the window right now and saw someone across the street with a camera on a tripod pointing it directly at the window you're looking from. Make you a little nervous, wonder what the h**l he's up to shooting you? Or think about the musicians - for most of them their performances aren't a hobby - they're their life and soul and the way they feed themselves and their family. Think it might make them a little uncomfortable to feel someone is trying to cash in on their work and their art without even giving them so much as the time of day or the courtesy of asking if it's okay with them? Sure, asking permission from everyone you shoot and the owners of every place that you want to film is going to be a pain in the backside, but never mind the law, it's simply the proper and courteous thing to do, treating the subjects of your film with the same respect you'd want them to give you.
 
Not to be glib; what do you think all those people on the credits are doing? 90% of (most) doc happens in pre-production. All those people working 40 hour weeks for months to years. Unless you are talking about a very intimate project one man docs are -near- impossible to pull off. Be certain you will be doing the job of 10 to 20 people at a minimum and that takes time and sweat.

My suggestion is to find local docs that you know of, read the credits, and start making some phone calls. Most will be happy to meet for coffee (your treat) and talk about your project. Have a solid treatment ready to present. Perhaps they will want to help you on your project, at worst they will provide a wealth of info on contacts and getting things done.

A even better idea would be to get work on a local documentary that has experienced hands at the helm. Contacts, experience, AND confidence in addition to a paycheck; can't be bad.

Good luck
 
I may be dead wrong in this but I'm certain that you are allowed to film almost anything you want in public with the exception of power plants, military facilities, and other areas deemed sensitive to national security.

Check out: http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm

Having said this, getting people's cooperation is much more helpful, and if people are running across streets to stop your filming you may want to consider a different approach. Half the fun of shooting, in my opinion, is the people you meet and the unexpected places that conversations might take you.

Cheers
 
Yup, you are dead wrong on this. The link you provided is about private people`s right to take photographs. The rules for PJ are also very different than for documentary film makers. The big difference here is that a documentary is considered commercial use and you need apropriate releases if you want to make it public. If you don´t want to ruin your life due to copyright and/or personal right infringement suits you SHOULD consult a copyright lawyer before you start shooting. There is too much at stake to play russian roulett IMO. Besides, as I stated before, even outlets like CurrentTV won`t air a single second of your work if you don`t provide releases for the persons, the properties and the music you show/use...
 
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Yeah, if you're standing on public property and shooting, you're ok (that's the way it works for the TV network I freelance for, anyway). Anyone speaks on camera, get a release, especially if on private property. If you're outside, on public property, getting voluntary "man on the street" interviews, you might be ok - depending on how it's used. Any private property, you need a release, period.
 
Mbw,

Thanks for setting this straight. The primary difference then rests in what one plans to do with the work. Yes? If I'm shooting for fun it's quite different than if I'm shooting for commercial release.

Could you provide any links where this might be researched a little further?

Cheers.
 
If you are shooting on public property, ie the sidewalk, for commerical purposes most cities demand you have permit to do so. The rules vary from city to city so you have to find out what your local rules are. A lot of people ignore this and shoot "guerilla style" but that is at your risk. The advent of the palmcorder size cams like the DVX have made guerilla pretty easy to pull off as long as you don't don't use sticks or lighting. The rule for police tends to be "sticks on the ground" and/or creating a public obstruction, but again, depending on the city, a cop could confiscate all your equipment and media if caught shooting without a permit.

This is the exact kind of thing that consulting a local experienced filmmaker can offer advice on.

Cheers
 
Thanks for the comments, which are very helpful!

I guess I should revise my attitude, have friendly talks with people before shooting and get releases. Talking to people before shooting might give me new leads and friendly contacts which should be helpful for the doc. I'd rather spend my time shooting instead of being on the phone for half of the day, but if the doc benefits from it in the end, so be it.
 
As unsexy as the phone calls, paper work, and "that legal stuff" can be it's an absolute necessity, IMO, to know what you are doing before you go out so you don't paint yourself into a corner down the line. Like others have said, if you want to sell the doc everything and everybody will need a release. Even if you think you should be okay a distribution company won't want to buy your doc if they think they'll end up in court. That's time and money coming out of their pocket and they'll just move on because there are so many other fish in the sea.

Even things as seemingly benign as cell phone ring tones will most likely need to get cleared. Here's a quick article about some of the hell "Mad Hot Ballroom" went thru w/clearing things.


-A
 
Giganova said:
Thanks for the comments, which are very helpful!

I guess I should revise my attitude, have friendly talks with people before shooting and get releases. Talking to people before shooting might give me new leads and friendly contacts which should be helpful for the doc. I'd rather spend my time shooting instead of being on the phone for half of the day, but if the doc benefits from it in the end, so be it.
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Yes, you should definitely do all of the above. As well as making calls, spend time in the clubs you're trying to shoot. Talk to people. Get to know them and get them to know you. If you're not willing to do this, then it seems to me that you're not actually very interested in the story you're trying to tell, that you just want to grab it and go - and that's why you're getting so much negative response. The most important thing in any documentary is ACCESS. Do you have access to the people and the story you want to tell? If you don't, then you don't have a documentary, simple as that.

How can you possibly tell this particular story with any authenticity if you don't even know the subjects well enough for them to be aware of what you're doing? You've already got strikes against you now because you started shooting without first making contact. You're going to have to build trust with these people and that may require you to be humble and admit that you were a schmuck for not respecting the privacy and artistic integrity of the people you started shooting without so much as a "hello".

And if you only want to shoot but don't want to do any leg work or paperwork or phone calls, then what expectations do you have for this documentary you're making? Do you expect it to make it any further than your own living room? If you're just doing this for your own kicks, then what possible incentive do your subjects have for letting you interfere with their lives and their work?

I'm sorry if I'm being harsh, but I've spent the last two years (off and on, not constantly) working on a documentary set in Copenhagen about squatters who are very suspicious of strangers with cameras - partly because some elements of their community are illegal (well, they're squatters, so actually everything about them is essentially illegal), and partly because they have been burned before by sensationalist "journalism". We have spent a great deal of time and effort - and money - to gain their respect and trust, and we have to do it all over again every time we go back (about once a year) - but if we didn't do this, why would we even bother going there to shoot? It's not only what we have to do, it's also an incredibly important part of making connections and gaining access to other people and parts of the story that we would never have known about or been able to approach.

Alright, I've said my piece. Best of luck with your project. I think you have an opportunity for a great experience if you play your cards right.

Robert
 
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I can't believe the amount of misinformation here.

You can shoot anyone or anything when you're on public property. EVEN IF you don't have a permit. The permit isn't to allow you the footage, but to allow you to shoot (so you don't bother anyone while shooting).

Permits from city administrations for documentaries are cheap (if not free), fast, and easy to get -- I get a blanket permit to cover the entire city for the entire period of the shoot.

If you don't put down a tripod, you don't need a permit. Once again, permits are to prevent your crew from being a pain while shooting, NOT to prevent or give you access to the shot. NOBODY CAN PREVENT YOU FROM SHOOTING OR USING FOOTAGE SHOT IN PUBLIC. However they can prevent you from being a nuisance while shooting -- which is becoming more and more an excuse to try to exercise authority to censor.
 
Permits to shoot on city streets are a good thing, especially for fiction films.

Access to a documentary subject is something else entirely.

If you're making a documentary, you can have all the permits you like and a police escort to boot.

But that's entirely beside the point if you're making a documentary about artists or other real people, and the subject(s) of your documentary don't trust you.

You might as well go home, even if it's just down the block.

You DON'T have a story.

End of story.
 
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pmark23, I actually think your post is very misleading. You are right, as long as you shoot from public property almost anything goes - BUT that absolutely does not mean that you can use that footage in your documentary. As stated by some before you need for everybody and everything that apears in you film releases. You might be able to take a chance on something but without any releases your commercial value of your documentary is ZERO because nobody will buy it. Don´t confuse it with shooting for TV news, thats a totally different animal.
 
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I am not aware of any broadcast outlet that will air something without release forms on everyone and everything that appears on camera. This can be taken to the extreme such as a show like "Wife Swap" where even a sony logo on a TV is covered up to avoid legal issues. All of the books are usually turned around on the bookcases to avoid having to clear all of the titles. This is the most extreme case I've experienced but I do know that people are often blurred out if you can recognize them and a release form was not obtained. Do not expect to be able to shoot anyone and anything without a release form and have something marketable.
 
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