do you guys use a slider on many production ?

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deleuze3

Well-known member
Hi,
I was wondering if you guys use a slider on many of your productions.
I mean, would you leave the house without it for a production, is it an essential part of your kit to add value to your vision?

Have a good day,
deleuze3
 
Short answer..... It depends.

I keep a few different camera support tools on my van, including a Dana Dolly with assorted length speed rail and lowboy stands, as well as a Pocket Dolly for tighter locations. I don't use them on every shoot, but it is nice having convenient camera movement when needed.
 
Several years ago I bought a MYT Works 4' slider combo kit(slider and what's essentially a set of foam wheels on a frame that you can do some longer/more free form "slider" moves with as along as the surface is smooth) so that I could have a quick, down and dirty slider at my disposal that I could pull out, throw down and grab a quick shot with, without a lot of set-up(I have a Cam-Tram system that is very nice, but it is a build-up). It sits in storage most of the time. It's biggest selling point to me of being a "fully assembled" unit so I could always have a quick slider set-up available is also it's biggest negative, too, because it takes up so much storage space and there are other, more necessary things that I need and use more frequently, soI no longer keep it in the truck at all times anymore. I only carry it now if a slider has been requested or I really think I will use it.
 
Never actually comes out of the van - too much pressure to shoot fast.

.. and when there is time I use a dolly as the mass of the system means you can make nice moves.

Ive never got the purpose of a shot that is just a slide, usually one needs to counter pan or your subject just looks like it is passing on a conveyor belt. And once you are sliding and counter panning generally one needs to pull focus.. so you need a nails slider to have operators in contact, not a small light one.

Now shooting in a ploughed field or on a rocky beach? Well levelling tracks is a nightmare.. so that is the proper time to use a slider.
 
I have a Cinevate Atlas 200, which is heavy duty and lives on 4' chromed steel rods in a Pelican 1750 case in my ute. So I always have it with me. It gets pulled out very frequently, as it's so fast to setup. I also have 8' rods that I'll also pack when I know I'll need a longer slide, or if I want to create an overhead rig for a shot. Sometimes I'll even put my jib on top of it to create poor-man's techno crane shots.

It's the most versatile and frequently used piece of grip I own.

You're never going to get the same level of control that you can have with a proper ride-on dolly. But for smaller jobs where I don't have a grip truck or time to lay track, it comes in very handy.
 
Grug said:
Sometimes I'll even put my jib on top of it to create poor-man's techno crane shots.

You're never going to get the same level of control that you can have with a proper ride-on dolly. But for smaller jobs where I don't have a grip truck or time to lay track, it comes in very handy.
Click to expand...


Have to agree. I have gotten some great shots by mounting my Porta-Jib Traveler to my Dana Dolly to emulate a Peewee.

My doorway dolly and track no longer rides in my van, and will only be added upon advanced notice.
 
I like sliders and always have one with me.

At work we have the Kessler Crane 3' CineSlider. It's big and heavy and the track has a bump in it that I can't seem to fix. They want me to send it in to get repaired but Ive put it off.

I have a DUZI that for the most part is pretty good. Small 24" is perfect for me since I generally don't do long slider shots. It's way to fast for me. Hard to get constant speed. Cinevate improved the cart and has a new flywheel design but I decided to not upgrade mine. I feel the $200 cart upgrade doesn't fix the issue. The DUZI 4 with flywheel is $580.

I decided to go with the Rhino Gear 24" EVO with motion. So far i'm impressed with it. Very well designed and made. I haven't had a slider with motion control before. It's so much better. The moves are perfect and controllable. I can also program it to keep going back and forth continuously. Great fro a second camera angle on interviews. it has a smooth transition on the end so it doesn't jerk. Very smooth. Now I just need the Arc to keep the subject in the middle while sliding.

Rhino has a trade in program going. Send them a qualified slider for $500 credit. I'm going to send my DUZI in and get the Arc for paralax moves and a flywheel. The credit covers both and a little more. I planned this out on a Black Friday 20% off sale. This whole system was on the expensive side but I like the system and if i want to replace the rails with longer ones it's easy to do. No sending it in either. All user fixable as far as the rails go. I really don't like the fact that Kessler requires me to send them a 3 foot slider to replace the rails.

Thats my $0.02 :-D
 
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What sort of work do you do? What would you like to do? Will the expense of a good slider help you get better jobs or make better sequences?

On jobs I work, sliders are used less often than a few years ago. Maybe a style/fad thing...but more like they're not being overused. :-) I think for a while, when affordable sliders became common, there was a bit of "if your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail" thing going on. :-)

On bigger jobs (and for me, that usually means a Sprinter-sized grip truck...nothing that huge), a proper (or more proper) dolly and some crew. On many jobs, we're doing more gimbal stuff. Yes, they're not the same thing....but that seems more like today's hip "add production value" thing for certain gigs. On plenty of gigs with nice production values, we don't use one...sometimes we do. Depends on the job. I don't work much indie fiction/narrative stuff... Much more corporate, documentary, newsmag, etc. And I don't really like that "random slider second-camera interview" thing, though plenty of people do. Oh: when filming music performance, we use them pretty regularly. But I don't do much of that these days. So how often do you think you'll use a slider?

If you're heading down the DP-for-hire/owner-operator track and expect to work small jobs and there's not a good grip house nearby, I could see buying one.

But that's not my world. I'm a decent operator, own a C300 etc...but mainly use it for verite doc stuff. I spend more time as a producer and mixer. So I have plenty of other things to spend money on (e.g., crew and audio kit!). So I've hired people with sliders and rented sliders & dollies...but have a few good rental houses around here...

Not sure I'm helping, but if you do buy a slider, don't cheap out...get a good one...

Great comments from everyone else...A variety of perspectives...
 
I have a 3ft Kessler Cineslider that often travels with me. I've had it for about six years, used it all over the world in all sorts of conditions. Rock solid piece of kit.
 
I work on commercial productions with small crews and we use a Dana dolly on every single shoot. As far as smaller, fixed length sliders, I don't really like them. If space or speed is an issue then sure they can be great, otherwise I've found the length of the slide is too small and they're too unstable for even small-medium sized camera set ups. But, if your budget is limited, you are a single operator, are pleasing your clients with little dolly moves, or are using a small camera then it can be a no brainer.

Maybe going against Liam's point of view, in a documentary setting I would never lug around a slider. I don't think the payoff is large enough. For me this means shots that could use a dolly move are either static or replaced with a pan. I also think the products like the second shooter or kesslers equivalent are huge gimmicks and think that movement for a b cam profile is ridiculous.
 
Slider - do you need it?
That is a CREATIVE judgement that must be made for each and every shot.
*Never blow it off because it's more work. But also never use it "just to use it".

That Dana Dolly is the real deal - GREAT frikkin' tool for bigger moves.

For smaller moves - which can often be VERY effective - I've always carried a smaller slider, but frequently it would get "blown off" because of the added setup and operation time.
I recently got that new DUZI V4 slider and THAT is the best small portable slider I have ever used. Definitely worth the money. And it's fast to get great results with it BECAUSE of that built-in flywheel.

ALSO:
My secret weapon: a 3-foot X 6-foot piece of Masonite with support rails on the back.
I can just throw that thing on the ground or a table or stands...then I just toss the whole camera rig on a PRO skateboard...YES, a skateboard - but a GOOD ONE I got from a real serious skateboard builder. Boom! Instantly SMOOTH AS GLASS slides. And with the width of the Masonite I can get arcing slides with my other "Camera skateboard" that has adjustable axles for a repeatable arc. That skateboard only cost like $30.
Now YES, this is a little unorthodox maybe - but 95% of the time I can get the slide shot/dolly style shot from that piece of kit before some other shooter has even made their decision to pull their gear out or not.
 
Ned - I'll gladly be the dolly grip on your next production... if that extra stability is needed in the bins. :-KnockedOut(D
I've got the 24" glide cam Vista track that I got for a song... but since it hardly ever gets used - still paid too much for it. Small gimbal is my go-to now instead of slider. Or bigger gigs - the dana is great. Or even bigger gigs with repeatable focus, etc. then it's doorway dolly & grip truck etc .
 
I have a EZFX slider that works great and 6' rails. If the job pays enough I use it if it adds production value to the particular project.
When I get a van I plan on leaving it in the van
 
I got my slider many years ago and I won't sell it as it is still being used with great result just not as frequently used these days. Since a slider became popular many new motion tools have emerged so I look upon it just like one of many tools to move the camera.
 
A friend who I shoot with a lot has a Dana dolly, it's pretty good, we use it here and there. I have one of those junky Konova sliders, it's not so good, I rarely use it anymore although I used to use it with my 5D MKIII when I traveled and I did get some good stuff in remote areas that way. I am interested in the same setup as Erik, the Rhino slider with Motion and the Arc, seems like a cool piece of gear as I love shooting TL (I am but a rank amateur at it) and it would be handy for a second interview angle here and there. I often have issues with getting a clean second angle with a slider on interviews though, there are usually C-stands, light stands, edges of Chimeras, etc. in the way so it is really only good if you construct the shot for the slider, then move your A camera into position and hopefully can get the main shot you need. The BTS look is super cool to me, I like seeing the clutter but clients sometimes just want a clean shot, which can be tough with the slider on interviews.
 
We use the Dana Dolly a lot for product beauty shots, sometimes on interviews and scenics. If the network loves it, we use it. Would not be my first choice of gear for doc shoots, though.
 
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