Dan Harmon's writing method
- Thread starter Saharanturtle
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Eric Boellner
Well-known member
Which is why it's the perfect structural theory for writers who don't want a paint-by-numbers formula for screenplays. It's detailed enough to show what every good film has, and yet simple enough to give the writer his/her own space for originality and personal style.
Completely disagree with this idea that structure limits originality and personal style.
Eric Boellner
Well-known member
I never said that.
Batutta
Major Contributor
Always good to remember--
"I think the danger of craft is that it needs to be in second position to what it is that you’re doing. It’s seductive to put it in first position, often because what you’re doing is meaningless or worthless, or just
more of the same. So you can distinguish yourself by being very, very good at it." - Charlie Kaufman
"I think the danger of craft is that it needs to be in second position to what it is that you’re doing. It’s seductive to put it in first position, often because what you’re doing is meaningless or worthless, or just
more of the same. So you can distinguish yourself by being very, very good at it." - Charlie Kaufman
He mentions something along the lines of only having one protagonist, yet about 5000 indie films could be described as "a bunch of peoples lives cross each other in some meaningful way in a short period of time." Some of these are probably even considered good movies. Explain.
Eric Boellner
Well-known member
Could you quote the comment from Harmon or section of the article to which you're referring? Also, as a side-note, it really wouldn't kill you to say "please."
Batutta
Major Contributor
Those movies aren't really a single story. They are multiple stories intertwined. You would apply the paradigm to those individual stories...For instance, you could easily pull apart each story in Pulp Fiction and apply those 8 steps. But the more I think about it, I'm not even sure you can call what Dan Harmon's done a story structure. It's really more a structure for designing character arcs. I think it's useful because, in thinking up plots and stories, especially for more intricate ones, it's very easy to lose sight of a character's journey through the film. Keeping that focused will keep your story focused.
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There's another whole wide range of factors that are equally if not more important to a story than just a protagonist's role. The Antagonist, the subplots, the genre, originality, etc... each one of these elements will dictate what journey the protagonist will go through. That's why I take issue with these 'formulas', they only look at one side of the page...
Eric Boellner
Well-known member
Batutta
Major Contributor
That's fine, but I don't think Dan Harmon uses his method as an answer to everything. It's a starting point, a foundation, and I think a pretty solid one that can be referred to at any point in the writing process.
Ok here's the part I was referring to earlier:
"Lots of modern stories bounce us from character to character in the beginning until we finally settle in some comfortable shoes. The bouncing can be effective, but if it's going on for more than 25% of your total story, you're going to lose the audience. Like anything adhesive, our sense of identity weakens a little every time it's switched or tested. The longer it's been stuck on something, the more jarring it's going to be to yank it away and stick it on someone else"
"Lots of modern stories bounce us from character to character in the beginning until we finally settle in some comfortable shoes. The bouncing can be effective, but if it's going on for more than 25% of your total story, you're going to lose the audience. Like anything adhesive, our sense of identity weakens a little every time it's switched or tested. The longer it's been stuck on something, the more jarring it's going to be to yank it away and stick it on someone else"
Batutta
Major Contributor
I think he is talking about stories that are supposed to have a clear, central protagonist. But for ensemble films, or films with multiple, entwined storylines it is something to be conscious of at the very least. Excessive point of view shifts can lessen the emotional impact of your story, so they really need to be considered carefully. Going back to Pulp Ficiton, Tarantino doesn't bounce between his characters willy-nilly. He stays with one character, one story for a considerable stretch, then moves to the next for a stretch, then loops around and ties them back together.
It's the other way around. You need the protag to move or change, so you create the other roles to do it. The elements don't dictate the protag's journey - the protag's needs cause the writer to cause the elements to appear at certain times and act in certain ways.
A very suspect statement.
Eric Boellner
Well-known member
Oh dear. You're being ironic, aren't you.
Batutta
Major Contributor
I said "CAN"...You might be able to make it work, it's just a pitfall to that particular style of filmmaking...I speak not only as a writer but as an editor.
Saharanturtle
Active member
That's what I think too. For example, when watching community, this circle structure can be used to set up the character arc for the major plots (that usually involve Winger and Britta) and the subplots involving the rest of the cast's issue of the week. I'm willing to bet the circle is used on each member of the study group to set up his/her "life" in that weeks episode. That's why I think it would be a good thing to use in the beginning of major and minor plots, because it's based on the widely respected research and writing on mythology by Joseph Campbell, his research on the stories and myths that we read now thousands of years after they were written
I don't think this is really a "formula". Like someone else said, Harmon doesn't say that you must have this done by this page etc, he gives you the circle where you will work out the Protagonists life and struggles for that episode or film. You'll work out on the circle what he will fight for and what he will fight against, and in other circles you can work out the arcs of minor characters and what their part in the story is