D-R-A-M-A: Babel

c.g._eads said:
And maybe this is blasphemy, but this movie was ten times better than any of the long, poorly directed, uninteresting snore-fests that Altman made. Someone told me I should check out Altman's film library and I will always regret the time I wasted doing so. What boring films!
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you're not alone. i think he has more than a few duds in his filmography. in fact, having seen nearly every film he made, I'm really only an admirer of Short Cuts and The Player.

c.g., you might get a kick out of this...

The "Robert Altman Owes Us" Campaign
 
The only Altman movies I liked were M*A*S*H and The Player. That said, I was really disappointed with Babel just as I was with Crash.
 
Finally saw this film last week...

Let me preface by saying that I thought 21 Grams was great, and I immediately wanted to see it after hearing about it/seeing the trailer. It was definetly on my must see list (except I almost always seem to miss the movies I really want to see in theaters...)

I was dissapointed. It was alright, but I just really didn't get into it much. Let me say though, that I think after seeing Children of Men (my pick for best film of 06) the bar was set pretty high. Babel I thought was worth seeing, but it definetly didn't live up to whatever expectations I had for it. Well made, some decent acting from some, but I think I'll have to watch it one more time before I make a final decision on it.

At this point, however, just another overrated film in a year with many (Dreamgirls...).

I will say I definetly enjoyed the cinematography for sure. Also, to all the people out there comparing this to Crash, I'll admit as much as I thought this was overrated, I thought it was much better than Crash (even though it's a pretty dumb comparison).
 
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In addition to the Altman films already mentioned I'll add Gosford Park, McCabe & Mrs. Miller, and Vincent & Theo to the mix of Altmans worth seeing.
 
I didn't say I liked Altman or everything he did, but it doesn't change the fact that this film was poorly written, contrived crap.

I disliked Crash just as much as I disliked Short Cuts. Why is it that all these six-degrees lumps seem to come out of Los Angeles? I can tell you why - because I grew up in SoCal and have the answer. As I stated before, these are vanity exercises of the worst kind, where egos are stroked and the viewer's time is wasted with stories that go nowhere.

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I've never told anyone before, but... my great-grandmother was run over by a six-degrees-of-who-gives-a-crap delivery truck.

I've never been able to watch any of the "small world phenomenon" films - it's just too close to home.

I need a moment...

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overlandfilms said:
Why is it that all these six-degrees lumps seem to come out of Los Angeles? I can tell you why - because I grew up in SoCal and have the answer. As I stated before, these are vanity exercises of the worst kind, where egos are stroked and the viewer's time is wasted with stories that go nowhere.
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Amores Perros, Innaritu's first feature, was produced independently in Mexico. Many foreign films use this conceit. It's not an ego thing, it's an alternative storytelling method that has a limited audience. Innaritu's films are among the most imaginative coming out of Hollywood right now, but the multi-character design make it difficult for people to become emotionally invested in a protagonist, because they aren't given enough screen time. I'm hoping now that he's no longer working with Guillermo Arriaga he'll try his hand at a more traditional narrative style. We shall see.
 
I'm tending to agree pretty heavily with Overlandfilms...

Forgive me for reviving this thread a week later... but I just watched Babel and I only have one sticking point. I don't really get all the stuff with the Japanese school girl... yes she's the gun owner's daughter... but what was the point of all that storyline about her?

How was she connected to the rest of the movie in any meaningful way? I'm asking honest questions here... I felt about 99% frustrated and 1% satisfied at the end of this flick... maybe I just don't get it... but I'm trying to put the onion back together by starting at it's core... which I assume is Brad and Kate's middle-eastern vacation gone sour by a tour-by shooting... because the movie seemed to be like an onion as I watched it... growing layers and layers that were interconnected to form a whole... and then suddenly the movie ends and I felt like an audience cast member from The Illusionist as I saw the entire onion vanish into thin air along with the last 3 hours of my life.

I feel like if somebody can give me the significance of the Japanese school girl... aside from her being the guy's daughter... then I won't feel like I just watched a collage of (admittedly well-done) arthouse films... another way of putting it is that I felt like I just watched a pack of very capable runners all competing on treadmills.
 
Well, it's simpler than you think. The movie was about human beings' inability to communicate. I think the Japanese girl's storyline was the strongest example of that. I believe people are looking at the film the wrong way. They're trying to see how the people connect. I think it's more about how their experiences connect.
 
c.g._eads said:
Well, it's simpler than you think. The movie was about human beings' inability to communicate. I think the Japanese girl's storyline was the strongest example of that. I believe people are looking at the film the wrong way. They're trying to see how the people connect. I think it's more about how their experiences connect.
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Spoken like a true prodigy.
 
c.g._eads said:
Well, it's simpler than you think. The movie was about human beings' inability to communicate. I think the Japanese girl's storyline was the strongest example of that. I believe people are looking at the film the wrong way. They're trying to see how the people connect. I think it's more about how their experiences connect.
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Of course. I believe everyone agrees in that point. But the problem was that what we had was 6 short stories, or 5, or wathever. And while every single one of them could do a good film, the thing is it tries to do too much to put all of them together in one single film. While it works, in order to achieve that it had to be written in a very formulaic and forced matter. It just didn't look natural- it looked staged and forced for plot development.
 
Thank you for your replies... I felt really frustrated by the movie last night. I kept reminding myself... "oscar"... so that created a desire to see Brad and Cate as more then simply stars being used to hook an audience for a movie that really didn't have that much to do with their characters. Yes I get the connection points, but I really hoped for more then that. I wanted to find, what was for me, significance in each element of the story.

To have predominant images of Brad and Kate on the front and back of the dvd box feels like a shiny lure. I'm not especially a Brad fan, but if I watched Fight Club and there had been a couple quick bits with Brad and Edward Norton... and then the other 90% of the movie focused on the lives of a cast of relatively unknowns (in the US market anyway)... well I would have felt the same way... which is to say basically annoyed by the packaging of the movie... perhaps even in a litteral sense.

This isn't to take anything away from what is obviously very skilled acting, cinematography, etc... but I think this flick could have been 99.9% the same movie with other relative unknowns in Brad and Cate's roles... I guess it's my own initial perceptions that left me so frustrated with the ending. It did seem extremely "crashy" and I wish I'd have realized that before renting it.

c.g._eads... you are very well spoken and I appreciate your reply. That's an intelligent way of putting it. I just wanted to find something more then that... I understand your point and I saw that clearly in the movie, but here's the exact text off the back of the dvd box:

"A tragic accident in Morocco sets off a chain of events that will link four groups of people who, divided by cultural differences and vast distances, will discover a shared destiny that ultimately connects them."

Discover a shared destiny that ultimately connects them? What's the shared destiny? Communication problems?

I'd say that description (change a few words) would apply more to The Usual Suspects... where you get this "oh wow COOL!" feeling at the end... as the story wraps up and leaves you grinning with goosebumps (the first time you see it)... and as Babel played on I was getting more anxious to see this beautiful interconnection that would sew up all the pieces of fabric into a beautiful whole... but instead I just felt like we saw 4 bits of beautiful fabric all put on the same thread like a shish-ka-bob, where yes, it's all connected and each piece is a beautiful element... but I'm not feeling the skill in the tailor.
 
It's about more than just our inability to communicate whether we speak the same language or not. It's also about fatherhood - specifically absent fathers. Each character has father issues. That's how the Japanese girl ties in. Her relationship with her father.
 
good or bad, what is the purpose of judging a film agsinst the "marketing" material found on the front and back of the dvd cover?
 
I'm not judging the film based on the marketing material... I wanted psychological closure based on ideas about the movie that are put forth by the marketing... which the film didn't seem to address, in my initial perception. That's why I posted. If I give you a brownie that tastes like chicken it might still be enjoyable but you'll be confused by your expectations... please don't blame me for that. I viewed this from a standpoint of "oscar" and then I read the dvd jacket in blockbuster... and I expected something different.

I wanted to like this film, but couldn't figure out why I didn't... but Hairy just fixed it for me perfectly. Thanks Hairy Lime... I think I can go on with my life now... who would have thought I could get solace from somebody named "hairy lime"? Thanks for the peace of mind man. I needed that... I'm disappointed in myself for not putting that together since it should have been so obvious now that you said it.

Absent fathers which more or less results in children in crisis... simple enough. Thanks. :thumbsup:
 
Welcome, kind sir.

And here I thought "that was too short a reply for anyone to get meaning out of, but it's time for lunch so I'll post an expanded explanation later." Now I don't need to.
 
Yeah but when you think about it, 90% of movies out there are about absent fathers. :)

It's funny that you bring up the DVD synopsis because in almost all circumstances, the person who writes that blurb is completely independent from the production. Not even the director knows what's going to be written until he gets the box. That's what they get paid to do, come up with a synopsis that wraps up a movie perfectly, even if the movie itself doesn't wrap up perfectly.

I can understand your frustration. I used to want these movies to wrap up nicely as well. But now I kind of like their messiness. It keeps the movie less predictable.
 
ya i just watched this film.. i was highly disappointed with it. it could have been a lot better IMO. to me Brad Pitt's acting was the best part of this film. i can't put my finger on what it is, but i just didn't like the movie. honestly the only characters i cared about in this film were Blanchett and Pitt, and the kids. that's it. the other stuff with the japanese girl was awkward, and hard to watch, and the kids that shot at the bus, while an important part of the story, was over used. i coulda really enjoyed the film a lot more, just showing the kids getting the rifle, shooting the bus, then just the cops getting them. also take out the entire japanese girl storyline, and the film would have been a lot better.

ALL IMO of course
 
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