Clients Deleting Memory Cards

[Run&Gun]

First I'll say, it's not what you think. It wasn't a case of a client accidentally deleting the contents of a card while they were downloading them and the files being lost forever.

I was on a four camera shoot for a network about two weeks ago and we had a dedicated DIT/Data Wrangler. A "real" one, not just a PA with a laptop. About half-way through, he came by and collected cards from us to start DL'ing/ingesting everything and at the conclusion of the event we gave him our second cards so he could finish. After striking my gear, I collected my cards and went home. It was a late night so I didn't attempt to back the cards up(even though it wasn't necessary, it's just a habit I've gotten into) until a day later. When I connected one of the cards to my computer and attempted to spot check it, there was nothing on it. Checked the second card and it was the same. Also, the cards appeared on the desktop as "UNTITLED" instead of the usual "Untitled". Obviously the DIT/Data Wrangler wiped/removed the contents from the cards purposefully, BUT the process did something to the cards that my camera(F55) did not like. When I reinserted those particular cards back into my camera it threw a warning that they were unrecognized media or something to that effect and the slot/card indicators didn't recognize anything as being in the memory card slots. Somehow I was able to get the camera to start to format one of the cards, but it actually caused the camera to hang after several minutes of trying to format one of the cards. I actually had to pull the battery. After a couple of attempts, the cards finally formatted and all was well again.

But now I'm debating whether or not to say something to the client and how I tell them to not delete contents off of my cards in that manner anymore. I completely understand if they don't won't the contents of what was shot to leave their possession or control(I've been doing this for 22 years and I din't feel that in any way, shape or form was this that type of shoot or content), but let me format the card in the camera, don't just drag the files off the card and cause my camera to wig out when I put that card back in or put the card into a state that won't let it or makes it very difficult to format again.

 

[rob norton]

You could push to get the DIT to format the cards in your camera?

 

[Barry_Green]

I can't say what all cameras will do, but I can say that having a computer manipulate a memory card (deleting, formatting, whatever) can absolutely make a card unreadable and unusable in the camera. It wasn't necessarily always this way, but it is now.

So cards should always be formatted in the camera. If this guy didn't know that, or just didn't bother to tell you, well, that doesn't reflect too well on him. Rob's suggestion is a good one, if you trust the guy to touch your camera and there's time to do it. Otherwise you might just have to have a discussion with any future data wranglers about how cards are to be handled. I always write protect the cards coming out of the camera, which helps prevent some situations (like if they have a virus on their computer, or they're using a Mac which writes invisible files on every card it mounts.)

 

[Greg_E]

Is it worth trying to bill them for media in the future so that when you hand it over, it belongs to them?

I'd like to know more about what they did to the cards as I've never seen an issue where it was difficult to format in the camera (unless the card was really damaged). Even the "hidden" files left from a Mac have never caused me grief when formatting in camera. This would concern me about the integrity of the cards.

Only other thought was maybe the contacts got really dirty in the reader. But I would put several full record cycles on those cards before I tried to use them on another job.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

I can't say what all cameras will do, but I can say that having a computer manipulate a memory card (deleting, formatting, whatever) can absolutely make a card unreadable and unusable in the camera. It wasn't necessarily always this way, but it is now.

Both Lexar and Sandisk CFast cards recommend using a format and refresh utility program they provide for you to use on your computer. I do this regularly and THEN format again in-camera. It's helped avoid buffer issues.

Is it worth trying to bill them for media in the future so that when you hand it over, it belongs to them?

Yeah, just add a $10,000 line item to the invoice for memory cards. I've used that much memory on small shoots before. Let me do some fun math here...perhaps I average using six Cfast cards (at $650 per card) per shoot day I do, 130 shoot days per year, so 6 x 130 x 650, so just bill the clients $507,000 per year.

 

[rob norton]

Both Lexar and Sandisk CFast cards recommend using a format and refresh utility program they provide for you to use on your computer. I do this regularly and THEN format again in-camera. It's helped avoid buffer issues.




Yeah, just add a $10,000 line item to the invoice for memory cards. I've used that much memory on small shoots before. Let me do some fun math here...perhaps I average using six Cfast cards (at $650 per card) per shoot day I do, 130 shoot days per year, so 6 x 130 x 650, so just bill the clients $507,000 per year.

You're not billing those cards at cost are you? Surely you should be getting a producer fee for using your data and time to go to B&H and place the order, plus a collect from doorstep and unboxing fee..

 

[Run&Gun]

Is it worth trying to bill them for media in the future so that when you hand it over, it belongs to them?

I'd like to know more about what they did to the cards as I've never seen an issue where it was difficult to format in the camera (unless the card was really damaged). Even the "hidden" files left from a Mac have never caused me grief when formatting in camera. This would concern me about the integrity of the cards.

Only other thought was maybe the contacts got really dirty in the reader. But I would put several full record cycles on those cards before I tried to use them on another job.

Maybe an option if someone shoots on something like SD cards, but not really an option with more expensive and dedicated/proprietary media. Now if my cards had become completely unusable(unable to format), they would have been billed for them, for sure.

I think the cards themselves are just fine. I’ve shot on at least one of them twice since then.

On my personal MBP I actually have a program that removes the hidden Mac files off of media when it’s ejected, but yes, I’ve never seen the hidden files from just a simple DL cause issues. At least in my experience. I have seen them make a card’s contents “unreadable” when adding stuff from a computer, like scene or LUT files, but that’s a little different.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

You're not billing those cards at cost are you? Surely you should be getting a producer fee for using your data and time to go to B&H and place the order, plus a collect from doorstep and unboxing fee..

I'm not billing for cards at all because no client would ever want to pay those rates for cards. I've maybe had one or two clients I'd billed for cards back when I was using SD cards, I just recall one, and I charged them the same cost as the SD cards. They were paying me well and upcharging an inexpensive card isn't going to make much difference, but if it's a common thing then may as well up charge.

I do regularly mail out hard drives to clients, typically a $57 1 TB Seagate from Walmart which I charge the client $100 for. I've sometimes considered raising the cost to $150 or $200. I'm getting $43 to do a trip to Walmart, and sometimes I'll buy a few at a time (when I'm smart) so then less trips. I also give the client the option to mail me a drive and I'll mail it back to them if they want to save a little money. I used to mail my drives out and have them return them but after never getting one back I stopped doing that. It seemed to be a post office problem and I'm not going to follow up on a UPS insurance claim for $57.

 

[rob norton]

I'm not billing for cards at all because no client would ever want to pay those rates for cards. I've maybe had one or two clients I'd billed for cards back when I was using SD cards, I just recall one, and I charged them the same cost as the SD cards. They were paying me well and upcharging an inexpensive card isn't going to make much difference, but if it's a common thing then may as well up charge.

I do regularly mail out hard drives to clients, typically a $57 1 TB Seagate from Walmart which I charge the client $100 for. I've sometimes considered raising the cost to $150 or $200. I'm getting $43 to do a trip to Walmart, and sometimes I'll buy a few at a time (when I'm smart) so then less trips. I also give the client the option to mail me a drive and I'll mail it back to them if they want to save a little money. I used to mail my drives out and have them return them but after never getting one back I stopped doing that. It seemed to be a post office problem and I'm not going to follow up on a UPS insurance claim for $57.

I was only joking about adding even more to your scenario of half a million dollars.

It is interesting though when you break down certain tasks. Here there's a place to rent equipment about an hour away. It's really four hours - drive to pick it up, drive to shoot, return the gear, drive back home. It's one of the biggest reasons I started "collecting" equipment vs. spending a day driving to various places before a shoot.