Choosing a marketable genre

[Azmyth]

I've done nothing but horror since 2009, and while I love it. I feel like I may pigeon hole myself into being a "B horror guy" if I don't show what else I can do.

I've got a new script, that is more action/drama oriented, and I have a lot of interest in it. I'm trying to attach at least one name, and I have some producers helping me get funding (more than I'm used to having).

I want to make the film SAG as well. I did a search on IMDB for films "similar" to mine and I was really dissappointed to see that most of them were not even making the budget back. Movies like "Fighting", "Warrior", "Redbelt". None of them actually made a profit, and these are much bigger filmes.

My question is, did I choose the wrong genre to branch off into? It's one that I love, and I've had industry people say they love the plot, but I don't want to set myself up for failure. But, I don't want to start over with something else either...

what do I do? I know part of this business is taking risks, but is this a risk worth taking? What action/martial arts/dramas have been successful in recent years?

I can't think of many.

 

[thekreative]

Write about a guy that just makes horror and thinks he might be stuck but loves what he does. I love movies about making movies! You can't tell me you don't have a million little war stories.

 

[Kholi]

I know it's also about selling/maintaining, but do what you really like to do and you think you do well. If you're good at Horror, keep getting better at it. Nobody is going to judge you for being known as "the good horror guy", and that's the kind of work you'll get called for because you've got the experience doing it.

Or, what I'm trying to say is, it's not a bad thing to be good at one thing. You'll likely get the job over the guy that's okay at many things.

If you love the one you want to branch out into then do it! Maybe won't sell but it could still get you somewhere.

 

[EuropeanDistributor]

If you have a great script that you believe in, and you can get funding, then there is no need for you to worry about anything.
You can concentrate on delivering the best film possible, let the investors worry about the ROI.

Of course if you will invest your own money in it, then it's a different story, but that isn't adviseable anyway.

A more of a straightforward action/thriller is probably more marketable than an action/drama, but that doesn't mean there isn't a market for that too.

Have you talked to any distributors or sales agents yet? Granted, most of them won't be interested in just a script, they want to look at finished films, but you can still ask them if they would be interested in a film like this.

I'd say let the producers worry about getting investors, let the investors worry about the ROI, and you'll worry about the quality of the film.

What's the worst thing that could happen? You would get to direct a movie, doesn't sound too bad to me.

Okay, if it doesn't sell, really, nobody besides the investors will care, you could still go back to horror, or do whatever you want, you'd only have one more movie under your belt, that's not a bad thing.

 

[prexdealer]

I'd say let the producers worry about getting investors, let the investors worry about the ROI, and you'll worry about the quality of the film.

What's the worst thing that could happen? You would get to direct a movie, doesn't sound too bad to me.

Okay, if it doesn't sell, really, nobody besides the investors will care, you could still go back to horror, or do whatever you want, you'd only have one more movie under your belt, that's not a bad thing.

EuropeanDistributor, I have always appreciated your posts about the business. However, I just can't agree with the post above. First of all, if a director directs a financially unsuccessful film, other people will notice that when he tries to pitch another deal. And while I agree investors should be informed and invest what they can afford to lose, I think a responsible person would care if the movie does well. And that means sometimes making compromises that will make the film more marketable. Sorry, maybe your comment struck a nerve but if I were an investor and the attitude was the director didn't care if I got my money back, it would sort of bother me. I think that is why I would be really careful about which project I would invest in. The quality of the people matter since some projects can stuck in post for a while and I would be pretty bummed if the rats left after they took what they could from the investors.

 

[EuropeanDistributor]

EuropeanDistributor, I have always appreciated your posts about the business. However, I just can't agree with the post above. First of all, if a director directs a financially unsuccessful film, other people will notice that when he tries to pitch another deal. And while I agree investors should be informed and invest what they can afford to lose, I think a responsible person would care if the movie does well. And that means sometimes making compromises that will make the film more marketable. Sorry, maybe your comment struck a nerve but if I were an investor and the attitude was the director didn't care if I got my money back, it would sort of bother me. I think that is why I would be really careful about which project I would invest in. The quality of the people matter since some projects can stuck in post for a while and I would be pretty bummed if the rats left after they took what they could from the investors.

That is a good point, but I assumed that the film Azmyth is talking about would be primarily distributed on Blu-Ray, DVD, Video on Demand etc. and not in a wide theatrical release. If this is the case, then there is no way for anyone aside from the investors to know whether the film was financially succesfull or not.

I agree, compromises should always be made in order to make a film more marketable, but it's not like Azmyth is doing some experimental drama that would in no way be sellable. An Action/Drama in the vein of Warrior, or Fighting, granted, it's not as good as a straight up action, but if you can get some marketable names and you can keep the budget under a desireable level, then yes, it is possible that you can sell it and even make a profit.

That being said, the cold hard truth is, that 99% of all movies never make a profit.

Of course there is always the possibility of changing the script to make it more action oriented, or make it a teen movie, or a kids movie like Karate Kid, whatever makes it more marketable.

In my opinion, it is not the director's job to worry about if a film makes it money back or not, unless he is also the producer or an investor himself, his job is to make sure he delivers the film under the circumstances, and according to the wishes of the producers.

If you want to be a working director, then it would only be in your best interest to get experience as a director, in all sorts genres, it can only lead to more work in the future.

Let's say a producer is doing an action movie, he's looking for a director, someone who has experience working on action movies, Let's say Azmyth meets with him, if he has only directed horror before, then there is a chance the producer won't hire him as he doesn't know if he can direct action or not, but if Azmyth has directed an Action/drama before with a decent budget, some names and well directed action scenes, then there is a higher chance that the producer will hire him.

Whether the Action/Drama in question was financially succesfull or not is really besides the point, and chances are the producer wouldn't even know if it was or not, all he cares about is bringing in an experienced director who he knows can deliver him an action flick.
The name actors the producer hires, that is much more important to the marketability of the movie, the director in this case is just another crew member.

Go to the local video store (if there is one) and look at all of the movies on the shelves, how many of those movies have the name of the director on the case? The answer is not too many, unless that name is someone like Steven Spielberg or M. Night Shyamalan, movies get sold according to the stars they have, not the director, primarily.

Or take someone like Roel Reine, chances are if you are not in the industry or a fan of direct to video action movies, you wouldn't know his name, but the fact is, he gets work constantly directing the more higher budgeted direct to video action movies, most often sequels to bigger studio pictures, he gets hired because the producers know he is a decent director who can deliver action, probably under budget and on time.
Have all his movies been financially succesfull? Probably not, but that's not the reason he gets hired.

 

[prexdealer]

That is a good point, but I assumed that the film Azmyth is talking about would be primarily distributed on Blu-Ray, DVD, Video on Demand etc. and not in a wide theatrical release. If this is the case, then there is no way for anyone aside from the investors to know whether the film was financially succesfull or not.

I agree, compromises should always be made in order to make a film more marketable, but it's not like Azmyth is doing some experimental drama that would in no way be sellable. An Action/Drama in the vein of Warrior, or Fighting, granted, it's not as good as a straight up action, but if you can get some marketable names and you can keep the budget under a desireable level, then yes, it is possible that you can sell it and even make a profit.

That being said, the cold hard truth is, that 99% of all movies never make a profit.

Of course there is always the possibility of changing the script to make it more action oriented, or make it a teen movie, or a kids movie like Karate Kid, whatever makes it more marketable.

In my opinion, it is not the director's job to worry about if a film makes it money back or not, unless he is also the producer or an investor himself, his job is to make sure he delivers the film under the circumstances, and according to the wishes of the producers.

If you want to be a working director, then it would only be in your best interest to get experience as a director, in all sorts genres, it can only lead to more work in the future.

Let's say a producer is doing an action movie, he's looking for a director, someone who has experience working on action movies, Let's say Azmyth meets with him, if he has only directed horror before, then there is a chance the producer won't hire him as he doesn't know if he can direct action or not, but if Azmyth has directed an Action/drama before with a decent budget, some names and well directed action scenes, then there is a higher chance that the producer will hire him.

Whether the Action/Drama in question was financially succesfull or not is really besides the point, and chances are the producer wouldn't even know if it was or not, all he cares about is bringing in an experienced director who he knows can deliver him an action flick.
The name actors the producer hires, that is much more important to the marketability of the movie, the director in this case is just another crew member.

Go to the local video store (if there is one) and look at all of the movies on the shelves, how many of those movies have the name of the director on the case? The answer is not too many, unless that name is someone like Steven Spielberg or M. Night Shyamalan, movies get sold according to the stars they have, not the director, primarily.

Or take someone like Roel Reine, chances are if you are not in the industry or a fan of direct to video action movies, you wouldn't know his name, but the fact is, he gets work constantly directing the more higher budgeted direct to video action movies, most often sequels to bigger studio pictures, he gets hired because the producers know he is a decent director who can deliver action, probably under budget and on time.
Have all his movies been financially succesfull? Probably not, but that's not the reason he gets hired.

Fair points, but the part that threw me originally was (and maybe I totally misread it) that he should direct the best movie he can. Having had some limited experiences, not directing this at anyone on this board, there a tons of directors that have no f'n idea what they are doing, but think they got it all figured out. If he is just a mercenary for hire, then I am cool with it - but he would just take instructions from the dealmakers. The ones who are on the hook to the investors, etc. Yes, if Azmyth is cool with this approach, then yes build up the experience. I agree he should build it regardless if he gives two ***** about the investors. But as someone who has dabbled around the edges of this business, but who has invested in a lot of business ventures, an indifferent attitude to the investor would just bug the heck out of me. Yes, if Azmyth delivers what he is asked, on time, on budget and commercially viable product (per the instruction of the producers), I would have no issue.

LOL, I think it just hit a nerve thru my limited experiences. I think the part about the best he can do. I would say the best he can do with direction from the producers. A lot of directors think that what they are doing is magic, sometimes it is just a straight ABC paint by numbers genre film. Like I said struck a nerve - I have dealt with a moron of a director who thought he was going to win awards for a film he was directing. No regard for the investors. The producers should have been stronger and directed the director better, but live and learn.

 

[Gary Huff]

Having had some limited experiences, not directing this at anyone on this board, there a tons of directors that have no f'n idea what they are doing, but think they got it all figured out.

You shouldn't worry about your "limited" experience or what other directors are doing. You do the best job you can and stop worrying about other people.

 

[October Black]

Way to handle this debate with class....we need more of this around here. Bravo!

 

[simonpwood]

What action/martial arts/dramas have been successful in recent years?

I can't think of many.

'The Raid' springs to mind - a relatively low budget martial arts / police movie, that did well in the US and Europe despite being filmed in a foreign language. A good basic premise was its strong point, a limited location, but well thought out and choreographed with a couple of strong set pieces.