Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD: Microsoft speaks

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Barry_Green

Moderator
*very* interesting interview over on Tom's Hardware Guide about why Microsoft and Intel both decided to jump down off the fence and back HD-DVD instead of blu-ray...

http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050927_190208.html

In a nutshell, it says that the blu-ray group is making promises, and the HD-DVD group is making products. As far as MS and Intel were concerned, it's put-up-or-shut-up time, and blu-ray can't deliver: "But then as time went on, and we'd seen what's the reality of both formats today, and what were promises versus what's proven and what's real, that's when we decided to make the decision." They said that "Blu-ray failed the Intel/Microsoft test in six critical areas."

Another interesting part is where they say that HD-DVD actually LEADS in disc capacity! "Capacity, said Ribas, "used to be the biggest advantage of Blu-ray, and we believed it. We thought, they'll get 50 GByte BD-ROM discs working, but it's not happening, and it's nowhere in sight. There are not even pilots. It's only in the lab that they are building these discs." With regard to demonstrated capacity, he told us, HD DVD-ROM actually leads BD-ROM by a score of 30 GByte to 25 GByte"

It seems that strange things are afoot at the Circle K...
 
Very interesting to read about. Good find Barry!

It seems as if HD-DVD is going to be better than Blue Ray...but we still have to wait out to see what more things Blue Ray is going to reveal....was it only like..what...8 years ago...DVDs were created rite? ...its amazing how fast technology moves...especially in the electronics department for movies and music. Its crazy..i remember only a number of years ago when they only had VHS, and I would always buy the Disney movies on big clunky VHS tapes...now today kids have like Disney Ehanced DVDs with games and stuff on them..its crazy...

That quote...Bill and Ted's Most Excellent Adventure....LOL!


Bill: Ted, while I agree that, in time, our band will be most triumphant, the truth is, Wyld Stallyns will never be a super band until we have Eddie Van Halen on guitar.

Ted: Yes, Bill. But, I do not believe we will get Eddie Van Halen until we have a triumphant video.

Bill: Ted, it's pointless to have a triumphant video before we even have decent instruments.

Ted: Well, how can we have decent instruments when we don't really even know how to play?

Bill: That is why we NEED Eddie Van Halen.

Ted: And THAT is why we need a triumphant video.

Bill/Ted: Excellent.
 
None of this is surprising, when you look at the basics and simple hsitory. I went on record a while ago as saying HD-DVD would win out, regardless of whether or not it was the "superior" format.

Now that it looks like the 60GB Blu-Ray may be vaporware, I'm even more solidified in that position, 'coz without that capacity advantage, why would anyone go with Blu-Ray?
 
I just can't help thinking that HD-DVD and/or Blue Ray are too little too late. The capacity of the disks just isn't that much higher. I'm really hoping that the co-linear holographic technology makes a real breakthrough and portable TB storage becomes something we can take for granted.

The real bummer for me is the discussion of this "backward compatibility" thing - which ends up meaning while 30 GB HD-DVD's are possible, a single-layer HD-DVD will only have 15 GB for HD storage, and 5 GB for DVD storage. Then you'll end up with a heavily compressed DVD-5 feature, and a similarly compressed HD-DVD-15 feature. Gah!!

"All or nothing at all. Half of love never appealed to me."

-Spiff
 
"Too little too late" sounds good, but I still wonder if it's not "too little, too early"... I think that follow-up article stated it quite well -- people are thrilled with DVDs right now, and consumers don't seem to be clamoring to replace them anytime soon. There is indeed a threshhold of "good enough" -- it's amazing how good even standard-def DVDs look, when played back progressive-scan to a progressive-scan display...

I wouldn't be surprised if the whole HD-DVD/Blu-ray thing turned into a repeat of SACD/DVD-Audio, a format war where nobody cared... whereas the holographic thing looks to be a significant step forward, 200gb at over 1gbps, on a $1 sheet of film... that's a real step forward, not an incremental step forward.
 
Well, SACD/DVD-Audio was a format war over something that's actually pretty useless.

The only draw is that you'd have a "surround-sound" music experience, and that's only good in one spot in your room (which could be large or small, depending on your setup). So, if you want to take advantage of either, you have to stay put.

I don't think most people listen to music that way. There are some serious audiophiles who may, for whom the experience IS the music, and who knows, maybe someone does their yoga every morning in the middle of the sound field, but most people put music on as background, while they're doing something else -- or at the very least, they don't stay in one place while they listen. With simple stereo, that doesn't matter. I think the fundamentals of the idea were flawed to begin with, because it doesn't fit how people live.

But there's more to Blu-Ray/HD-DVD than just HD content -- storage capacity is the draw, and has usefulness well outside the mere display of video. It's more relevant than DVD-Audio or SACD; it cuts across many more categories.

How MUCH more relevant remains to be seen, of course.
 
I could care less which format wins the format war, I just wish there would be a clear and unanimous winner (like what happened with DVD and DIVX back in the day), and its never gonna happen now. more support on the HD DVD side now proves this even more.

XBOX 360 is coming soon so Microsoft had to name a format ASAP, but one thing people may forget is that the Playstation3 comes out in the summer and that's of course Sony (BluRay). It's just a freakin mess!

Plus all this talk about possibly having to plug your player into your phone line and discs becoming enabled/disabled is total bullshit. ugh!
 
the-lyons-den.com said:
Plus all this talk about possibly having to plug your player into your phone line and discs becoming enabled/disabled is total bullshit. ugh!
Click to expand...

Occasionally, though I'm as far from an alarmist as possible, I do see things like these and wonder if I should be learning Rollerball.

But let's not get into that! :thumbsup:
 
I was talking to my friend about this HDDVD BluRay debate last night. He strongly believes that BluRay will win out over HDDVDs. I actually agree with him.

Last spring break he attened SXSW in Austin and went to a convention where all the vendors were showing off their stuff. Well, Sony was there with a few BluRay disks, and what do you know, he said it was the clearest, coolest and best quality he had ever seen. The demo disks contained concert footage of Incubus. Not only did these disks allow you to change camera angles with the music being played constantly, but you could also program the different camera angles within your BluRay remote. So, in essence, you could watch the concert any way you wanted, without any pause or skip in music. He also said the menus would be able to access multiple camera angles for movies too. Something I think we would all love.
 
Purely politics. I mean come the hell ON!! Did you actually expect M$ to back Blu-ray? Let me break it down for you:

Blu-ray = SONY = PS3

Yeah...I'm sure M$ had to think real hard about that decision. :huh: Even though the current Xbox360 will only include a Dual Layer DVD-ROM, future iterations will likely include an HD-DVD ROM.

HD-DVD was the obvious choice. I could be overstating...but that's WHY I believe M$ went with HD-DVD. My 3.141592 cents!! I could give a *flip* less which formats "wins" cause' Toshiba and a few other companies have already announced dual-format players for 06'

~reservoir~
 
Oh, I think they gave pretty compelling reasons.

Besides, how would it hurt MS to use Blu-Ray in the Xbox 360, even if it's being used in the PS3? They're using the PowerPC chips when you'd think they'd go with Intel for "political" reasons. If it's better for their purposes, they'd be fools not to use it, and say want you want about about MS, they didn't get to be one of the largest companies in the world by being fools.
 
Jubal28 said:
and say want you want about about MS, they didn't get to be one of the largest companies in the world by being fools.
Click to expand...

You're right... they get there by stealing other companies' technology :)
 
Kai...I'll agree: O gets the [] :thumbsup:

06' is going to be a great F'ing year!!

Apple vs. M$ both on Intel Hardware
Xbox360 vs. PS3 vs. Nintendo Revolution
HD-DVD vs. Blu-ray
HVX200 vs. JVC, SONY, Canon's stuff


....and much, much, more!! I know we all just can't wait!!

~reservoir~
 
kai said:
You're right... they get there by stealing other companies' technology :)
Click to expand...

They are strong-arm bandits the likes of which haven't been seen in North America since the Robber Barons, and the Sherman Act suits should have busted them up.

However, the point remains -- if they back (or steal) a technology, it's because it's better for their needs.
 
That'd be funny if another company like Apple came out with their own DVD format...haha

HD-iDVD...import your favorite songs from itunes into the player so it backs up the music in a movie!!
 
well DVD Studio Pro 3 already lets you create "HD DVD's", but which can only be played on a computer...
 
Yeah...I *believe* they are .h264 encoded or something. Something like an HD-divx type of thing. It would be cool if future DVD players would have a playback feature for that. Nice HD video on a standard 4.7GB DVD+/- R

~reservoir~
 
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