Blackmagic Design Introduces 4K B4 Mount URSA Broadcast

You will old skoolers will probably all shout me down but those Sonys are monsters Id way prefer the mass savings of the bmc.

I'm currently lying on the sofa broken after a day of fs7 shoulder work .. Enogh for me thanks :)
 
This is a broadcast camera. So why would you expect to have MFT and speedbooster? This is specifically made to be used with those glorious 2/3" ENG lenses. Oh my, this camera is a beautiful thing. None of these idiotic rigs people come up with to make up a run and gun camera. This is the real thing. Slap a nice Fujinon 20x lens on this and you have a real run and gun camera.

If you start adding features of a cinema camera suddenly you have an expensive camera that defeats the very purpose of this camera. This thing is brilliant right the way it is.
 
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I wonder how much those 2/3 lenses can really resolve. They definitely won't give this sensor the justice 4K/6K stills lenses would in terms of resolution, but maybe for HD broadcast that's not the point.

Some people would definitely have used it as a cinema camera (even with that sensor) with small & fast MFT lenses for half the price of the UMP.

It's definitely going to offer some amazing quality and it even shoots RAW!
 
Just hook up a Fujinon UA22x8BERD for $46,000 and you have yourself a nice 4k ENG camera. :shocked:. So that's the conundrum. A $3500 camera needs a $xx,xxx lens to make it behave the way it should.

No question about it, cinema demands much better lenses than broadcast does and Fujinon acknowledges that. But they adapted their 4k cinema lenses to the broadcast market and claim they are now on par with cinema.
 
Paul F said:
This is a broadcast camera. So why would you expect to have MFT and speedbooster? This is specifically made to be used with those glorious 2/3" ENG lenses. Oh my, this camera is a beautiful thing. None of these idiotic rigs people come up with to make up a run and gun camera. This is the real thing. Slap a nice Fujinon 20x lens on this and you have a real run and gun camera.

If you start adding features of a cinema camera suddenly you have an expensive camera that defeats the very purpose of this camera. This thing is brilliant right the way it is.
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This camera is not strictly a B4 lens camera. It has an interchangeable lens mount.

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicursabroadcast/design
 
leteeci said:
And it is a matter of what you are shooting..if is narrative it is not problem for you to step closer..on broadcast, concerts and venues..you are filming from distance..and too much DOF is just too much to handle with focusing and aestetics are off
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I concur, but that said, what percentage of people in video production are shooting "narrative"? I venture to guess that it isn't over 5%. Maybe even as low as 1%.

By far the vast majority of video production performed is of a nature that warrants use of zoom lenses and for which use of primes is simply not practical. Use of primes is limiting for most work. Of those who do own a prime or primes, the prime lenses ( fixed focal length lenses ) serve mostly just for interviews and the bulk of the work is done on zooms.

Sorry if I am on a bit of a rant here, but I am slightly irked when it is suggested that shooting with primes and "zooming with your feet" is even close to being practical for anything but a very small sliver of video production that takes place.
 
Paul F said:
Just hook up a Fujinon UA22x8BERD for $46,000 and you have yourself a nice 4k ENG camera. :shocked:. So that's the conundrum. A $3500 camera needs a $xx,xxx lens to make it behave the way it should.

No question about it, cinema demands much better lenses than broadcast does and Fujinon acknowledges that. But they adapted their 4k cinema lenses to the broadcast market and claim they are now on par with cinema.
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That is the conundrum indeed. However, for someone looking for an HD broadcast ENG camera the BMagic presents a huge cost-saving over the Sony alternatives. Last year I purchased a used PMW-400 with VF for $10k, sans lens. I spent over twice the cost of the BMagic Broadcast for a used Sony. A new Sony HD Broadcast 2/3" camera runs around $16k. And in order for it to shoot 4K you have to pay $11k for a mechanical upgrade. The BMagic Broadcast is 4K-ready for only $3500. An Owner / Op like me could purchase the BMagic Broadcast and shoot HD with it, then, when a client demands 4K 2/3" rent a 4K 2/3" lens. Or simply default back to my Fs7. So if you ignore the 4K aspect of things and just consider the HD angle, the BMagic Broadcast is a helluva deal over the 2/3" HD broadcast cameras out there. Half the price of a high-mileage PDW-800. And it shoots ProRes. And if you have the client base you can get $1000 a day for it in rental. The thing pays for itself in 5 days of work. One good hurricane and the camera is paid off for a shooter doing TheWC.
 
As an old school shooter, this cam has a lot of appeal to me.
I recently worked with an FS7 fitted with a Canon 17-120 cine zoom and I realized how much I missed a good parfocal zoom. The image from that lens was beautiful. Too bad the price is north of $20K.
I do miss the shoulder mount design cams. They're very practical for any type of shooting. And the price of this cam is amazing. It's cheaper than a used FS7.

The various record codecs is befuddling to me. I don't know what DNx is, and all the flavors of ProRes. And can ProRes only be used with a CFast card?
And if you add an EF mount, how will a Canon APS-C or full frame lens work with a smaller sensor?
 
Dnx is some windows thing - I think.

Prores is data heavy so probably won't write to the small cards in 4K

Using a stills (ff) lens will give a big "crop factor" - wides will probably suck but an 80-200 will get you fantastic reach. Of course you have to be aware that these lenses may not be so sharp when using only 1/4 or less of the image circle.
 
All of the codecs write to the UHS-II cards. CFast is recommended for RAW; lossless, 3:1 and 4:1.

This sensor is pretty much the same size (a tiny bit bigger) as the pocket so an 80mm would be like a 230mm, ha. Wides will be difficult...most BM MFT users used a SB and the 18-35mm.

Now with the Canon and Nikon mount...more difficult. But a Sigma 14mm f/1.8 would probably look nice.
 
vanvideo said:
As an old school shooter, this cam has a lot of appeal to me.
I recently worked with an FS7 fitted with a Canon 17-120 cine zoom and I realized how much I missed a good parfocal zoom. The image from that lens was beautiful. Too bad the price is north of $20K.
I do miss the shoulder mount design cams. They're very practical for any type of shooting. And the price of this cam is amazing. It's cheaper than a used FS7.

The various record codecs is befuddling to me. I don't know what DNx is, and all the flavors of ProRes. And can ProRes only be used with a CFast card?
And if you add an EF mount, how will a Canon APS-C or full frame lens work with a smaller sensor?
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But we've been at $20K and higher for most of the modern life of high-end 2/3" lenses. If I had to replace my ENG lenses with brand new ones right now, each one would be over $30K.

DNx is an Avid codec. Hardly anyone(that I deal with) uses it(never been asked for it). If they don't want a cameras native codec, most people will ask for ProRes, for some God-awful reason(slight sarcasm).

This is a great tool for figuring out differences in the FoV of lenses on different sensors.
https://www.abelcine.com/fov/
 
Very skeptical about video quality at $8K or any Black Magic products. After the dismal Smart View monitor experience ( https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/smartview ), I seriously doubt that this to be released $8K cam can come close with established name brands from Ikegami, Panasonic, and Sony. Smart View monitor colors were way off. So bad that I thought the signal came from a $500 prosumer palmcorder instead of a $30K 2/3" ENG/EFP cam. This was brand new from B&H. Fortunately there is a 30-day return and I had no hesitation in returning after an embarrasing live video shoot. Fortunately I had Small HD 17" as a main program to save my reputation in front of various clients.

The math doesn't add up. This is simply too good to be true for Black Magic. They fooled me once but not not this time.

BM URSA 2/3" B4 perform in the harsh field is another story. Can it handle artic to desert weather w/ out any hitch? I trust the Varicam series for important assignments in harsh environment. Not so sure with Black Magic as they'll cut corners like they did w/ the Smart View and other products. Thanks but no thanks Black Magic. I rather pay more for quality product.
 
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lonewolf2koc@hotmail.com said:
Very skeptical about video quality at $8K or any Black Magic products. After the dismal Smart View monitor experience ( https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/smartview ), I seriously doubt that this to be released $8K cam can come close with established name brands from Ikegami, Panasonic, and Sony. Smart View monitor colors were way off. So bad that I thought the signal came from a $500 prosumer palmcorder instead of a $30K 2/3" ENG/EFP cam. This was brand new from B&H. Fortunately there is a 30-day return and I had no hesitation in returning after an embarrasing live video shoot. Fortunately I had Small HD 17" as a main program to save my reputation in front of various clients.

The math doesn't add up. This is simply too good to be true for Black Magic. They fooled me once but not not this time.

BM URSA 2/3" B4 perform in the harsh field is another story. Can it handle artic to desert weather w/ out any hitch? I trust the Varicam series for important assignments in harsh environment. Not so sure with Black Magic as they'll cut corners like they did w/ the Smart View and other products. Thanks but no thanks Black Magic. I rather pay more for quality product.
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I never thought the Smartviews were made for accurate color rendition, only to show signals, waveforms, histograms, etc... At work we only use them in the server room to check images when doing patching (have about 4 different BMD routers combining around 200 input/outputs). On their homepage I don't see anything about the screens own color rendition or accuracy (which is usually the case if they are intended for that). In the OB-trucks they are only for checking signals, whereas Flanders Scientific or Sony's pro-color calibrated monitors are used for the actual "color rendition check". Anyways, I never thought of BMD's Smartviews as screens for anything other than "checking signals", I mean, they are cheap cheap, no info on gamut coverage, 8-bit, etc... I might be wrong in what "the purpose of Smartview" is but to me the fault seems more that you don't understand what you are actually buying rather than the product being bad.

As far as I'm concerned BMD makes great bang for the buck equipment, and camera wise they have had great color quality for the price. However, of course Sony and the rest will be better, but they tend to cost twice as much for nearly the same features. Also, by saying "bang for the buck" I am inferring that others will have better stuff, but usually not at the same price point.
 
I recalled URSA B4 was advertised back in 2014 with their 1st URSA PL & EF as "Coming Soon". A year later it quietly disappeared from their web site. 4 years later today it's announced again. Is it really ready or just another vaporware? I can only imagine the enormous complexity involved with 2/3" sensor. The low price point makes it even more challenging to mass produce. Hope this is not a repeat of the AJA Cion.
 
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lonewolf2koc@hotmail.com said:
I recalled URSA B4 was advertised back in 2014 with their 1st URSA PL & EF as "Coming Soon". A year later it quietly disappeared from their web site. 4 years later today it's announced again. Is it really ready or just another vaporware? I can only imagine the enormous complexity involved with 2/3" sensor. The low price point makes it even more challenging to mass produce. Hope this is not a repeat of the AJA Cion.
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I believe it's a single sensor(s35 or m4/3?) and an adapter with the optics to enlarge the native image circle of the 2/3" lens to cover the Ursa's sensor. And I would be willing to bet almost anything that the camera will not stand up to field use/abuse like a Sony, Panasonic or Ike ENG camera. Or be as easy to use. All it takes is one glance at the Ursa to know that no one who has ever shot in the field had one thing to do with their design.
 
The camera's shipping already...and it's a 2/3" sensor:

From BM: "2/3 inch sensor size when using 4K B4 mount (Actual sensor size 13.056mm x 7.344mm)"

Problems may exist, but the image quality will be amazing per usual with BM cameras.
 
Terry Nixon said:
We're working on getting the pre-order links below live below.

No word on ETAs yet.

Blackmagic URSA Broadcast Camera CINEURSAMWC4k $3495

Blackmagic URSA Broadcast Camera Fiber Converter CINEURSANWFRCAM $2995

Blackmagic Studio Fiber Converter CINEURSANWFRSTUD $2995

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I was hoping for their sake that what they did with the Mini Pro, i.e. have it basically shipping as soon as it was announced, was to become the norm with them, hopefully that will be the case with this one and not back to the old ways of months and months of waiting?
Steve
 
Run&Gun said:
I believe it's a single sensor(s35 or m4/3?) and an adapter with the optics to enlarge the native image circle of the 2/3" lens to cover the Ursa's sensor.
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I'm pretty sure the optics are not so much to enlarge the image circle as to correct for the lens being designed to go through a prism on a 3-chip cameras.
Steve
 
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