Best C-stands? Flag kits?

N

naveenmedia

Active member
Any recommendations for C-stands? Should I just go with Matthews?

Also, any recommends on a basic flag kit for use with an Arri Softbank IV?

Thanks,
Naveen
 
Personally I prefer the Norms C-stands to Matthews because they have stiffer bases than the Matthews spring loaded ones. Norms also makes pretty decent flags, they have them in kits at www.cinemagadgets.com at a great price. Hope this helps.
 
Even though I own mostly Norms gear, I would rate www.americangrip.com as slightly better build. On the C-stands, American has the best grip head knuckles, even better shape than Norms. And neither the Norms or American have those stupid Matthews spring loaded legs. I hate those.

You won't go wrong with either. OTOH, someone just posted in a another thread that Norms will give you a 25% discount if you pay right when you order. If so, you can't go wrong with Norms. You have to call them in North Hollywood, they are a non-internet company.

Matthews? Eh...really average. Not terrible, not great, just okay.
 
You know, I might be in the minority here, but I just bought a set of Matthews Road Rags to go with my Softbank IV kit, and I think they're pretty great.

My logic was that I don't have a big truck to carry that wooden case filled with flags and nets, and I was worried about tearing the nets, or also just generally unhappy with the awkwardness of transporting them. So instead I bought the collapsable Road Rags kit and stuffed them in my softbank case in that little compartment.

I don't really need a ton of flags and nets right now but it's great to always have them available!
 
Different strokes I guess... I don't know how old they were, but I used a mix of C-stands on a gig not too long ago and the norms stands were not my favorite... maybe they were older then they looked.

I haven't bought this brand yet, but the newest generation of the Avenger C-stands looks like a good call for the $$$... The biggest complaint with the older Avenger stands was that they were heavy... and they got the weight down on the newer versions so that now they are pretty close to the same weight as American's stands.

For a while people on here were really hot for Amvona C-stands... but if you thought the old Avenger C-stands were heavy then you better start working out if you get the Amvona stands... Industry people were calling Avengers heavy because of a couple pounds and the Amvona stands are several pounds heavier then even the old Avengers.

Over a year ago you could get the Amvona stands on Ebay for cheap... but then people really started talking them up on the forums and suddenly they were selling for the same price as the regular top brands! People lost sight of the fact that what made them appealing in the first place is that they cost less then HALF what a normal stand would cost... and because this major point was overlooked and rarely mentioned... people were paying way too much for them. If this insanity settled down and you can get a bargain price again... then I say they are worth considering although they are very very heavy compared to the new Avengers, Matthews, or American stands.

If you literally want the best then my vote is for American Grip... aka American. Why? Because they seem to be super-tough and beefy while still being the lightest weight... but they aren't cheap. The other thing I like about the American stands are the leg junctions to the stand... very slick with no clamps or anything... just smooth welds.

My next purchase will be a couple of the Avengers... to me they look to be a good value for the money. Especially the black c-stand with turtle base and knuckle/arm combo... For a while there a company was selling those at a great price on Ebay (it was either Barndoor Lighting or maybe Full Compass)... but as I recall B&H has always had decent prices on this particular setup also.

Normal C-stands have spring loaded legs that splay out... and all legs are fixed at the bottom.

Next is a rocky mountain or sliding leg stand... that has one leg that can slide up the center pole and lock at different positions and heights... this is handy for putting a c-stand on steps or sliding the leg way up and using one leg on top of a table or something. At least one stand in your kit should be this type.

Next is the turtle base... this means that the center pole assembly is totally removable and you have just the "turtle" at the bottom... this is handy for all the times that you want to use a stand to properly support something very very low to the ground. Of course don't forget that you can use the knuckle/arm pointed at a low angle and put a light at the end to get down NEAR the same height... but you won't get as low... and you may not want the stand in the shot... which makes a turtle base nice because you can hide it behind anything. I would suggest you get a turtle base stand if you can... you will also need the spud adapter so that the base will accept lights/accessories just like the top spud.

Next is a gary coleman... or shortie, or whatever you want to call it... this is a c-stand with a short center column... instead of the normal 60" center it's short... they make 20" and 40" center risers. I wouldn't put one of these too high on the list initially... but I'm a big fan of short c-stands as part of an already complete kit.

If you're sticking with the same brand I'd get at least 2 of the same height... and possibly three and maximize your functionality within that. I'd try to get at least one turtle base and one sliding leg... then after that you can decide what you want. Personally I don't have any "plain" c-stands.

Just my .02
 
I'm a Matthew's guy myself. Here in Toronto I haven't seen American or Norms so I can't compare. Rental houses here tend to use Matthews stands and Avenger arms and heads - probably due to the weight factor of older Avengers.

The older style Matthew's heads are terrible but all the new stuff I find really sturdy and it just has a really good grip as it tightens. I own 4x 40" sliding legs and 1x 40" Turtle base plus 2x additional 20" arms and heads. Good idea to get black stands as I used to spend a fair amount of time black taping stands on-set because of reflections.

Has anyone tried the Modern Studio C-stands?
 
The Road Rags are a unique product. I have used them, they are okay. I have a 24" x 36" wooden flag box. Yep, it's a PITA to transport since I don't have a grip truck. It fits into my pickup, but just barely.

I agree Matt, the Amvona stands are ridiculous. They are not very high quality build. If they were really cheap, I guess they could be a viable alternative for a newbie but they aren't cheap, they are clunky and all of the castings are rough and crude. They remind me of Russian gear. It's not all bad but generally Russian gear is kind of big, heavy and crude.

I have a dozen Norms C-Stands and three Americans, the Americans are superior. Same with light stands, I have Norms, Matthews and American, once again, the Americans are built better, look better after a decade of abuse. I had American re-cover several flags a few months ago, they are good guys too, went there in person.

Avengers? I have seen them used by several still photogs. I think they made or make an all or mostly aluminum C-stand that has a turtle base, good for travel but overall, I have never seen an avenger C-stand on a Hollywood set.

If that other post detailing the Norms deal is true, then Norms is a great deal. 25% off!

Dan
 
Wow, a lot of good info to digest! Thanks guys! I've been on plenty of medium-budget commercial sets but never really paid attention to the brand of C-stand being used...the "minor" stuff that becomes important when its time to invest in your own equipment.

I'll check out the American and Norms. If that Norms deal is real, then I'll have to go with that.

I'll have to do more research on the flags. Transportation is a big issue.

Thanks again for all the info!
 
I've been really happy with my Matthews with the Rocky Mountain leg. I'll most likely add a couple more of them to my kit as time goes on. It's easily the best stand I own.
 
I've got a bunch of Avenger stands. No complaints, they're good stuff.

I've never seen 'em on a hollywood set either, but I think just about every grip & gaffer I've hired who's worked with my gear has said "whoa, these are nice stands..."
 
I'm not that concerned with necessarily sticking to the Hollywood standard. A lot of that may have to do with tradition and what the establishment is used to using (think Avid...though I'm not trying to open up that can of worms).

Functionality for interviews, commercials, and short-films is the issue for me. And of course, durability.
 
I've seen plenty of Avengers on Hollywood shows. That said, I loathe sprung legs. Loathe. I only weigh a buck-seventy-five (wet, no shoes), so the tight springs alway mean I get dirty because I have to use my stomach or legs to leverage the lumps open.

Gentlemen filmmakers do not motor about after dark and should not get filthy forcing open a tightly-wound c-stand. It's simply not civilised.

Rocky-Mountain legs are very handy and a good door-mounted rack for storage will alleviate the need for removable turtles.

e
 
I agree about the spring legs and have had the same experience with them. Rocky-Mountain, hmmm...more to factor in to my purchase...
 
I've never understood the Matthews bashing either Horse... the Matthews C-stands that I've seen in the last year have all looked pretty nice to me. Nice, fat locking knobs on the risers too... which I couldn't mention w/o saying that the Avenger C-stands have beautifully fat locking knobs also... and for not too much more Avenger makes some rubber thingies that fit over those knobs to transform them into flat-out luxurious... which is why my next C-stand order will be two black Avengers with turtle bases.

Not that this means anything... but on the Discovery Channel show MythBusters I always noticed that they're using Matthews.

As far as the American stands go, which I own, I absolutely LOVE the locking knob on the knuckles, but I would put the knobs on the risers behind both Matthews and Avenger.
 
Hi guys:

Just so we're clear, I am not Matthews bashing, they are fine. I have a client who has a ton of them and use thm weekly. But to me, their stuff has those damn spring loaded legs which make them average to me. I learned how to grip on the set of "Unsolved Mysteries" (boy, how's that for showing my age?) and we had all Norms and American, I learned how to manipulate the non-spring loaded legs like a switchblade. I can open and close my stands in about 2 seconds versus about 10-12 seconds for a Matthews with the spring loaded legs. Doesn't sound like much, but when you are lighting a set by yourself, as I often am these days for interviews and tabletop, these little things matter.

That's what these boards are for, so we can all express our opinions! ;-)

Dan
 
What he says about opening the Norms stands is gospel. It's like a little indian-burn move - once you learn the twist trick, they're open and ready to go in less than three.

It takes me about that long to start getting frustrated about the sprung model.

e
 
Ditto here on the Avenger. Doug Jensen (Vortex Media) recommended them and I agree - the favorite C Stand in my kit.

Regards, Michael
 
HorseFilms, which Matthews stand do you have? As far as I can tell, they all have spring-loaded legs...or am I not understanding what "spring-loaded" means?
 
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