Background Hiss on zoom without microphone

K

Klazart

Member
Hey guys,

I've read in the past that you can get some background hiss with certain microphones/ configurations with the zoom H4N. We did some audio testing yesterday and we were getting this constant hiss in the background with the zoom. We have a pretty average mic so we thought that perhaps that was the problem.

The hiss seemed to be a little less when we reduced the level and had the mic on normal mode rather than 'tele' mode.

But then we unplugged the mic and did a test with just the zoom on its own using the inbuilt mics, we even put a windshield on it and sure enough there was the hiss back again.

Has anyone encountered something similar in the past? I have a feeling that either I have a defective H4N or that I'm doing something wrong with the settings, though this is a brand new, out of the box item.

Thanks!
 
what was the record level at? Too high....and that's the preamps you hear. Zoom (and other other low budget recorders) are infamous for this.
 
I think it was too high. Ironically, the on camera mic on the GH2 sounded pristine in comparison. I'm going to test with lower levels because the mic was catching the dialog no problem from 5 feet away. If it was the preamps then the solution is to keep the level lower in recording, I'm guessing?

We tested it at 100 and then 87 which, according to the guy who's with me, is the level it needs to be recorded at and that if you go at a lower level you're getting diminishing returns. And that that level would have to be increased in post anyway which will give the hiss again.

Am I wrong in thinking, that if the dialog is perfectly audible at a lower level then we should just be able to use that if there is no associated or minimal hiss? My colleague says that even if we can hear the audio fine with our earphones on the laptop and on the recorder at the lower level it would still have to be increased for projection in a cinema or it wouldn't work, and that we should just record at 87 and do what we can about the hiss in post.
 
I NEVER use the onboard Levels on my H4N unless I'm just recording with the On-board mics.
Though the pre-amps are good the noise filters in this recorder are not.
I always control levels via mixer such as the JuicedLink Riggy, Azden DSLR or recently BeachTec DSLR Pro.
So I turn the levels on my recorder down completely and control levels via my mixer.
 
Klazart said:
I understand. But say I do not have a pre-amp or access to a preamp, what's the best option?
Click to expand...
If anything recording at a lower level will ultimately make things worse, not better. Your colleague is correct - low original dialog levels will just have to be raised in post and that will also raise the level of background hiss recorded along with it. PLUS any other noise in the system will also be raised as well. You have to work on controlling the RATIO of desired sound to hiss, not the absolute levels of hiss+sound.

You comment about the mic's "mode" setting, normal versus tele, affecting the hiss is setting off some warning bells. First of all, mics that have those switchable modes are usually cheap consumer gadgets rather than quality mics intended for serious recording - so called "tele mics" really only exist in the minds of marketing types. It may be that the mic is adding its own noise to that of the Zoom's preamps. If you were trying to use it in "tele" mode I'll bet that you were trying to use it too far from the subject. Proper mic placement for dialog recording puts a shotgun mic about 18-20 inches from the subject and other mic types need to be even closer. The preamp hiss will be constant at any given gain setting and is dependent on the gain setting. The level of the voice picked up by the mic, on the other hand, will get lower as you move the mic away and higher as you come in closer to the subject. If you position the mic too far away the level of the voice hitting the mic will be low and you'll have to boost the recording gain to compensate, boosting the hiss at the same time. Conversely, moving the mic in close allows you to lower the recording gain, lowering the amount of hiss relative to the voice in the process.

Use a good quality mic - it doesn't have to be super expensive - preferably teamed up with a proper mixer with decent preamps. If you don't have access to one, get access. A craftsman needs to have the proper tools.
 
Every single handheld recorder I've used (and I've used a bunch of them) has a very high noise level, both on the mic pre's and the built in microphones.
 
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