audio quality of sony pcm-m10 audio recorder

M

mhh

Active member
I bought a Sony PCM-M10 audio recorder to use with my Canon 550D (T2i). This was based on very positive reviews and sound samples I heard on the net. I bought it instead of the Zoom H4n because I have a beachtek DXA-6 and therefore didn't require xlr. The sound samples I heard also sounded cleaner than the Zoom H4n.

I have connected a Rode NT3 to the Sony PCM-M10 using both a simple xlr to mini jack adaptor as well as the Beachtek. I also did the same but connected to my Canon HV20 camcorder. Both setups used the exact same source and distance from the mic to the source (a track playing off my laptop). I then imported into Sony Vegas and made sure the sound level from the track was the same from the PCM-M10 and the Canon HV20.

I was hoping to see that the noise floor level of the Sony PCM-M10 was considerably lower than the Canon HV20. I mean aren't camcorder preamps supposed to be poor whereas the Sony PCM-M10 is supposed to be good. Well, there was absolutley no difference in the noise floor level between the two, to my ears, when listening to the room tone.

Is this expected? because if it is, I might as well have just used my Canon HV20 to record audio. Would I see much improvement if I used a juicedlink. I hear the preamps are good but then I also read that about the PCM-M10.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I'm confused and disappointed.
 
If you turn off AGC on your camera, and use a juicedLink, you will get decent audio, and it will be attached to the video!

I would not recommend putting the Beachtek in front of the Sony. You'll most likely be adding noise. Beachteks are mic level devices that don't add gain. Adding gain would increase your signal to noise ratio, resulting in cleaner audio. I believe the JuicedLink stuff actually adds gain.

The benifet of using a recorder is that you can record in 24 bit.
 
Thank you for the reply.

I've done some more tests comparing the audio quality of the Sony PCM-M10 and the Canon HV20 with a Rode NT3 connected. The results again showed that there is hardy any difference in the noise floor to my ear. This was confirmed in a rough and ready exercise where I calculated a s/n ratio by comparing the volume of the same peak to the noise floor volume, for each set up, using the mixer in Sony Vegas. The ratios were almost identical. The audio quality is also very similar.

The audio quality from the built in mic on the Sony PCM-M10 far surpasses the Canon HV20's and because it's 24 bit I suppose it will hold up better to editing. However, I bought the Sony PCM-M10 to record dialogue with an external mic and the fact that the quality seems almost identical to that recorded with the Canon Hv20 camcorder is both disappointing and shocking.

I don't know enough about audio to understand why this is the case or whether it should be expected. Maybe one of the sound experts could offer some guidance. I sure would appreciate it. I'd also welcome advice on how to improve matters with the Sony. Would a Juicedlink help?
 
I must mention that the audio on HDV cameras is not a nice uncompressed wav type file. HDV audio is the equivalent of a 320kbps mp3 file. This may not be so important for dialogue, but I personally avoided HDV all together due to the reduced quality audio.

I'm not sure if a juicedLink would help your Sony. It would help you get XLR to 1/8" mini to go into the Sony. Does the sony have a "Line" level input? Either a dedicated input, or a switch?

The thing is that once you buy a mixer just to get XLR cables into your recorder, you may as well get a better recorder like the Edirol R-44 (4 tracks) or the Fostex DR-880 (8 tracks). Both under 1,000.00. But you already have your recorder. So perhaps a juicedLink may help and not break the bank. JuicedLink does not have a limiter, so you must be careful. If your sony had a Line level in, I would suggest a SoundDevices MixPre - a fabulous little mixer. But it only sends out a line level. HOWEVER you could get an inline attenuator (1/8" cable that cuts the signal by -20db). The cable will also work on your T2i if you had a line level mixer going in.

http://www.core-sound.com/attenuator-cables.html

Anyway Line level is good because it's a hotter signal, and allows you to turn your recording levels/preamp down, effectively turning down the noise too. The JuicedLinks are switchable between line/mic I believe. There is also a JuicedLink that defeats the T2i AGC, leaving you with one recordable channel. Still not as good as using the Sony, but may come in handy sometimes.

http://www.juicedlink.com/index_files/CX_camcorder_XLR_microphone_adapter_audio_mixers.htm


There are just lots of options, depending on your budget.
 
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