4x3 or 16x9

Draccan said:
I guess you could put it on letterbox and mark off the black.. should be pretty much the same... :)
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yea, i thougtht of that right after i posted, but then you cant read the timecode because it gets covered by the tape... so what else could use use to mask off the lcd? or do you guys mask off the lcd at all or leave it as it is then guess where a 16x9 mask would be and adjust it in post...?


and, doesnt shooting in squeeze mode take away from the quality of the image since it's trying to squeeze all the information of a 16x9 frame onto a 4x3 ccd?
 
It all depends on how you envision the end product. The feel you want to create and also If you know how to frame a shot. Personally right when I got the camera I would flip the cropped bars on just because it instantly had a more cinematic feel. Also I was comfortable with my framing and there was no need to adjust in post. Right now It just depends on how I want the image to look. I like how 4x3 looks like a lot of earlier films through out the 60's filmed with 16mm. You do it right and people will get by the fact its 4x3 instantly. You can also use it as a save haven for frame adjusting if you decide to do it in post.
 
The answer is simple and is mentioned in Barry's DVX book. Use the anamorphic adapter and DV Rack. Sure it is a lot of expense but it gives great results. You can use the fully calibrated feild monitor with a 1.77:1 Pixel aspect ratio to view the stretch or Ana-Lens output correctly. Personally I think that the days of 4:3 are going away. If you shoot ana-lens, you are good on HDTV as well as SDTV.

Anyone that is really thinking that they are going to do a film out is overly optimistic and deluded. Shoot for TV, and if so shoot to put it on 16:9. Get the Ana-Lens (with everyone buying HVX's, and prematurely at that, the you should be able to get one cheap), shoot 16:9, use DV Rack and all of it's wonderful features and you will be happy as all get out.

I just shot a music vid with this set up and it is fantastic. Oh yeah get your framing right when you shoot. Anything that has to be done in post is usually not doe as well. Get the image as perfect as possible BEFORE post, then you don't have to make all those Janky corrections.
 
So if you shoot in 4:3 and crop it in post to 16:9 can you still make an anamorphic DVD (i.e. plays fine on 16:9 TVs and then adds black bars when playing on a 4:3 television)? Or is it that since you shot 4:3 and cropped, you will always have the black bars?
 
i think if you set the dvd to letterboxed 16x9 settings, in the authoring program it will play fine on 16x9 screens and then letterbox it on the 4x3 screens.
 
With DV rack the feild monitor is one of the many useful "modules" that are part of the DV Rack suite. The 'monior' becomes your laptop.

Check out the details here

HTTP://www.seriousmagic.com

While I am not 100% about this, I think that if you shoot 4x3 cropped adn then tell the NLE that it is a 16:9 display it will probably look like carp. But I've always believed that the best way is very seldom the easy way.
 
crazycatz said:
yea, i thougtht of that right after i posted, but then you cant read the timecode because it gets covered by the tape... so what else could use use to mask off the lcd? or do you guys mask off the lcd at all or leave it as it is then guess where a 16x9 mask would be and adjust it in post...?


and, doesnt shooting in squeeze mode take away from the quality of the image since it's trying to squeeze all the information of a 16x9 frame onto a 4x3 ccd?
Click to expand...


You can use sctch tape and be able to see right through it. So you wont cover any information on the lcd.
 
Draccan said:
Is this true of anamorphic adapter footage also then? Will it show as easily on the 16:9 tv or will it appear cropped ?
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I am very interested in getting an ana. adapter. My main goal is being able to make my finished products anamorphic. I just bumped this question because I hope to get an answer.

Also, another question. when i have the anamorphic adapter attached to a camera, will it show squeezed on the LCD or Viewfinder. it shouldnt right? Because its just a "horizontal wide angle lense".

I also would like to second the "can i creat an anamorphic DVD with a letterboxed (or matted in post) product.
 
I hate to be the voice of opposition here, and I've still got a lot to learn, but I don't understand why anyone would shoot 4x3 if they want the end result to be 16:9 anamorphic.

Shooting 4x3, letterboxing (whether in post or in-camera) and then stretching up to 16x9 anamorphic loses quality... unless there is something I'm missing. I've seen it done with compressor, and tried it myself several different ways (and different programs)... and in every single case, there was enough quality loss for it to be noticable.

I do NOT know how that stretching in post compares to shooting stretched mode in camera -- it's something I plan to try out and compare myself... but I cannot imagine the camera does a worse job. I realize there may be some argument about that... and I've read several articles in favor of both methods.

But I know what I see when stretching 4x3 video in post. Even a friend of a friend at a video production company cringed at the thought of stretching the footage up.

Is there information I'm missing here? Please do shed some light...
 
EditPhish said:
Is there information I'm missing here? Please do shed some light...
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There really isnt any stretching in Post. The process is just to add the matte (black bars) on the top and bottom. one could shift the image vertically if they wanted to in post to fine tune their framing. stretching the image wouldnt be necessary. when you do the initial shoot, you would have guides on your monitor or LCD where the black bars will be later placed. I aggree, stretching video makes me cry at night, but for this process it isnt needed.
 
Rubo...

Follow me for a sec here...

If you are shooting 4x3 and then letterboxing (and that's all), then fine. But if you want to get it to 16x9 anamorphic, your video has to fill the screen at 720x480 anamorphic. Letterbox doesn't do that - the picture-area is 720x372. So if you want it to be anamorphic, how are you filling in the black area of a 16:9 project without stretching up (whether you do it yourself or your compression program does it)?

There HAS to be a downside, otherwise there'd be no reason to go out and buy the anamorphic lens. I have yet to see someone show me that there is no quality loss... that doesn't mean I'm right, I just want someone to explain to me how you are not degrading the quality by shooting 4x3 letterbox and then resizing it to work at 16:9 anamorphic.
 
oh jeezus! I understand! okay okay. let me lay it down. As I once was, there are probably other people that need it simply put.

HERE ARE THE THREE WAYS TO CREATE AN ANAMORPHIC PRODUCT (and their main draw backs):

1)Shoot with squeeze mode on the camera
-There is loss of resolution

2)Shoot with the anamorphic adaptor
-its 700 bucks

3)shoot letter box (whether on camera or created in post), then stretch out picture
-Monster loss of resolution
 
Wow what a thread,

If one just wanted letterbox effect and wanted to frame the shot explained great.

I have a question though, How does one explain to a client why shooting in16:9 loses Quality?

I tried explaining that it squeezes the shot down to look like it was shot with a film camera and because 4:3 has higher resolution you lose color.

I tried explaining that the effect he is looking for is possible using the methods mentioned above and he still wants to shoot 16:9.

Any suggestions?
 
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